manitou202

Is anyone aware of upcoming Taycan track tests?

Obviously we have the Porsche Nurburgring results, but I'd still like to see the Taycan on a more typical track. Ideally something with a lot of historical data. I have a feeling it will crush a lot of times on a smaller track with lower top speeds.

JayGT4

Not many from US tracks so far but I'm curious to see how it'll do at tracks with a lot of comparison data - Laguna Seca, Willow Springs, VIR, etc.

daveo4porsche

you will need fast charging near/@ the track - energy use is going to be epic! I used 60% battery in ONE 25 minute session with my other EV - mechanically i expect the taycan to do well - but there will be some energy planning logistics - L2 charging at 9.6 kW isnt goint to do it for a track day

daveo4porsche

quick survey of tracks vs. fast charging logistics (my criteria is at least 100 kW - 50 kW is too slow)

• Thunderhill Hill - feasible - 350 kW fast charging 7 miles from track - that means 10 min to charger - 30 min charge - 10 min back - probably run two sessions in the morning and two in the afternoon - fast charge again before going home
• Autoclub speedway - feasible - 350 kW fast charging less than 8 miles from the track
• The Thermal Club - feasible - 350 kW fast charging less than 15 miles from the track
• Daytona - feasible - 350 kW fast charger 5.9 miles from the track
• Roebling Road - feasible - 350 kW fast charger 9.2 miles from the track
• Virgina International Raceway - mixed bag - closest fast charging is an unreliable 25 kW fast charging station - but it's super close only 0.5 miles!!!
• Laguna Seca - awkward - closest faster chargers are > 11.3 miles away (but a 25 min drive each way) - and only 50 kW
• Pocono Raceway - awkward - 350 kW fast charging 29 miles from the track
• Sonoma Raceway - awkward - closest fast chargers are EVGo 50 kW - 10 miles away very congested highways to get there
• Circuit of the Americas - awkward & risky - single 62.5 kW fast charger 8.6 miles from the track
• Miller motorsports track - awkward - 50 kW fast chargers 7.7 miles from the track
• Portland International Raceway - awkward - 50 kW fast chargers less than 5 miles from the track
• Summit Point Motorsports Park - awkward - 150 kW fast chargers 21.5 miles from the track
• Buttonwillow - awkward - Chargepoint 50 kW @ starbucks listed in chargepoint app - reliability unknown at this time
• Willow Springs - very awkward - closest working fast charges 20 miles from track - figure 30 min each way just in travel time & 25 kW max power
• Chuckwalla - very awkward - 50 kW fast charger about 30 miles from the track
• Limerock - infeasible - no fast charging remotely near the track
• New Jersey Motorsports Park - infeasible - no fast charging remotely near the track
• Watkin's Glenn - infeasible - no fast charging remotely near the track
• Barber motorsports - infeasible - no fast charging remotely near the track
• Spring Mountain Motorsports Clug - infeasible - no fast charging remotely near the track
• Mid-Ohio - infeasible - no fast charging remotely near the track
• Road America - infeasible - no fast charging remotely near the track
• Palmbeach International Raceyway - infeasible - no fast charging remotely near the track
• Seabring Raceway - infeasible - no fast charging remotely near the track
• Oregon Raceway Park - infeasible - no fast charging remotely near the track
• The Ridge Motorsports Park - infeasible - no fast charging remotely near the track
• Pittsburg International Race Complex - infeasible - no fast charging remotely near the track

daveo4porsche

Anatomy of a track day with an EV…

The enemy of a track day for EV's is power consumption - your battery that will get you 200-300 miles at normal highways speeds will deplete at a rate of about 50% charge for 1 20 minute session - so power management is the major watchword of the day.

Now many many tracks have NEMA 14-50 RV hook ups and these can help - but are no where near sufficient to replinish the power your used while on track between sessions. So a good reliable and accessible fast charging solution is required if you want to track your EV for more than 2 20 minute sessions and then still be able to drive it home.

The basic plan is as follows:

• Drive to Hotel night before
• Plan to charge to 100% so you leave for the track "full" in the morning - combination of fast charging and L1/L2 charging overnight to have the car full in the morning
• Drive to track as gingerly as possible to use as little power as possible - measure your usage to the track - you'll need this much "buffer" to return to the fast charger later in the day
• arrive right when gates open
• stake out a spot w/NEMA 14-50 charger
• plug-in the car and begin charging to refill the mornings drive while you unpack the car and drivers meeting
• plan so that you can out on track for session #1 at or near 100% charge
• have fun
• don't focus on session duration - focus on consumption - come in from session 1 at 55 to 45% charge
• plug into the NEMA 14-50 to maximize your charge between sessions
• Session #2 - again have fun - push the car safely - and come in when you are approaching your "buffer" battery to get to the closest fast charger
• Drive slowly to the fast charger
• Plug into a fast charger - top the battery off to 80 or preferably nearly 100%
• drive back to the race track
• do sessions 3 & 4 in the afternoon if you can and based on battery usage, trickle charge the car on NEMA 14-50 between session
• come in from last session
• plug in the car while you pack up and get the car ready for the drive home
• swing by the fast charger on the way out of town to top off for the drive home
• drive as normal home using fast chargers as necessary to reach your destination

the Taycan is perhaps the best EV track car on the market today due to it's industry leading 270 kW fast charging rate - if you achieve that here is a concrete example of a day @ thunderhill

1. fast charge the night before to 100% @ EA 350 kW charger @ Walmart in Willows, CA
2. Drive to Holiday Inn Express - using about 2% battery
3. Sleep overnight
4. Drive slowly from HIE to Thunderhill using another 8% battery
5. Arrive at track right as gates open @ 7 am
6. Park next to one of many NEMA 14-50 RV hook ups -plug in the car
7. Unpack, get the car ready - attend driver's meeting
8. 1st session 9 am or 10 am - with 2 or 3 hours paddock time you should be able to reach 100% battery for your 1st session
9. Grid up for 1st session - drive on track - target coming in at close to 50% battery
10. come in and quickly plug-in to NEMA 14-50 - this should be able to restore 4-7% battery before session #2
11. 2nd Session - go on track have fun - be aware you're going to be down below 20% battery at the end of the session
12. come in around 10% battery to have enough charge to reach the Walmart
13. come off track drive directly to the Walmart - 15 minutes
14. The Taycan @ 270 kW can reach 80% charge in 22 min - but stay another 15-20 min to get close to 100%
15. drive back to thunderhill slowly to preserve battery charge - 15 minutes
16. total time for the fast charging session 30 minute driving + 40 min charge session - 70 minutes
17. arrive back at track - plug into NEMA 14-50 to trickle charge before session #3
18. Session #3 use 1/2 remaining battery
19. 14-50 charge again between session #3 & #4
20. Drive Session #4 - come in when you're at like 10% battery
21. park the car - plug it in to charge while packing up
22. Drive back to walmart in Willows, fast charge as necessary to reach your destination.

basically if the fast charger is close enough and powerful enough you should be able to do 2 sessions in the morning - charge over lunch - and 2 sessions in the afternoon - and fast charge once again to get home. The slower and farther away from the track the fast charger is the more tenious this plan becomes, although you should be able to do 3 sessions…even if the charger is slow/far form the track -because all that means is your lunchtime charging session takes longer…

for fast charging during a track day you need to consider the following:

• can you actually use the fast charger you plan to use - some business restrict usage
• how reliable is the charger - if it's offline/broken a lot (plugshare reliability rating) - it's effectively not an asset and you can't rely on it
  • are there recent check'ins where someone reported successful charging - or is the last checkin from Jun. 16th, 2017
• how likely is it going to activate with out a phone call - you can easily lose 20 minutes on the phone with helpful customer service representative trying to remotely activate your charger because the point of sale system at the charger isn't functional
• how many stalls are there - single stall chargers are very very high risk - congestion is an issue - you don't want to be on a schedule to get back to the track and arrive at the fast charger with the 1 or 2 stalls occupied
• do you have a history with this fast charger? have you personally seen it delivery close to it's maximum rate - I often show up at 125 kW or 50 kW fast charger and never see anywhere close to the maximum charge rate - test the fast charger before you are at the track the next day - measure it's capabilities
  • test the charge rate - that way you'll have an idea how long your charging session will take
• are there amenities near the charge, can you walk and get food and bathroom while your EV is charging - is there good cell coverage or wifi

I'm very excited about the Taycan - it's superior charge rate of 270 kW means that _IF_ you can find a 350 kW charger near your favorite track it's entirely feasible for a reasonable 20-40 min charging session to get you to 90-100% battery during a track day - meaning you can probably run 4 sessions at a normal track event. That would be great and not terribly inconvenient - but a PITA compared to a gas car.

whiz944

Buttonwillow Raceway shouldn't be too bad when the Buttonwillow Chargepoint station is completed. There already is a 50 kW CHAdeMO at Lost Hills, and a Supercharger site in Buttonwillow proper. Of course then it becomes an issue of capacity, as racers will have to compete with I-5 travelers for stalls.

daveo4porsche

here is the math on a Taycan at Thunderhill - green boxes are user entered data - blue boxes are calculated

Assumptions:
84 kWh usable on the Taycan
3.06 miles/kWh consumption from the article posted that blew away the EPA range numbers - I use this consumption to calculate the "reserve" I need to have to drive from the track to the fast charger

so if you start out your first track sessions at 98% battery
and there is 55 minutes between sessions to charge on the NEMA 14-50 @ thunder hill - you can add back in 8.4% battery between session 1 & 2
that increases our usable "battery" on track to 51.6% that I can use for each session (let's call it 52%)

start at:
Session 1 start: 98%
Session 1 end: 47%
Charge for 55 min: 47% + 8% = 55% (NEMA 14-50 @ 204 volts @ 40 amps - observed rates from actual RV hook up at thunder hill @ 95% charger L2 efficiency)
Session 2 start: 55%
Session 2 end: 4%
Drive to Fast Charger - arrive @ 1% battery left when you plug in.

calculations below.

daveo4porsche

@ 43.399 kWh used per session - a 50 kW CCS charger at the track could replenish that in one hour between sessions - the question is with the Taycan is 43.399 kwh a 15 minute track session or 20 minute track session - we do not yet have track consumption data metrics.

my Model 3 used 60% battery in a 25 minutes on track - or about 45 kWh

if a track had a 50, 75, 100, or 125 kW charger you could probably run all day at a track event as long as there was at least 40 minutes between sessions.

daveo4porsche

basically a NEMA 14-50 plug can recover about 10.85% battery per hour of charge on the Taycan - assumptions are full 9,600 watts (240 volts @ 40 amps) and 95% L2 efficiency - while the plug delivers 9,600 watts with 95% efficiency only 9,160 watts lands in the the battery - the rest is lost to charging overhead…

now I rarely see 240 volts @ RV hook ups at tracks - it's normally more like 202 volts @ 40 amps - which is 8,080 watts - and 8,080 * 95% is 7,676 landing in the battery - or about 9.13% of a Taycan battery per-hour of charge…

that means if go out on track and use 50% battery - you have to charge for 5.47 hours to get back what you spent on track

you can plan to recover 9% Taycan battery per-hour charging on a NEMA 14-50 at the track - so plan your track usage appropriately -and it's entirely reasonable to use 40-60% battery in one track session - so you're going to need some fast charging - the L2 40 amp charger at the track isn't going to do it.

umwolverine

My guess if you plan to track the Taycan and really push it on it's summer tires, you'll be lucky to get one weekend of time. On a rough track, they'll be shot after a day.

Drifting

Yep, even with a Porsche, tracking a BEV looks to be a hassle. I could live with charging it once over lunch, but not after almost every session. Will stick with the GT3.

AlexCeres

Chris Harris said they had to replace the tires after 3 power slides. He comes out and says the worst thing about the car is that tires can’t handle it’s awesomeness.

various cheeses

Weighs more than a Cayenne, with loads more torque. Tires can only do so much. EVs will have a hard time on the track until the weight comes down.

evanevery

Not looking for an argument, but if you are thinking about WHEN you charge at the track, I think you have the wrong perspective...

The car should ALWAYS be plugged in while not actually on the track. The best way to get maximum EV functionality is to always have it plugged in when not in use. So its not so much WHEN you charge the vehicle, it how long you have between sessions to re-charge. We have at least one actual EV charger at our track (Autobahn) and several Nema 14-50 outlets around the paddock for RV's (as most tracks do). Our sessions run 20-25 minutes and can have anywhere from an hour to two between run classes. My challenge will be that I'm about 120 miles from the club so I will arrive pretty well depleted before I even get started! (I have a race trailer for my M4 track car but I'm planning on driving the TurboS to the track and probably stay a night or two with a full track day in between...)

Pneumonicflyer

Anyone has actual trackability feedback this season? Looking at wear and tear on expendables and charge depletion.