944 Bilstein rear shocks -- one downside
#1
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All in all, I've been very happy with the Bilstein cup shocks on my car. They fit well, require little maintenance, are good value for the money, and they work well.
However, I have one gripe: why the rubber bushings on the rear?!
I just took my 4 year old shocks off the car to inspect them, and was surprised to see the extent of the deformation of these bushings (I believe cold flow may be the term). True, I run a coil over spring on them, so they're taking more load than a torsion bar setup... But, when they come threaded for adjustible spring collars... doesn't that imply that coil overs should be used?
Maybe I can get creative and put heim joint ends on them... The projects never stop!
However, I have one gripe: why the rubber bushings on the rear?!
I just took my 4 year old shocks off the car to inspect them, and was surprised to see the extent of the deformation of these bushings (I believe cold flow may be the term). True, I run a coil over spring on them, so they're taking more load than a torsion bar setup... But, when they come threaded for adjustible spring collars... doesn't that imply that coil overs should be used?
Maybe I can get creative and put heim joint ends on them... The projects never stop!
#5
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Yep, Ive had the same deformation on the two sets I have used (one setup was a coilover only car, the other is with helpers and t-bars still installed). Have thought about going to a spherical bearing conversion - looked at doing it myself, and also having bilstein do it.
I tried to locate spherical bearings that would fit within the existing mounting ends (just removing the rubber) and keep the stock bolts, but it would require some significant machining.
A local friend had his converted by bilstein (pretty cheap), and after looking at what they did - its not anything too trick. They cut off the existing mounts, then had spherical bearings installed in a short section of steel tubing, and welded the tubing to the shock body. So if you have the time and the tig-welder, you may consider doing it yourself (although I dont know if I would recommend putting any heat to the shock body with the gas still pressurized? EDIT - see Skip's note).
But the problem with the bilstein conversion - they are 1/2" rod ends, so you would need to convert the upper 12mm bolt to work with 1/2" and the bottom would need to be converted to a racer's edge type adapter bolt. If you do it yourself, you can get 12mm and 14mm rod ends.
I tried to locate spherical bearings that would fit within the existing mounting ends (just removing the rubber) and keep the stock bolts, but it would require some significant machining.
A local friend had his converted by bilstein (pretty cheap), and after looking at what they did - its not anything too trick. They cut off the existing mounts, then had spherical bearings installed in a short section of steel tubing, and welded the tubing to the shock body. So if you have the time and the tig-welder, you may consider doing it yourself (although I dont know if I would recommend putting any heat to the shock body with the gas still pressurized? EDIT - see Skip's note).
But the problem with the bilstein conversion - they are 1/2" rod ends, so you would need to convert the upper 12mm bolt to work with 1/2" and the bottom would need to be converted to a racer's edge type adapter bolt. If you do it yourself, you can get 12mm and 14mm rod ends.
#6
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Originally Posted by Oddjob
But the problem with the bilstein conversion - they are 1/2" rod ends, so you would need to convert the upper 12mm bolt to work with 1/2" and the bottom would need to be converted to a racer's edge type adapter bolt. If you do it yourself, you can get 12mm and 14mm rod ends.
Looks like a pretty simple job. Just remember, if you DYI, you'll also need some conical spacers.
#7
Drifting
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Originally Posted by Oddjob
...But the problem with the bilstein conversion - they are 1/2" rod ends, so you would need to convert the upper 12mm bolt to work with 1/2" and the bottom would need to be converted to a racer's edge type adapter bolt. If you do it yourself, you can get 12mm and 14mm rod ends.
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#8
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I'm sending the shocks back to Bilstein soon for re-valving/re-building... so my thought was to do my welding (with proper 12mm and 14mm rod ends), then ship them out. But, of course, if there is a risk of the shock exploding in my face while I weld, then I guess I'd consider letting Bilstein do it with half-inch ones. ![Smilie](https://rennlist.com/forums/images/smilies/smile.gif)
I can also easily make spacers for the 12mm and 14mm bolts -- and I like the idea of the larger bolt at the bottom (since it's not supported on both sides like the top).
Anyone ever welded on a shock before?
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I can also easily make spacers for the 12mm and 14mm bolts -- and I like the idea of the larger bolt at the bottom (since it's not supported on both sides like the top).
Anyone ever welded on a shock before?
#9
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. . . Or supply Bilstien with the proper metric rod ends (both 14 mm or a pair of 12's and a pair of 14's - whatever) and threaded rod stock and have them weld when you send them in - that way you dont have to disassemble and any failure would be "on them". Surely they would credit you for the materials.
#11
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Hi Jon, I did see your ledas there, and thought about them. But I'm a huge cheapskate
and I see $40 worth of rod ends plus $65/shock to have Bilstein rebuild them as a bargain.
Are we still on for Sunday?
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Are we still on for Sunday?
#12
Three Wheelin'
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It is very reasonable. I had Bilstein do the conversion. As Oddjob said it was nothing too trick but I think the big thing was having them disassembled when you weld.
I also made spacers for the difference on the lathe. Then sold the shocks for a set of Koni's before I ever mounted them
I also made spacers for the difference on the lathe. Then sold the shocks for a set of Koni's before I ever mounted them
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#13
Three Wheelin'
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Originally Posted by Van
Hi Jon, I did see your ledas there, and thought about them. But I'm a huge cheapskate
and I see $40 worth of rod ends plus $65/shock to have Bilstein rebuild them as a bargain.
Are we still on for Sunday?
![Big Grin](https://rennlist.com/forums/images/smilies/biggrin.gif)
Are we still on for Sunday?
Your friend Aaron indicated he was interested in the shocks. I have a bunch of other stuff, if there's anything else he's looking for (OG racing rollbar for example).
-J
#14
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Morning would work best for me -- maybe between 9 and 10?
Aaron is still hemming and hawing over the shocks! Is that just a roll bar you have, or a full cage... I know someone in Troy looking for a cage.
You were just at the track this weekend, right? How did that go?
Aaron is still hemming and hawing over the shocks! Is that just a roll bar you have, or a full cage... I know someone in Troy looking for a cage.
You were just at the track this weekend, right? How did that go?
#15
Three Wheelin'
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It's just the rollbar, sorry. Damn racers.
Miata was an absolute blast, and the weather couldn't have been better. Started getting pretty comfortable in the car, and pushed a little too hard. I got loose trying to carry more speed through 11 and tossed both feet in during my last session. Looking forward to getting back there, and sorting it out.
-Jon
Miata was an absolute blast, and the weather couldn't have been better. Started getting pretty comfortable in the car, and pushed a little too hard. I got loose trying to carry more speed through 11 and tossed both feet in during my last session. Looking forward to getting back there, and sorting it out.
-Jon