hotrodc4s

Hi all.
(I posted a reply to a "coaxial speaker replacement" topic, and thought I might be able to help more people if I started a new topic. I'm going to post the same info here that I posted in the reply, as well as add some info on the Bose setup.)

(I receive the daily 911 digest, but don't venture to this board more than a few times a year. After seeing all the stereo postings, yikes, maybe I should tune in more often! I might be able to help)

On the 996, the non-hifi equipped cars have come with a 4" full range in each dash location and a 4" full range in each rear side location. On the hifi setup, there is a 5.25" subwoofer mounted in each door, and the dash and rear side speakers are 4" mid and separate tweeter. All dash and rear side speakers attach to the grills, and overall size is pretty much restricted to a 4" speaker there. If your car didn't come with the hifi package, then it's actually quite simple to simply upgrade speakers all around with 4" coaxials, though attaching them usually involves "gutting" the factory speakers to use their "mounting flange" to clamp the new speakers in place, and some brands are better fit than others. Even changing out the head unit is quite simple because there is no separate amp on the non-hifi cars, and a standard harness adapter and antenna adapter allow the new radio to plug in cleanly without altering the car. (If installing your own unit, email me for installation instructions, there are a few things to be aware of including powering the antenna booster, and disconnecting a security lead that interfaces with the alarm, and it seems 03 and up have no switched ignition wire in the harness, but there is an orange wire at the ignition switch itself that will behave properly-that is, it remains energized until the key is actually removed from ignition-hooray!)

The factory speakers, amp, and radio, are all in my opinion, poor quality stuff that is easily outperformed by even medium end aftermarket equipment. The Bose setups now include a subwoofer in the coupes (like the 02 TT in our shop right now, drool, drool...) with dual 6" drivers that despite their large ported enclosure still somehow fail to produce quality bass. The door speakers are ported, but seem to break up at anything but a low level. The Bose setup involves another, teeny tiny amplifier in the trunk. (All hifi cars have an amplifier in the trunk, a black square unit that claims 60 x 6, I believe). The Bose speakers are laid out the same, but they use their trademark triangular drivers.

Good quality speakers, a quality amplifier, good sub setup (even 5" subs behind the rear side panels in the coupes sound great!), nice clean head unit with good response and at least 4 volts of preamp voltage, all make for one spectacular true 4-way system, which is very hard to describe. I'll sit in this TT when it's all done and waste a bunch of time that I can't afford to spend listening to it, just stunned 'Hopefully this car will be done tomorrow. 'sorry for rambling, I spent the weekend in Kentucky working on a 993 TT and an SC cab, I had a blast, but I need a day off, hehe.

Anyways, that's my $.02. Questions are always welcome, my shop email is hotrod930@msn.com the website is www.caraudioinnovations.com I can email some directions I have for the 996. I'm sorry they're not as fully developed yet and detailed as I have for the earlier cars. (I think I've only done audio upgrades on perhaps 50 996's compared a few hundred of the earlier cars, so I keep adding and updating, and taking more pictures.) Even if you're just looking at different options, you can email me what you're thinking and I can render my opinion.

I've seen Reus systems mentioned, and I believe them to be very qualified and experienced, and I've heard from people who're happy with their setups. I met with Rick and I think he's a nice guy to boot.

-Rod

yeldogt

Thank you Thank you - very nice post

I have an 01 tt and I want to do some upgrades on it but I do not want to remake the wheel.

It would be great to know the names and models of some speakers that will fit in the factory spots? I would think it would be best to have them all from the same co.

Also since I have a tt -- I was told that they did not come with the basic system (I have door speakers) I do not have that "digital system" control in the dash - so I must have the hi-fi setup -- but I do not see any amp!

I was just going to change out the head unit for a 'traffic pro' - but I wonder if it is going to be as bad as the unit I have now -- they look the same! The porsche unit is fine when a CD is playing but the FM system is just not very good.

Also I did not know about any ant booster!

Thank again - TAG

Trojan Man

[insert shameless plug here]: I have the full Reus system in my Turbo and it is the best sounding car stereo I have ever heard. While I have not heard systems from Car Audio Innovations as mentioned above, IMHO it would be hard to imagine a better sounding system than my Reus. It would also be hard to imagine a more expensive system


Finally, I would call Reus much more than qualified and experienced - I would call Rick Reus "The Master" of car audio. Since I do business with him regularly, I have occasion to visit his shop at least once a month and I am always amazed at the endless parade of Porsches, Ferraris, and Mercedes that run through Reus' shop.

hotrodc4s

There are a few shops down your way, I hear good things about Paris Audio in I think Bevery Hills? Also, Eric at Speakerworks in Orange is one of the pioneers of many things that are now common in competitions. I've heard from a few happy Reus customers, and people being happy with their stereo is what it's all about. Rock on.

On your 996TT, your factory amp is under that small black "grill" on the passenger side of your trunk, right next to the gas tank. The grill is a vent for the amplifier, and is held in with one phillips screw. Remove that black vent and you'll see your 60x6 amp (I think that's a max rating, personally!). This amp is more obvious on the C2 because it's located behind the spare on the back wall of the trunk. The Hifi package includes a door speaker location, the non-hifi cars have an open map pocket there instead.

I think I ranted in my previous message about the different speaker locations and how the car is equipped from the factory.

For the dash and door location, I like to use the Focal Polyglass 3 way set, which isn't even their top speaker, but a 3 way set has inherent advantages, and if you run separate subs in one configuration or another, then you'll have a true 4-way system, which just has to be heard to be believed. After doing a couple of dozen of these, it still floors me. I hear a lot of nice setups and get to compare equipment A/B style. I've likely done a few hundred 911 installs altogether, and when done properly, it's self-evident. The Focal 3-way set is something that we do with a couple differences over the standard 165v3 set, we substitute the 5.25" midwoofer from another Polyglass set (with Focal's blessings, of course, since we ran it by them first), and we have a specific way we mount them and perform additional level matching to achieve the proper balance with the 3 drivers. We include the parts, instructions and details with this set, $599.95/set. Since we're authorized Focal dealers, they come with a 3 year warranty, and we perform advance replacement coverage for that period for our mail order customers. We can also ship out replacments to those whom we visit on an "installation trip" to southern Calif, or wherever I go to install on a Porsche (this last weekend I flew to Lexington, then Louisville Kentucky for installation work on a 97 993TT and 83SC cab, see the 993 boards for details-what a job!). (Beware of the Focal stuff you see online with defaced serial numbers!) For many systems, to save guys money, we'll just put the Focal coaxial 4" in back at $159.95/pair, and they're plenty for rear "fill", and can even be driven off head unit power, saving amp dollars.

There are subwoofer enclosures that we build for the 996, and pictures are shown on our website, www.caraudioinnovations.com, on the Porsche sub enclosure page. One configuration for the coupe is a dual 10 or dual 8" enclosure that sits on the lower shelf behind the rear seats, extends into the area behind it, and is wrapped in vinyl, with "Carrera" or "Turbo", your choice embossed on the back, facing the rear window. This is the grey enclosure towards the bottom of the enclosure info page for the 996, and is also shown in "Porsche Installations" in a 2001 C2 coupe. It ranges from $1200 with dual 8" subs to $1499 with dual Focal 11" Polyglass subs. Heck, if it was my car, I'd do the Polykevlar 11" subs at $2600, hehe.

Another sub option is our cabriolet style enclosures, which have shallow 8" subs, one on each rear floor, also shown on the Porsche 996 enclosure page. These sit low on the rear floor, but do consume the floor. $949 for a pair.

One nice, subtle, and perhaps mild option is a 5" Focal Utopia sub behind each rear side panel $189 each for Utopia, $239 each for Polykevlar, in some adapter plates and panels that we make. These don't produce bass with the authority of larger subs in a large enclosure, but they do produce great low frequencies. We have an '02 TT in our shop now, and we've built one of our wood enclosures, a 5" Focal Utopia in a transmission line style enclosure ($649) which produces a great quantity of pretty smooth bass, like a larger driver. Plus we're doing the 5" subs in the rear sides for midbass, and the Focal 3-way system up front. This is going to make up a 5-way system in this car, and it will be done on Saturday, in case any SF Bay Area or Sacramento area 996 owners want to hear it-let me know!

I know I've thrown out too many subwoofer options now. So here's another:

You can run 5" subwoofers in the two rear side locations as well as the doors, for a total of 4 5" subs, and do Focal's higher end Polykevlar 4" component set it the dash (100kp) for some of the smoothest highs you've ever heard.

On the head unit, I don't recommend the Traffic Pro. I think the Becker stuff is noticeably inferior in clean signal and flat musical response, as well as bandwidth. It's tough to try to "eq" a setup that has such dull sound with poor clarity like those Beckers, and their tuners seem to be weak. Any aftermarket head unit with at least 4 volts of preamp signal will be superior. I like a number of brands, and I'm proud to be an authorized dealer for Eclipse, Pioneer, and Kenwood Excelon. My favorite for the 996 dash has to be the Nakamichi stuff, for which I'm also a dealer. The CD400 is a great unit, $449.95, clean sound, a ****, auxiliary input, 3 pairs of preamp outputs, 4 volts each, sub level control, and a 24 bit D/A converter which makes for CD playback that's just superior. (Kenwood, Pioneer, and Eclipse have 24 bit on some of their nicer units, and it just makes for more clean sound and some more headroom). I've got squirreled away a couple of the Nakamichi MB100 units, which are plain looking, have buttons for volume, amber display also, 24 bit D/A, and 6 disc indash. Preamp outputs are 5 volts, but only front and rear. (You can add a nice bass **** to some of the better amps, which can be handy in either case). $999.95 each, 'kinda pricey but nice. I might keep one of them for myself, they've stopped making them and who knows when the MB10, the replacement, will be out.

Pioneer has a new headunit this year that I think will simply dominate the market for such. Their new AVIC-N1 indash motorized LCD touchscreen includes navigation, DVD player, AM/FM/CD, tuner, at $1999.95. Just a year ago, you had to pay $2k for just the navigation, to add to the $1800 indash screen unit! We've done a few of these, and they're nice, including back up camera input, 24 bit D/A, just a great unit with friendly navigation features.

For amplifiers, I'm really big on the Audison stuff. The VRX stuff can be pretty pricey, but that's what I'm putting in my personal car. (I'm between 911's, sorry, so cruising a 528i for now). Amps can run anywhere from $439 for the small SRX4 4 channel to $599 for their beefy 3 channel (one of my favorites), they have an LRX line with more power at $700-900 depending on 4 or 5 channels. On the C2, these amps will all fit on the rear wall where the factory amp goes-which I think is a big bonus. The factory changer or any other changer won't fit in it's usual spot, though, since the Audison amps are longer than the factory amp.

Well, there I think I've laid it out, hopefully clearly. Once I understand someone's needs and budget, I can usually help weed through the options to figure out what will best serve.

In my opinion, the downside of the 996 is that there really isn't anything from the factory stereo that is worth keeping, even with the Bose setup, which can make any worthwhile upgrades expensive (I'd say our average install on a 996 runs about $3700-4800 or so without doing the large sub enclosure or navigation/video.) On the up side, if one installs speakers properly (kind of a tricky mount to get a rigid, airtight fit to the factory grills), sets levels properly and crossovers (we set all this before shipping product out for the do-it-myself guys), man, it's a really nice setup. Be cautious what speakers you put in the dash, and settings. Bright or harsh speakers seem to just plain cause fatigue when you're driving at speed with the tunes up to compensate for road/wind noise.

I hope this helps! Questions, comments, feedback are always welcome.

-Rod

wet996

Rod - great info!!!

I am still "strategizing" on my audio upgrade (99 cab). So far I have the Focal 165K3 3-ways (polykevlars not polyglass) and a soundstream VGA 4x125w amp. I wanted to use the 3-ways upfront (sound stage) then use ch3&4 to drive the subs (TBD). Already have 2 issues with the Focals: fitting the 4" mids in the dash and the 6.5" in the door pods (magnets are too big in both cases). Would I be better off just going with 5.25s and splitting them (tweets in dash and mids in the door - read you should keep them together)? Then putting subs in back?. Have you ever counted a "big magnet" 6.5 in the door of a 996?

Thanks!!

JayM

Hey Rod-good to hear form you, man!

For those who don't know, Rod is the NorCal version of Jamie at Paris Audio, and saves us the need to drive all the way to Beverly Hills for decent tunes. There may be a couple of Porsche sound guys who are as good, but I can't imagine anyone better. Or more honest. Or easier to deal with. Or more professional.

And anyone who says you can't get decent sound in a convertible needs to go for a ride in the Ruf

hotrodc4s

hey, more responses, coolness.

On wet996's equipment, hmm, I don't know how to get those speakers in your car. It sounds like you've got the previous Polykevlar series 3 way set. I think that 4" will fit in the dash location, but I'm not sure how to securely mount it. I think with the dash grill removed, it drops right into the opening. securing it, well, I haven't tried to get that big stout 4" into the dash, it's not something that can be mounted to the grill like we do with the other Focal 4" mids. I'd keep the mid and tweeter together in the dash.

You might be able to get that 6.5" midwoofer from the same set into the door with an adapter plate. The critical thing here is to achieve an airtight seal/fit to the door enclosure. We cut some ABS adapter rings for some drivers and actually use ABS glue to attach them to the door enclosure. Some trimming on the back side of the door panel is done for necessary clearance. An easier fit would be the same generation Polykevlar 5.25" midwoofer, which just about drops in, and needs just a minor spacer ring to seal up airtight. I don't know how hard it would be to find this driver, since the new Polykevlar power series revamped speaker sets have been out for about a year now. The new Polykevlar K3P set includes a 6.5" woofer, 6.5" mid and the phenomenal new TN52 tweeter. 'Great set, but not a good fit for the 996 which is ready for a 5.25, 4" and tweeter. The Soundstream amp will be okay if it's an older model, but if it's something built in the last two years, then it's actually built by Power Acoustik, a low end brand that bought Soundstream. This saddened us, and we dropped the Soundstream brand. In the 996, a quality amp and proper interconnects, wire routing, etc is critical, as well as a head unit with at least 4 volts of preamp signal. Otherwise, noise will likely result, especially alternator whine. If you don't use the right kind of speaker wire (the factory stuff works fine, and you can use twisted style aftermarket wire with good results) you can even have noise with the system off.(!) A low quality amplifier will simply be noisy, with no way to get rid of the noise short of replacing with a better quality amplifier.

Hey, Jay, thanks for the kind words! You rule. I trust that your Ruf is still rockin'! Jamie is no longer at Paris Audio, apparently they let him go. (I found out through a Boxster owner who was trying to get help redoing some stuff he wasn't happy with). I think he finally was taken care of by the owners, but for some reason had stuff swapped out at another shop.

questions, comments, feedback always welcome. I can email instructions to 996 owners on installing stuff, and we ship out "do it yourself" setups all over the U.S every week. (I've even got an order for our 993 subwoofer enclosure panels from Italy to ship out right now!) I'm always looking to organize a trip to install equipment too. Sometimes it can be pretty cost effective if I can organize a few cars in the same general area. So far I've traveled to Washington state, Kentucky, Ohio, Illinois, Indiana, NY, NJ, and MD for installation work, as well as about 5 trips to So Cal including a couple trips to Palm Springs.

'hope this helps!

-Rod

MLA911

Rod was gracious enough to answer most, if not all, of the same questions posed above when I called him out of the blue about a year and a half ago. He didn't know me from a hole in the wall but did everything he could to answer all of my questions about upgrading the stereo in my 996, which I did, including the use of his custom subwoofer enclosure with twin 8" image dynamics. Thanks for all your input Rod.....The subs sound great BTW! Mike A.

wet996

Hey Rod - Thanks for the great info (wish I was closer to your shop)!!!

I heard about your soundstream comment elsewhere (post purchase of course). I am switching to Phoenix Gold Titanium (hopefully ebay the SS VGA). As for the Focals - the 4" is tight only on the driver side. There is a metal brace thats in the way of the magnet I am still working on it though.

As for the door mount - I found a pair of Porsche 5.5 litre sealed enclosures (my 99 came with smaller vented pods) on ebay and was going to use them (the 6.5" will require some modification to fit). Question is - how will a 5.25 or 6.5 sound in a sealed box? If you have pics of the direct door panel mount - would love to see them. Thanks again for sharing your knowledge !!

wet996

Hey MLA911 - I live in Delray too. What audio mods did you do (besides the subs)? Where did you get it done (if not yourself)?

Thanks!

Rob in WA

I just ordered a bunch of stuff from Rod and I'm going to install it next weekend. I'm a little nervous, so if anyone else in Western Washington is thinking of upgrading perhaps we could get hime up here.

wet996

Rod - above you mention an adaptor plate for the door. Is this to replace the 6x9 stock grill? I guess you remove the 5-1/4" speaker pods. Does the airspace behind the door pannel and infront of the foam bearier provide enough air space and sound isolation? If you have/make this adaptor I would am interested in buying them. Thanks!!

hotrodc4s

oh my, this is becoming a lively discussion. 'careful everyone, I get really excited about this stuff. I'll try to take a deep breath and stay on track:

A trip to Washington state would be fine! Rob's here too. wild man.

On the door speaker adapter plate mentioned by wet996, here's the lowdown on the door speaker in the 996 and Boxster. Only the cars with the hifi option have the door speaker location, non-hifi cars have just an open map pocket on that forward corner of the door panel.

When equipped with door speakers, the mount is a bit unusual, but becoming more common on BMWs and Porsches. The 5.25" (standard frame "woofer", 2 ohm I think), speaker doesn't mount to the door itself, but is mounted to an ABS plastic housing that is fastened to the door with 4 screws. This speaker enclosure has some good air volume to it, and it's ported. I have relatively small hands, and I can reach into this enclosure through the speaker opening (this unit is kind of flat in shape, just deep enough for the speaker to mount, and fits sort of into a groove on the interior surface of the door, behind the door panel) and I can stuff at least a 1/4 pound of Acousta-Stuf into the enclosure. The factory speaker grills built into the door are fine as they are, but on the back sides of the grills, with a dremel, you sometimes need to trim some protruding plastic so that it clears the speaker/sub when the door panel is mounted. The adapter plates that I mentioned we ship with the equipment, they're basically ABS rings that are cut with a circle jig and provide a nice seal/mount for the driver, depending on which driver you're installing in the doors. We do everything in these doors from a 5.25" standard basket, (like in the Focal Polyglass set in our modified 3-way setup that we supply), to a 6.5" version of the Polyglass midwoofer, which we can usually adapt in, and the other option mentioned with Focal 5" door subs (5 3/8" drivers, also sealing up/mounting with the proper adapter plates/rings). The odd thing is that over the few years of the 996 and Boxster, I've seen about 4 different versions of these door enclosures, all with the same "subs" from the factory, but slightly different shapes and volumes, which makes it hard to tell how a speaker will fit until we do some test fitting. The Bose system is similar, they just use those funky sort of triangle shaped drivers. 'still greatly compromised system, IMHO, and not nearly as nice as even a modest aftermarket setup.

On door speaker response in a ported versus sealed enclosure, I think either should sound fine, but both enclosures seem to benefit from stuffing. On the sealed, it helps response and increases air volume, on the ported it helps dampen the air movement through the port.

for pics of the door speaker mounts (I *think* I have some on the PC at the shop) please email me there, hotrod930@msn.com so that I can reply and attach pics and instructions. These instructions are available to all Rennlist members for no charge. When ordering, Rennlist members get a couple free demo CD's, and make sure to ask for your free T shirt (M, L, XL)so's I don't forget to include it.

More questions welcome, 'bring 'em on!

-Rod

mattmarsden

Does anyone know how easy it is to add the door speaker enclosures? I'm guessing it is fairly easy to do this.

wet996

Rod - I do have the "hi-fi" option. My 99 came with the smaller ported "pods" but I found the larger sealed "pods" on ebay and intend to use them. Thanks again for the info.

Mattmarsden - your 996 needs to come with this "hi-fi" audio option. The door pannels are different, they extend into the car to accomodate the speaker enclosures.