1962 Notchback Coupe with top chopped off...HUH?.
09-06-2006, 08:35 AM
#17
Burning Brakes
Now you just need to buy an original hard top and weld it on....
I actually have one I'd be prepared to sell.
No seriously, I think this is a good way to get in to cabrio 356 driving for relatively little money. Cabrios Here in Germany change hands for 60,000 euro in any sort of reasonbable condition.
I think you should get some cover for the car and you have three options:
an original hard top
an original cabrio roof
a tonneau cover
The only real issue is if the top of the wind screen is identical to the original cabrio. if this is so, any of the above are possible. If the top of the windscreen in not as per original - the tonneau seems the answer.
I do have all three tops for my T5 cabrio so if you need photos just ask. (and I would sell the hard top as it's too much work to take the cabrio top off anf fit the hard top)
I actually have one I'd be prepared to sell.
No seriously, I think this is a good way to get in to cabrio 356 driving for relatively little money. Cabrios Here in Germany change hands for 60,000 euro in any sort of reasonbable condition.
I think you should get some cover for the car and you have three options:
an original hard top
an original cabrio roof
a tonneau cover
The only real issue is if the top of the wind screen is identical to the original cabrio. if this is so, any of the above are possible. If the top of the windscreen in not as per original - the tonneau seems the answer.
I do have all three tops for my T5 cabrio so if you need photos just ask. (and I would sell the hard top as it's too much work to take the cabrio top off anf fit the hard top)
09-07-2006, 06:14 AM
#19
Burning Brakes
On a roadster or sppdster the windscreen frame is bolt on...
On a cabrio the frame is part of the body construction. The question is how Karmann welded the roof to the cabrio body...and then how this was cut when the Karmann coupe cabrio was created....?
If it is not to standard I'm sure a good metal worker could solve this. If I remember there was an artical in "up-Fixin" from the 60's about how to cut and shut a normal 356 coupe to make a cabrio (not easy, requires reprofiling the rear deck) but it must have discussed the top of the screen frame. I'll see if I can find it...
Is there any chance of us seeing a photo of this car?
On a cabrio the frame is part of the body construction. The question is how Karmann welded the roof to the cabrio body...and then how this was cut when the Karmann coupe cabrio was created....?
If it is not to standard I'm sure a good metal worker could solve this. If I remember there was an artical in "up-Fixin" from the 60's about how to cut and shut a normal 356 coupe to make a cabrio (not easy, requires reprofiling the rear deck) but it must have discussed the top of the screen frame. I'll see if I can find it...
Is there any chance of us seeing a photo of this car?
09-07-2006, 05:33 PM
#21
Burning Brakes
After much searching I found the reference I was thinking of.
It's in the 356 Porsche technical and restoration guide volume 2 (RPM Books) from the 356 registry magazine volume 21-6 by Ron Roland "going topless" where he turned t-6 hardtop into a roadster.
one thing he does mention is the need to form a piece of metal to close the top of the wndscreen after you cut the roof off. I wonder if this in necessary on a Karmann hard top of if the metal is there already.....
It's in the 356 Porsche technical and restoration guide volume 2 (RPM Books) from the 356 registry magazine volume 21-6 by Ron Roland "going topless" where he turned t-6 hardtop into a roadster.
one thing he does mention is the need to form a piece of metal to close the top of the wndscreen after you cut the roof off. I wonder if this in necessary on a Karmann hard top of if the metal is there already.....
09-09-2006, 07:55 AM
#23
Burning Brakes
Here is the drawing from the article, as you can see he planned to cut and shut the base of the screen frame as well as he thought it was too high for a nice cabrio look.
Last edited by Irishdriver; 09-13-2007 at 08:40 AM.
09-10-2006, 08:51 PM
#25
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From what I remember the top of the windshield frame looked pretty right for a Cab...there were holes for the top pins and everything. Just some weld clean up and find the hardware and you are in business. The only sheet metal difference is in the back where the inner panels hide the top frame when it is open...they arent there on the hardtop. Easy to fab if you wanted to.
Post some photos!
Post some photos!
09-13-2006, 08:22 AM
#26
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"Well, I went for it. it is a '62 twin grill. The top was removed and as far as I can tell, they did an excellent job. I would be hard pressed to know that this was not a factory delivery. Then again, it dis start out life as a cab..."
Firstly, congratulations on getting into the 356 world but, and yes there is always a but, your car did NOT start out life as a cab. It was built as a notchback. It is the same body shape as a cab, but it was a hardtop. A fixed, welded, non removeable factory built hardtop. I believe that as more people convert notchbacks to cabs, the notchback will become (if it isn't already) more valuable than a butchered NON original cabriolet. As for a price comparison between a real cab and a cut up car, maybe 50% difference between the two. I wouldn't recomend joining the 356 talk list and asking any questions without first getting a really good flack jacket. Just my $0.02c.
Firstly, congratulations on getting into the 356 world but, and yes there is always a but, your car did NOT start out life as a cab. It was built as a notchback. It is the same body shape as a cab, but it was a hardtop. A fixed, welded, non removeable factory built hardtop. I believe that as more people convert notchbacks to cabs, the notchback will become (if it isn't already) more valuable than a butchered NON original cabriolet. As for a price comparison between a real cab and a cut up car, maybe 50% difference between the two. I wouldn't recomend joining the 356 talk list and asking any questions without first getting a really good flack jacket. Just my $0.02c.
09-13-2006, 04:55 PM
#27
Burning Brakes
Hi WAZ356,
I think you are overdoing the 356 originality bit. 356 copies in plastic (now do I sound superior?) are getting 30,000 Euro around here which is mad money. Actually about the same as a good 356 coupe.
Given this madness, an actual 356 notch made into a pretty cabrio will hold its value compared to the original notch. I'd estimate about the same value, particularly if and original cabrio top is fitted.
I actually compliment him for getting into 356 cabrio driving without getting ripped off.
I think you are overdoing the 356 originality bit. 356 copies in plastic (now do I sound superior?) are getting 30,000 Euro around here which is mad money. Actually about the same as a good 356 coupe.
Given this madness, an actual 356 notch made into a pretty cabrio will hold its value compared to the original notch. I'd estimate about the same value, particularly if and original cabrio top is fitted.
I actually compliment him for getting into 356 cabrio driving without getting ripped off.
09-13-2006, 05:37 PM
#28
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Yeah, I'm going to agree here. I'd rather have a "real" 356 than a kit. So, I'd pay more for a chopped notch than a kit, even if it started as a notch.
Look at it this way, on the plus side, the notch may be stronger than an original cab because it has had a roof for more of its life which kept the floor from flexing and weakening in the flex cycles.
Also, it is not one of those circumstances where a car that was not designed with reinforcements for being a cab was chopped to a weak POS. It was exactly the same car as a cab to start.
I do seem to recall that at some point one of the parts to convert a notch into a full cab was only available on the original cars themselves and there was no reproduction or aftermarket part. But, the more I read this thread, the more I want chopped notch! So, I'm going with WAZ now. They are worthless, never going to amount to anything, yes, 50% of anything real. So, sell one to me now!!!!
Look at it this way, on the plus side, the notch may be stronger than an original cab because it has had a roof for more of its life which kept the floor from flexing and weakening in the flex cycles.
Also, it is not one of those circumstances where a car that was not designed with reinforcements for being a cab was chopped to a weak POS. It was exactly the same car as a cab to start.
I do seem to recall that at some point one of the parts to convert a notch into a full cab was only available on the original cars themselves and there was no reproduction or aftermarket part. But, the more I read this thread, the more I want chopped notch! So, I'm going with WAZ now. They are worthless, never going to amount to anything, yes, 50% of anything real. So, sell one to me now!!!!
09-13-2006, 08:03 PM
#30
Folks,
The issue is not between getting a plastic fake or an original car… the car is yours and you can do whatever you want… the issue is that there is no fun on destroying a nice notchback converting it into a cabriolet thinking you have one… it will always be a butchered notchback as stated on its VIN#
On your case… you got the car as it is… so drive it and have fun… but avoid investing money on it…
I agree you can enjoy a cab better than a coupe or a notchback… but transforming a nice notchback into a cab will never pay back the cost of conversion.
There are some nice notchbacks in the market such as the one bellow:
http://www.steenbuck-automobiles.de/...00_S_356_b.htm
And those should be kept as they are. Beautiful and rare 356 notchbacks!
Regarding plastic wannabes… there are several for sale in the market… the owner may fool others… but he will always know what he has. Not to mention the Jacuzzi smell of those cars… for those cars there must be a plastic wannabe Rennlist
That is my opinion.
Freddy
The issue is not between getting a plastic fake or an original car… the car is yours and you can do whatever you want… the issue is that there is no fun on destroying a nice notchback converting it into a cabriolet thinking you have one… it will always be a butchered notchback as stated on its VIN#
On your case… you got the car as it is… so drive it and have fun… but avoid investing money on it…
I agree you can enjoy a cab better than a coupe or a notchback… but transforming a nice notchback into a cab will never pay back the cost of conversion.
There are some nice notchbacks in the market such as the one bellow:
http://www.steenbuck-automobiles.de/...00_S_356_b.htm
And those should be kept as they are. Beautiful and rare 356 notchbacks!
Regarding plastic wannabes… there are several for sale in the market… the owner may fool others… but he will always know what he has. Not to mention the Jacuzzi smell of those cars… for those cars there must be a plastic wannabe Rennlist
That is my opinion.
Freddy