Notices
928 Forum 1978-1995
Sponsored by:
Sponsored by: 928 Specialists

Greg Brown Vs Mark Kibort THE CHALLENGE AGREED TO!

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old 10-04-2015, 12:08 AM
  #151  
Daniel5691
Rennlist Member
 
Daniel5691's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 3,128
Received 235 Likes on 140 Posts
Default

Daniel5691 is offline  
Old 10-04-2015, 12:14 AM
  #152  
jej3
Three Wheelin'
 
jej3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Jacksonville and sometimes St. Aug Beach, FL
Posts: 1,727
Received 342 Likes on 171 Posts
Default

Oh Dear Lord.... I've been off RL for a couple months and I don't know if it is comforting that Kibort never changes or more reason to walk away for another couple of months.

If I'm in the minority of owners that DO NOT CARE about what fantastic information Mark K has to share about Amsoil, stock engines being pushed to their limits on race tracks or his generally trying to disprove fact, I am sorry.

I'll share Greg's "Please make him stop" because SERIOUSLY.... PLEASE. MAKE. HIM. STOP.
jej3 is offline  
Old 10-04-2015, 12:16 AM
  #153  
Alan
Electron Wrangler
Lifetime Rennlist
Member
 
Alan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Phoenix AZ
Posts: 13,432
Received 429 Likes on 292 Posts
Default

Greg - its much easier when all the thread pages look like this:

I do highly recommend it - it has made my rennlist experience more enjoyable by far...

Alan
Attached Images  
Alan is offline  
Old 10-04-2015, 11:55 AM
  #154  
GlenL
Nordschleife Master
 
GlenL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Minneapolis, Minnesota
Posts: 7,661
Received 32 Likes on 26 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by mark kibort
No I do not think long accelerations hurt the engines. the G loading is so low that it approximates the longest slow accelerations from a stop to 70mph during street driving. and even if you were correct, the fact that most of our use in racing DOES take the engine to redline in 3rd gear and near 5700-6000rpm in 4th gear as at laguna main straight and especially thunderhill main and back straight.
That pattern is not hard use. My #1 track uses its full NHRA strip as the straight and it's a 70MPH to 145MPH blast of 3-4-5 and then there's a long sweeper. It is very different and more demanding than the tracks you drive.

Originally Posted by mark kibort
because the "scalar" g forces go down proportional to speed, you only need the same acceleration rate at half the speed 120 vs 60mph , to experience the same g forces , and since this force required at the engine goes down as speed goes down but is kept constant at the tires, you can go from 0 to 70mph over a much longer time, and create the same oil moving g forces. (and at the same RPM levels if desired)
Mark, this isn't correct. I also don't think you understand the difference between a scalar and a vector. A scalar is just a number; it's a magnitude. A vector is a magnitude plus a direction. You asked if a "g isn't a g" and direction is why it matters. This led to my discussion of vehicle acceleration versus cornering. What direction is the oil moving as it resists the acceleration vector being applied to it?

Originally Posted by mark kibort
plus, if you do a test with a stock oil pan and see the how little the oil can move with the small g forces available at WOT in 3rd gear and especially 4th gear, you would see that its unlilkely that this condition would have any effect in "uncovering " the oil pool from the oil pick up ladle.
Mark, I did this in a numerical simulation. Cars can do 1g laterally (some more, some less). What is the acceleration axially (fore/aft) that pushes the oil backwards? What is the force pulling the oil forwards? When is the backwards force greater than the force pulling the oil down the oil pan back into the sump?

In my car running at WOT, the oil does not flow down the pan until sometime in 5th gear. So how much is being pumped out of the sump? How much simply rolls back out of the sump? And then the money questions:

When accelerating straight ahead, does the pickup get uncovered or suck foam?
Does the foam created in long accelerations get sucked in at the next corner?

I've got graphs of this and know it's a problem. That's why I enjoy knowing I've got the super-cool Ishihara-Johnson windage kit in the bottom of my engine. All those fingers, scrapers, and baffles include a cover for the sump and moving trap doors that keep oil in the sump. Power ON: oil stays in the sump. Power OFF: oil rushes in.

I'd need to dig through records to see how many track hours I've got since my rod bearing failure. It's a lot. It's more than any other 928 in my area. (I'm excluding Wisconsin. Those boys are crazy.)

Originally Posted by mark kibort
the good news the fastest way around the turn which is constant speed is to be in the sweet spot of the bottom of the Hp curve so you can accelerate out and not burn a shift by being too high. obviously, this means running sweepers not at near max RPM .
Gosh, Mark, cut loose and say it: the sweet spot is at the top of the TORQUE curve. The bottom of the HP curve is idle speed.


And, Alan, that's just mean. I've got plenty of people on ignore. I choose to just ignore them.
GlenL is offline  
Old 10-04-2015, 11:57 AM
  #155  
The Fixer
Drifting
 
The Fixer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Pennsyltucky
Posts: 2,453
Likes: 0
Received 6 Likes on 6 Posts
Default

[QUOTE=jej3;12642422]Oh Dear Lord.... I've been off RL for a couple months and I don't know if it is comforting that Kibort never changes or more reason to walk away for another couple of months.

+1, What a bore already. Egos run-a-muck. Big fish in little pond.

Going to watch the news now.

Last edited by The Fixer; 10-04-2015 at 12:01 PM. Reason: punctuation
The Fixer is offline  
Old 10-04-2015, 02:24 PM
  #156  
The Fixer
Drifting
 
The Fixer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Location: Pennsyltucky
Posts: 2,453
Likes: 0
Received 6 Likes on 6 Posts
Default

1 more thing that has occurred to me for a long time regarding the "big names" mentioned here.

They never stop in to a guys thread that's restoring their car or making a repair and say "Good Job" or "Nice Work". Unless they want to sell something..

If it's Not about Their career, their legendary lap time or "better" product

They're just absent.
The Fixer is offline  
Old 10-04-2015, 03:01 PM
  #157  
Randy V
Addict
Lifetime Rennlist
Member
 
Randy V's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Insane Diego, California
Posts: 40,449
Received 98 Likes on 66 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by mark kibort
stop the trolling...
Pot meet kettle.

Randy V is offline  
Old 10-04-2015, 04:13 PM
  #158  
Jaeger
Advanced
 
Jaeger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 63
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default

Didn't others start this argument with Mark Kibort on Rennlist? so then its festering in mark for some time, insulting him for quite some time, and so it becomes like a western duel.

And yes naturally its tied into ego and the harm to one's ego and to a subject that they take quite seriously or did at some point, and nobody wants to be belittled. I think they should go at it on the track and then everyone can at the end stop acting all high and mighty and see the different strengths each driver and car has in this race, learn to be noble winners and graceful losers. God knows the world could use a lot more of them. And losing is a great way to learn how to improve one's self.
Jaeger is offline  
Old 10-04-2015, 05:52 PM
  #159  
Charles Parkinson
Instructor
 
Charles Parkinson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Back in Australia
Posts: 148
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default

Rob, does that make you feel better about yourself.... were you pushed around in school? if so, we will be your friend here and you can feel safe... we will protect you.

Daniel... that goes for you too!
MK - Full a#$hole marks for that one. I have seen numerous posts from you over the last decade that make similar statements to people who disagree with you and interestingly, they always seem to be people who have done a *lot* to help others on the board over the years. Having a dig like that at one of the boards most helpful members is a new low.

Perhaps you had the best years of your life being a high school bully - and before you assume I'm a "little man" etc, I jammed plenty of other kids heads down the toilet at school etc - but I knew when it was time to grow up and stop being an a#$hole.

Have a lovely day.
Charles Parkinson is offline  
Old 10-04-2015, 06:19 PM
  #160  
SeanR
Rennlist Member
 
SeanR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 35,700
Received 501 Likes on 267 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by Charles Parkinson
MK - Full a#$hole marks for that one. I have seen numerous posts from you over the last decade that make similar statements to people who disagree with you and interestingly, they always seem to be people who have done a *lot* to help others on the board over the years. Having a dig like that at one of the boards most helpful members is a new low.

Perhaps you had the best years of your life being a high school bully - and before you assume I'm a "little man" etc, I jammed plenty of other kids heads down the toilet at school etc - but I knew when it was time to grow up and stop being an a#$hole.

Have a lovely day.
Which is why he gets very few responses to his technical questions. Fun to watch though.
SeanR is offline  
Old 10-04-2015, 06:51 PM
  #161  
Rob Edwards
Archive Gatekeeper
Rennlist Member
 
Rob Edwards's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Irvine, CA
Posts: 17,649
Received 2,817 Likes on 1,376 Posts
Default

Meh, I was being a snarky jerk and MK was slinging it back, deserved on my part. For every snarky thing I actually post, there are about 10 compositions that get deleted instead of posted. Shoulda taken the high road and done that here.

Though I do think the pscychology study is amusing.
Rob Edwards is online now  
Old 10-04-2015, 06:59 PM
  #162  
yardpro
Rennlist Member
 
yardpro's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Morehead City NC
Posts: 1,955
Likes: 0
Received 18 Likes on 16 Posts
Default

This threads is like all the others.... Especially the Hp vs torque debate.....
yardpro is offline  
Old 10-04-2015, 07:17 PM
  #163  
ltoolio
Rennlist Member
 
ltoolio's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Lisle, IL
Posts: 1,415
Received 3 Likes on 2 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by yardpro
This threads is like all the others.... Especially the Hp vs torque debate.....
I still haven't heard a clear statement as to which oil is best to use under these racing circumstances.
ltoolio is offline  
Old 10-04-2015, 08:41 PM
  #164  
mklaskin
Drifting
 
mklaskin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Winnetka, IL.
Posts: 2,638
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by yardpro
This threads is like all the others.... Especially the Hp vs torque debate.....
Did you ever read the "braking into turn 2 at Laguna" thread?
mklaskin is offline  
Old 10-05-2015, 12:29 AM
  #165  
mark kibort
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
 
mark kibort's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: saratoga, ca
Posts: 29,953
Received 170 Likes on 66 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by Charles Parkinson
MK - Full a#$hole marks for that one. I have seen numerous posts from you over the last decade that make similar statements to people who disagree with you and interestingly, they always seem to be people who have done a *lot* to help others on the board over the years. Having a dig like that at one of the boards most helpful members is a new low.

Perhaps you had the best years of your life being a high school bully - and before you assume I'm a "little man" etc, I jammed plenty of other kids heads down the toilet at school etc - but I knew when it was time to grow up and stop being an a#$hole.

Have a lovely day.
Rob knows this, and you should too.... i always keep my discussions on track, unless im insulted, then i dont.. I usually am known to fire back with the same measured response. usually those that insult, have the small mans complex, or just doing it for laughs. I have no problem with the later. I dont think a lot of guys here have grown up to your self proclaimed standards... Now, did you not read all that Rob had posted?
usually, people do mock what they dont understand. its no different around here and i get that.
I use this place to help and to learn... others are here for other reasons and thats ok.. i have a thick skin!
mark kibort is offline  


Quick Reply: Greg Brown Vs Mark Kibort THE CHALLENGE AGREED TO!



All times are GMT -3. The time now is 06:00 PM.