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Posted this question on the Green PTS thread, but I apologize it should've been on this one. Wondering if any one knows if there has ever been any yellow PTS colours in the past?
There are a number of choices, but Signal Yellow is the best. I was originally thinking of doing my GT3 in it, but I don't think the current Signal Yellow is true to the vintage Signal Yellow.
I saw a signal yellow C4s at McKenna porsche a while back. What a beautiful color! It is what I would have ordered if PTS was available for the GT3. Racing yellow is a close second, but the orange tint in Signal really made for a unique color.
Yep - I was going to do it but ended up skipping the whole PTS thing for this car and glad I did as I would rather the buckets. Might do it on the RS, but who knows what that will all look like and if it's even offered.
Posted this question on the Green PTS thread, but I apologize it should've been on this one. Wondering if any one knows if there has ever been any yellow PTS colours in the past?
Bronson: There has been yellows on Porsche since the 356 days, but they became a memorable hue on the special shape of the early longhood 911's. Some were standard offerings at time. Others were 'special order'. But all were widely available and often seen on early 911's of the period:
Of the above, 'Signal Yellow' & 'Green Yellow' are approved as PTS for the 991/981. In the 997 era, the only 'Signal Yellow' done was the UK gt3 RS pictured in the photo posted by NateOZ below! After this one, PAG claimed they had issues with the paint (e.g. warranty) and refused to redo this color on any other 997. We are lucky that someone persisted and PAG tested it again on the 991/981, where it passed the feasibility test & it's currently on the approved list!
Take a look at the enclosed current PTS list. There are just a few more 'yellow' colors you can choose, including 'Atacama Yellow' and the older 996/997 favorite standard 'Speed Yellow'! But it would be great if the full list of early 1970's colors would be requested for PTS and approved!
Originally Posted by NateOZ
There are a number of choices, but Signal Yellow is the best. I was originally thinking of doing my GT3 in it, but I don't think the current Signal Yellow is true to the vintage Signal Yellow.
Nate: Why do you think that? Did you see the McKenna car in person & was it a disappointment to you (photo 1 & 2)?
It has the same color code as the vintage early 911 color (photo 3 & 4 of my original paint 'Signal Yellow' 1973 911T Sunroof Coupe)!
Sadly, I didn't see the car at McKenna. But one of the shops that does work on my cars was working on a more correct Signal Yellow recreation - I saw a sample a Porsche dealer had sent them and it just wasn't worth the hassle. The plan for one of their customers was to do feasibility on a custom color that would be much closer to the original Signal Yellow.
Ultimately, the project got canned as Porsche was making it too difficult, despite it being a 918 order. I was hoping to piggyback on it for my GT3 order. I may take up the cause again on a future order of a non-limited run car, like a facelift C2S.
My 2015 GT3 will be PTS Signal yellow 😊 should be here in January. Also LWB seats. I am a big fan of 114, had several cars in that color:
73 RS clone
99 996 Conv
08 997 RSR
Will post pics, can't from my iPhone (will keep trying...)
Sadly, I didn't see the car at McKenna. But one of the shops that does work on my cars was working on a more correct Signal Yellow recreation - I saw a sample a Porsche dealer had sent them and it just wasn't worth the hassle. The plan for one of their customers was to do feasibility on a custom color that would be much closer to the original Signal Yellow.
Nate: The problem is who/what a 'Porsche dealer' sent. What are they sending? What color are they copying? What is a color photo or an actual color chip?
As you can see from my earlier post on the green PTS (photo #1), only 'Porsche Exclusive' in Germany keeps track of what colors have been done via PTS. They have these chips. And there is some color formula behind it. And they label then with the correct color code. Note that 'Signal Green' has had various color formulas and paint codes. Porsche is aware of that and list them accordingly. But interestingly, Porsche has kept 'Signal Yellow' to this day as color code 114. That tells us they are pretty damn sure that their current 'Signal Yellow' PTS is almost the same as their original 1970 'Signal Yellow' Code 114!
As you know, paint suppliers often change at PAG. And the materials that cars are currently being built with often change too. So the color formulas have to be tested using the new paints & base coats - in this case presently from DuPont. And it's a 991/981 era. So every color requested has to go through the feasibility test again.
So God only knows what the 'Porsche dealer' you mentioned sent to the shop...and why your shop thought the color of the sample was 'off' and needed to be closer to the original 'Signal Yellow'. There are so few original paint 'Signal Yellow' Code 114 cars from that early vintage 911 longhood era to compare it with today! Dealers are notorious for getting confused about colors and PTS. Even McKenna, who custom ordered this 'Signal Yellow' car for inventory speculation and not a private order, would not admit the color of their car was 'Signal Yellow'. They insisted it was 'Signal Orange'. And we finally got from 'Porsche Exclusive' confirmation that PAG has not approved 'Signal Orange', so McKenna had to be WRONG as to what they were representing! If anybody has the time, reading the threads linked below should be an eye opener:
Dealers are mostly ignorant about the nuances of PTS colors. I don't trust a single one of them on this subject. We at Rennlist, from the threads & posts of our various experienced PTS owners (e.g. Porschemeister), do a TERRIFIC job of covering this subject in depth. There is no better site anywhere on the internet to research, in a comprehensive way, the topic of PTS & 'Porsche Exclusive' than with us here at Rennlist! We are good...and thorough!
Originally Posted by porschemeister
My 2015 GT3 will be PTS Signal yellow 😊 should be here in January. Also LWB seats. I am a big fan of 114, had several cars in that color:
73 RS clone
99 996 Conv
08 997 RSR
Will post pics, can't from my iPhone (will keep trying...)
Best, Porschemeister
Excellent news....best of luck with your order. And looking forward to seeing the results!
Nate: The problem is who/what a 'Porsche dealer' sent. What are they sending? What color are they copying? What is a color photo or an actual color chip?
As you can see from my earlier post on the green PTS (photo #1), only 'Porsche Exclusive' in Germany keeps track of what colors have been done via PTS. They have these chips. And there is some color formula behind it. And they label then with the correct color code. Note that 'Signal Green' has had various color formulas and paint codes. Porsche is aware of that and list them accordingly. But interestingly, Porsche has kept 'Signal Yellow' to this day as color code 114. That tells us they are pretty damn sure that their current 'Signal Yellow' PTS is almost the same as their original 1970 'Signal Yellow' Code 114!
As you know, paint suppliers often change at PAG. And the materials that cars are currently being built with often change too. So the color formulas have to be tested using the new paints & base coats - in this case presently from DuPont. And it's a 991/981 era. So every color requested has to go through the feasibility test again.
So God only knows what the 'Porsche dealer' you mentioned sent to the shop...and why your shop thought the color of the sample was 'off' and needed to be closer to the original 'Signal Yellow'. There are so few original paint 'Signal Yellow' Code 114 cars from that early vintage 911 longhood era to compare it with today! Dealers are notorious for getting confused about colors and PTS. Even McKenna, who custom ordered this 'Signal Yellow' car for inventory speculation and not a private order, would not admit the color of their car was 'Signal Yellow'. They insisted it was 'Signal Orange'. And we finally got from 'Porsche Exclusive' confirmation that PAG has not approved 'Signal Orange', so McKenna had to be WRONG as to what they were representing! If anybody has the time, reading the threads linked below should be an eye opener.
To help clarify, it was the customer who wasn't happy with the sample that didn't match his signal yellow 911 perfectly. The issue as I understand it extends from the change to water based paint, which has resulted in some colors not having the same character.
The shop was asked to figure out a water based mix that would match perfectly and could be provided to PAG for feasibility. I don't know who it was but I knew they were working on it as I was getting their opinion on ordering a Signal Yellow GT3.
They've done some custom colors on 918s successfully, but I suspect the factory was imposing deadlines on this one so they just had to throw in the tell and order it another way.
It's hard to describe the shop other than car customization and they want to make sure you're 100% happy with what you get from the dealer as they know you'll spend more money on mods then
You guys are amazing!!!!! What a wealth of knowledge. With all the history regarding PTS and standard colours, it's great to have all this information moving forward. I'm certainly looking forward in the near future on ordering a PTS Pcar. It just won't be easy chosing one. Once again, all who posted on this thread, thanks again.
To help clarify, it was the customer who wasn't happy with the sample that didn't match his signal yellow 911 perfectly. The issue as I understand it extends from the change to water based paint, which has resulted in some colors not having the same character.
The shop was asked to figure out a water based mix that would match perfectly and could be provided to PAG for feasibility. I don't know who it was but I knew they were working on it as I was getting their opinion on ordering a Signal Yellow GT3.
1) Yellow is the hardest hue to color match. Ask me how I know?*
2) 'Signal Yellow', in particular, was difficult to match perfectly even back in the 1970's, when leaded factory paint was still available.
3) Part of the character of 'Signal Yellow' was the lead in the original formula. That is no longer allowed by current regulations.
4) 'Signal Yellow' is very sensitive to the underlaying color of the base primer coat.
5)The weak link is what appears to have happened in your story, Nate, is the 'sample' provided by the Porsche dealer to the shop. The 'who/what' still applies to that scenario? 'Porsche Exclusive' in Germany doesn't do metal samples of PTS colors and sends them to customers or dealers. It's the other way around. So who knows the quality of the sample and how original was the 'Signal Yellow' of the vehicle the customer was trying to match.
5)Let's wait and see other examples of the current PTS 'Signal Yellow' as they turn up shortly. Porschemeister will get his soon. McKenna sold that 'Signal Yellow' Carrera 4S. But it will probably be shown by its new owner somewhere...and we can perhaps explore it photographed against an original 1970's 'Signal Yellow' 911! So the jury is still out on whether or not PAG nailed the current 'Signal Yellow' PTS, color code 114...or missed by a mile. I am certain we will have an answer to that question pretty soon. 'Signal Yellow' is too beautiful of a color for folks in forum like this not to order on their next 991 or 981. It is truly a stunning color in person!
Saludos,
Eduardo
Carmel
*I tried to have a reputable Porsche paint/restoration shop in Long Beach, California touch up three small 'repair' spots on my otherwise original 'Signal Yellow' 1970 911T Sunroof Coupe a few years ago. They failed to blend it in and instead painted the entire panels. It was an unmitigated & expensive disaster. I was so disappointed with the job that I sold the car at a large financial loss. I couldn't stand seeing the mismatch colors, whether in public or inside of my garage (see attached photos). The two-tone error was unmistakable when you wore polarized sunglasses or took photos with any decent camera. It was frankly pure agony each time I looked at my 911. I tried to put up with it for a year, then contemplated a lawsuit...and finally decided to sell it, move on & not ruin my hobby with lawyers & courts. Learn from my mistake. Leave well enough alone and never try to perfect 'original' paint in a historic old vehicle. And be careful with whom you trust with your car's original paint. Caveat lector.
5)The weak link is what appears to have happened in your story, Nate, is the 'sample' provided by the Porsche dealer to the shop. The 'who/what' still applies to that scenario? 'Porsche Exclusive' in Germany doesn't do metal samples of PTS colors and sends them to customers or dealers. It's the other way around. So who knows the quality of the sample and how original was the 'Signal Yellow' of the vehicle the customer was trying to match.
Let me find out how they saw the current version - frankly it might have been a car that was ordered. They're not open on Weekends and I think are closed next week, but will let you know as soon as I get a response.
If it was a clients car, they have very strict rules against photos of cars that aren't your own so I wouldn't be able to get a hold of them without their client's permission.
Eduardo, would you happen to have colour sample comparison with the Racing Yellow side by side with the Signal Yellow? Would love to see the difference. Thanks in advance!!!
11-28-2014, 08:37 AM
