New 996 Owner - Synchro Ring DIY - Rennlist Discussion Forums



New 996 Owner - Synchro Ring DIY

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 03-08-2017, 02:00 PM   #1
msteiner805
User
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Santa Barbara, California
Posts: 162
Default New 996 Owner - Synchro Ring DIY

Hi Everyone,
Last week I brought home a 105k mile 996 (1999 911)! I’ll post more pictures later today as my phone is currently having issues uploading photos.

I bought the car sight unseen, near Los Angeles, knowing it had some mechanical issues and little (no) maintenance history. I paid a very reasonable price due to the nature of the problems and lack of docs, but, now the fun begins!

Some major issues with the car:
- 3rd gear mild occasional grinding
- 4th gear issue (bad grinding). The shifter allows entry into 4th with the clutch pedal depressed. With the shifter in 4th, I try to release the clutch pedal and as I do so, grinding starts, the gear pops out. I basically skip to 5th gear when driving.

Some minor service items that I will attend to as well:
-Brakes squeak occasionally (front pad replacement needed)
-Parking brake needs too much force to engage.
-Rattle coming from behind dash + foam bits in the cabin air vents
-Exhaust seems low, likely need new motor mounts
-Deferred maintenance... IMS bearing change, chain guides etc etc

I haven't been under the car yet, but, the car runs well, good power, turns well. Really a high quality example - I never understood why the 996 got so much flak it is such a solid car.

So the near immediate dilemma is that I'm torn between getting a used trans, or, doing the synchro replacement myself.

Can you guys provide some info on the cost & difficulty in doing a DIY synchro replacement (assuming I just need to replace the 3rd and 4th)? I consider myself a semi-competent at-home Porsche mechanic. I had a 1978 911 many years back and I currently own a 91' 928 .. I have done quite a bit of work on it (torque tube rebuild, intake refresh, etc etc) so I'm thinking a synchro job is something I can tackle.

Any advice, resources etc would be really nice. Thank you in advance.

Mike




msteiner805 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2017, 02:09 PM   #2
dporto
Addict
Rennlist Member
 
dporto's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: L.I. NY
Posts: 1,625
Default

Hmmm, were the two boys in there when you opened the Frunk? As for the syncro question, there are a couple recent threads dealing with Tranny issues. If you're a competent mechanic with some experience in manual transmissions it may not be out of the question assuming you've got the proper tools and maybe a shop press...
dporto is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2017, 02:17 PM   #3
msteiner805
User
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Santa Barbara, California
Posts: 162
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by dporto View Post
Hmmm, were the two boys in there when you opened the Frunk? As for the syncro question, there are a couple recent threads dealing with Tranny issues. If you're a competent mechanic with some experience in manual transmissions it may not be out of the question assuming you've got the proper tools and maybe a shop press...
LOL ... no, they're mine.

They wanted to inspect the hood to make sure that there was no engine ... Confirmed.

I found these threads the other day after some digging:
http://rennlist.com/forums/996-forum...ent-diy-2.html

http://rennlist.com/forums/996-forum...y-project.html

Are there some others? I'm also thinking of getting the shop manual, but, does it address synchro replacement in detail?

Mike
msteiner805 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2017, 02:35 PM   #4
dporto
Addict
Rennlist Member
 
dporto's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: L.I. NY
Posts: 1,625
Default

Ha! They look like they're loving it!!!

Yup, those are the threads! I have no idea re: the shop manual, but I would imagine that everything is in there - The real Porsche maunal(s) cost well over $1k and probably closer to 2k. The Bentley manual is supposed to be very good, but I'm not sure how far they get into the transmission(s). Good luck - and if you wind up doing the work yourself, please document it!
dporto is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2017, 02:47 PM   #5
Imo000
Captain Obvious
Super User
 
Imo000's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Cambridge, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 19,718
Default

Since the tail pipes are low first, change the engine mounts and see if the shifting improves. Sounds strange to a new 996 owner but there is a direct relation to poor shifting and sagging mounts.
Imo000 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2017, 02:50 PM   #6
msteiner805
User
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Santa Barbara, California
Posts: 162
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Imo000 View Post
Since the tail pipes are low first, change the engine mounts and see if the shifting improves. Sounds strange to a new 996 owner but there is a direct relation to poor shifting and sagging mounts.
Thanks - got new Rein mounts on order earlier in the week and they should be here today.
msteiner805 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2017, 02:51 PM   #7
DBJoe996
Addict
Rennlist Member
 
DBJoe996's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Ormond Beach, FL
Posts: 1,808
Default

Unless you have some very good shop tools and a massive press, I would not tackle this job DIY. Has been done DIY but a lot of problems crop up. This is epic http://rennlist.com/forums/996-forum...ement-diy.html
I would send it off to GBox for a synchro refresh http://www.gboxweb.com/index.html
DBJoe996 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2017, 02:56 PM   #8
msteiner805
User
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Santa Barbara, California
Posts: 162
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by DBJoe996 View Post
Unless you have some very good shop tools and a massive press, I would not tackle this job DIY. Has been done DIY but a lot of problems crop up.
I would send it off to GBox for a synchro refresh http://www.gboxweb.com/index.html
Thanks for the suggestion!

Tools and presses aren't a problem, its mostly a time issue. I like doing the work, and, would rather do it myself. Swapping a trans is quicker.

Can you provide some threads/posts where "a lot of problems crop up"? I'd like to see what they are.

Thanks,
Mike
msteiner805 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2017, 03:07 PM   #9
DBJoe996
Addict
Rennlist Member
 
DBJoe996's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Ormond Beach, FL
Posts: 1,808
Default

Read the thread I posted. And wow...you have a 30 ton press at your disposal? See that thread for some of the tips and problems.
DBJoe996 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2017, 03:13 PM   #10
msteiner805
User
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Santa Barbara, California
Posts: 162
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by DBJoe996 View Post
Read the thread I posted. And wow...you have a 30 ton press at your disposal? See that thread for some of the tips and problems.
Thanks, that's the thread I originally posted. I have access to a machine/engineering shop with a variety of presses and tools. I don't know what the ratings on this shops various presses are but I'm fairly confident they have one that can handle this - they rebuild airplane engines as their main business.

Mike
msteiner805 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-10-2017, 02:49 PM   #11
msteiner805
User
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Santa Barbara, California
Posts: 162
Default

Finally got under the car today. First thing I saw is that the engine area appears to be free of wet oil. There are spots where it looks like some seals need to be replaced, but, overall, nothing too bad.

At the transmission though - different story. It looks like gear oil is coming out in a fairly healthy manner from several areas. In fact, one of gear linkages looks fairly soaked. So the trans is likely low on oil, and, in need of new seals.

Does the oil on the linkage indicate a problem with the actual linkage, or, inside the trans? Next step is to figure out if the linkage is healthy... time to do some research on how to test linkage... any advice here would be welcome



Why is it soaked at the linkage and not at the housing?



Another shot...
msteiner805 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-10-2017, 02:51 PM   #12
msteiner805
User
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Santa Barbara, California
Posts: 162
Default

My 928 has a new

partner
msteiner805 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-10-2017, 03:03 PM   #13
Imo000
Captain Obvious
Super User
 
Imo000's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Cambridge, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 19,718
Default

Iv'e got one of each too!
Imo000 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2017, 10:36 AM   #14
msteiner805
User
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Santa Barbara, California
Posts: 162
Default Transmission Out & Clutch Inspection

Hi Everyone,

So, after some deliberation, I decided to source a low mileage used transmission. It should be arriving late next week. I'll be taking the original one apart to see what needs to be fixed, but, I'd rather be able to drive the car while I rebuild so I went ahead and got a used one from what I hope is a reputable source.

Removed the transmission yesterday. Took about 3.5 hours - its not that bad of a job. Last year I did a torque tube rebuild on my 928 where I had to drop the trans and that was a more difficult job... the 928 trans drop takes maybe about twice as long as compared to the 996. What sucks on the 996, is that even with dropping the engine onto the cross-member, that top transmission bolt is a real pain-in-the ....

Some photos below; I'm going to figure out what I need to replace and what I don't. I'd rather not replace stuff that still has life left as I like doing these jobs and would rather not waste stuff.

Anyhow, how does this clutch look? I'm not sure what a worn versus good 996 clutch should look like...

Also, I have a parts list going on pelican - I would be interested in what else needs to be replaced:

Part Number: 997-101-212-01-M17 Price: $13.75 Qty: 1
Description: Flywheel Seal, 996 Carrera 2/4 (1999-04)

Part Number: PEL-TOL-T136 Price: $8.85 Qty: 1
Description: Clutch Alignment Tool

Part Number: 999-073-092-02-M260 Price: $1.75 Qty: 8
Description: Flywheel Bolt - Crankshaft to Flywheel (10 X 50 mm)

Part Number: 900-067-131-03-M260 Price: $0.50 Qty: 6
Description: Bolt - Flywheel to Clutch Pressure Plate (8 X 16 mm)

Part Number: 996-116-087-01-M100 Price: $42.75 Qty: 1
Description: Guide Tube for Clutch Release Bearing Brand: Genuine Porsche

Part Number: 996-301-805-00-M204 Price: $7.25 Qty: 1
Description: Main Shaft Seal Brand: Kaco

Part Number: 012-141-751-C-M1002 Price: $2.75 Qty: 1
Description: Pivot Piece for Clutch Release Lever Brand: Genuine

Part Number: 996-116-743-00-M100 Price: $2.50 Qty: 1
Description: Sealing Washer for Clutch Release Lever

Part Number: 996-116-080-04-M38 Price: $101.50 Qty: 1
Description: Clutch Release Bearing Brand: Sachs

Part Number: 4200-080-050-M38 Price: $7.50 Qty: 1
Description: Clutch Disc Spline Grease - SACHS High Performance

Part Number: 996-116-741-00-M100 Price: $10.75 Qty: 1
Description: Retaining Spring for Clutch Release Lever Pivot



Trans after some cleaning.





Is this clutch too far gone?

msteiner805 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2017, 12:39 PM   #15
Imo000
Captain Obvious
Super User
 
Imo000's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Cambridge, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 19,718
Default

That clutch looks about half worn, maybe a little more. Since you do all your work, reinstalling it is not a terrible choice. I would at least reline the disk or get a new one and install a new release bearing. The pressure plate looks normal for a used clutch. Too far is when the rivets dig into the flywheel or pressure plate. By the way, a release bearing from a '97 Audi A4 is the same as the one for the 996 (I've used it on my own car) but at a fraction of the cost (doesn't have the Porsche badge premium)

Next time if you need to remove the torque tube on the 928, the transmission doesn't need to come out, Just disconnect the transmission mounts and push the transmission back a few inches and the front will clear the bell housing. The parking brake cables will need to be disconnected from the rear cross member too.
Imo000 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Related Topics
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
FS: 996TT 1-3 mainshaft with gears and synchros powdrhound 996 Turbo Forum 8 10-06-2016 02:26 AM
997 C4 slight grind in all gears? NineNine7 997 Forum 7 09-08-2016 10:46 AM
grinding noise shifting into 5th and 6th? 911cedric 993 Forum 10 07-23-2016 11:34 AM
Gear shift problem shiraz 993 Forum 8 11-19-2015 12:56 AM
What Synchros in an 08? 2nd gear hard? arachnyd Porsche Cayenne Forum 10 08-31-2015 12:21 AM


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -3. The time now is 03:48 AM.


Copyright © 1998 - 2015 Rennlist.com
 
  • Ask a Question
    Get answers from community experts
What's your question?
Send