Engine Rebuild 4.0
04-22-2016, 11:26 AM
#1
Pro
Thread Starter
Engine Rebuild 4.0
Just got all my parts back from the local race shop.
fresh crank wtih con rod journals machined .50 mm over size
have a few little projects to complete:
1. reinstall oil cooler - recently flushed (looking for metal bits)
2. reinstall pedal cluster - clutch pedal was releasing just off the floor so got it rebuilt and freshened up
3. need cut off clutch hard line and replace end that is seized and needs to be able to swivel and connect to the clutch slave hose - previously i would have to connect to hard line then install the slave - very difficult but can be done
4. rebuild power steering pump
5. replace transmission output shaft seal x 2 sides as there was minor leak
Then:
rebuild bottom end, then top end and all the rest of the bits
All this required because i threw a connecting rod bearing due to either,
1. crappy oil,
2. not enough oil,
3. not properly torque-ing on the connecting rods,
4. crankshaft was not straight - off by 10 thou, which also explains why the crankshaft pulley had come off... twice
So i'll post some pics and may have some questions for those that have more experience than me.
why 4.0
2013 - rebuild 1.0 resealed but left the no. 8 bearing sticking out - who knew?
2013 - rebuild 2.0 resealed after tear down and still leaked like a bitch
2013 - rebuild 3.0 resealed after tear down, clean up and no longer leaked but would not run right,
so replaced some of the obvious stuff and repair a bunch of stuff over 2014 and 2015 -
1. new injectors,
2. distributor rebuild,
3. computer ECU rebuild,
4. AFM - replace with rebuild,
5. new 02 sensor,
6. fresh knock sensor,
7. replaced the engine harness,
hope to have back together over the next couple of weeks.....
fresh crank wtih con rod journals machined .50 mm over size
have a few little projects to complete:
1. reinstall oil cooler - recently flushed (looking for metal bits)
2. reinstall pedal cluster - clutch pedal was releasing just off the floor so got it rebuilt and freshened up
3. need cut off clutch hard line and replace end that is seized and needs to be able to swivel and connect to the clutch slave hose - previously i would have to connect to hard line then install the slave - very difficult but can be done
4. rebuild power steering pump
5. replace transmission output shaft seal x 2 sides as there was minor leak
Then:
rebuild bottom end, then top end and all the rest of the bits
All this required because i threw a connecting rod bearing due to either,
1. crappy oil,
2. not enough oil,
3. not properly torque-ing on the connecting rods,
4. crankshaft was not straight - off by 10 thou, which also explains why the crankshaft pulley had come off... twice
So i'll post some pics and may have some questions for those that have more experience than me.
why 4.0
2013 - rebuild 1.0 resealed but left the no. 8 bearing sticking out - who knew?
2013 - rebuild 2.0 resealed after tear down and still leaked like a bitch
2013 - rebuild 3.0 resealed after tear down, clean up and no longer leaked but would not run right,
so replaced some of the obvious stuff and repair a bunch of stuff over 2014 and 2015 -
1. new injectors,
2. distributor rebuild,
3. computer ECU rebuild,
4. AFM - replace with rebuild,
5. new 02 sensor,
6. fresh knock sensor,
7. replaced the engine harness,
hope to have back together over the next couple of weeks.....
04-22-2016, 03:10 PM
#3
Pro
Thread Starter
yes... lots of money unnecessarily spent and i guess it is part of learning... i will be working with a couple friends with much more experience and specifically with 911 engines
and lots of time...
if we consider the first rebuild was poorly done by a race shop that assured me they knew what they were doing
plus my 3 attempts
plus a bunch of shop time trying to figure out issues
plus the latest...
maybe $20 plus grand if you count all the other maintenance...
and lots of time...
if we consider the first rebuild was poorly done by a race shop that assured me they knew what they were doing
plus my 3 attempts
plus a bunch of shop time trying to figure out issues
plus the latest...
maybe $20 plus grand if you count all the other maintenance...
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04-28-2016, 05:44 PM
#8
Pro
Thread Starter
use sealant as thread locker on case studs?
power steering pump rebuilt
moved all the bottom end parts into my kitchen as it is still a bit chilly to work in the garage... Toronto Spring this below seasonal temps....
using sanding block and 220 grit to remove the threebond 1184 that is very much stuck to the case.. also smoothing out a few gouges from last clean up of case.
removed all the studs from the case this time though...
was thinking to use threebond 1184 as a thread locker and sealer for the case studs in event that there is slight leak at the case and oil tries to seep past the case studs... anyone ever try this?
moved all the bottom end parts into my kitchen as it is still a bit chilly to work in the garage... Toronto Spring this below seasonal temps....
using sanding block and 220 grit to remove the threebond 1184 that is very much stuck to the case.. also smoothing out a few gouges from last clean up of case.
removed all the studs from the case this time though...
was thinking to use threebond 1184 as a thread locker and sealer for the case studs in event that there is slight leak at the case and oil tries to seep past the case studs... anyone ever try this?
05-26-2016, 03:05 PM
#10
Pro
Thread Starter
engine in but not running
stuff we've done since assembling the long block and top end
installed crankshaft with .50mm oversize bearings
crankshaft was off by 10 thou and straightened
sealed with yamabond 4
fresh set of cylinder jugs with proper sealing rings
forgot to install the exhaust ducts prior to installing the heads so had to stop, wait for new set of sealing rings and re do
timed the cams - close but not exactly on spec 1.26mm or about 49 thou
engine runs very nicely on hand cranking power
installed all the intake, fuel, oil lines
issues:
will not catch and run on its own
seems a bit tight
putts putts on starter power but backfires
i have a worn ignition switch and requires moving the key position a couple of mm back towards the rear once the engine starts - this allows all the accessories to run ie: exterior lights
stuff we tried:
index the distributor - set to tdc z1 mark on compress stroke and drop in the distributor, the rotors line up perfectly with the notches (perhaps a little to the left of the notches but cannot get any closer - either on the notches or off by 30 degrees left or right) - lots of back fire
swap around 180 degrees
gap the sensor - do our sensors show a little metal at the very end? gapped at .9mm more or less, using the glue a thin washer on the end to set gap, then tighten up and remove the washer method.
working with: fresh caps, rotors, wires, spark plugs
fresh ecu 'rebuild'
reference sensor a couple years old (replaced with the 996 part and oval connector)
throttle cable was not fully retracting and pressing on the wide open throttle, idle switch... adjusted but still a bit tight
next steps:
remove old fuel (since nov 2015) and replace with new
check grounds
double check all ignition timing related items
buy distributorless ignition! anyone use the compu-tronix system on 964 ?
look for suggestions from the forum
bang head on wall if all else fails
stuff we've done since assembling the long block and top end
installed crankshaft with .50mm oversize bearings
crankshaft was off by 10 thou and straightened
sealed with yamabond 4
fresh set of cylinder jugs with proper sealing rings
forgot to install the exhaust ducts prior to installing the heads so had to stop, wait for new set of sealing rings and re do
timed the cams - close but not exactly on spec 1.26mm or about 49 thou
engine runs very nicely on hand cranking power
installed all the intake, fuel, oil lines
issues:
will not catch and run on its own
seems a bit tight
putts putts on starter power but backfires
i have a worn ignition switch and requires moving the key position a couple of mm back towards the rear once the engine starts - this allows all the accessories to run ie: exterior lights
stuff we tried:
index the distributor - set to tdc z1 mark on compress stroke and drop in the distributor, the rotors line up perfectly with the notches (perhaps a little to the left of the notches but cannot get any closer - either on the notches or off by 30 degrees left or right) - lots of back fire
swap around 180 degrees
gap the sensor - do our sensors show a little metal at the very end? gapped at .9mm more or less, using the glue a thin washer on the end to set gap, then tighten up and remove the washer method.
working with: fresh caps, rotors, wires, spark plugs
fresh ecu 'rebuild'
reference sensor a couple years old (replaced with the 996 part and oval connector)
throttle cable was not fully retracting and pressing on the wide open throttle, idle switch... adjusted but still a bit tight
next steps:
remove old fuel (since nov 2015) and replace with new
check grounds
double check all ignition timing related items
buy distributorless ignition! anyone use the compu-tronix system on 964 ?
look for suggestions from the forum
bang head on wall if all else fails
05-26-2016, 04:17 PM
#11
Three Wheelin'
"using sanding block and 220 grit to remove the threebond 1184 that is very much stuck to the case.. also smoothing out a few gouges from last clean up of case."
Sanding on the case half mating surface? The case wasn't hot-tanked?
With all of the crank issues, did you plasti-gauge the bearings and test fit the halves? Did the crank spin smoothly by hand before rods were attached?
What is the story on the "rebuilt" ecu?
I would not add more complexity -aftermarket ignition changes- until you at least have it running in the present configuration. Adapting a dizzy-less ignition with the motronic will not be trivial.
After it's running, with a 4.0 you're going to need larger injectors, a chip to run them, and fuel and timing tweaks. A wideband wouldn't be a bad idea. Odds are high of going lean on stock injectors.
Sanding on the case half mating surface? The case wasn't hot-tanked?
With all of the crank issues, did you plasti-gauge the bearings and test fit the halves? Did the crank spin smoothly by hand before rods were attached?
What is the story on the "rebuilt" ecu?
I would not add more complexity -aftermarket ignition changes- until you at least have it running in the present configuration. Adapting a dizzy-less ignition with the motronic will not be trivial.
After it's running, with a 4.0 you're going to need larger injectors, a chip to run them, and fuel and timing tweaks. A wideband wouldn't be a bad idea. Odds are high of going lean on stock injectors.
05-26-2016, 05:23 PM
#12
Addict
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
I was initially confused by the thread title too, but Alex is referring to this as being the 'fourth' rebuild, and not an increase in engine displacement.
05-27-2016, 01:51 AM
#14
Pro
Thread Starter
sorry for the 4.0 confusion. .. i'll change the title. and would like to join the toronto964owners...
drained the gas out of the tank tonight and will try with fresh gas this weekend.
drained the gas out of the tank tonight and will try with fresh gas this weekend.