suicide doors?
08-20-2018, 02:34 PM
#16
Rennlist Member
I have read in the past that a floor mounted battery in addition to being a good place for weight given COG issues - but the battery itself is a large mass and can easily be made into. structural mass - actually enhancing the car's stiffness and structural integrity in the event of side impact - Tesla spoke at length about the the advantages of the battery for side impact in reducing intrusion distances due to it's low position in the car and ability to absorb energy during an impact....
perhaps Porsche will surprise us and have real suicide doors and excellent side impact behavior - if they are able to pull that off it will be due turning lemons into lemonade - i.e. using a low mounted high mass object to beef up the structural integrity to the point where a B-pillar is not necessary....
it will be interesting to see if that happens - my SWAG however is still officially no suicide doors and a normal car "B" pillar…
perhaps Porsche will surprise us and have real suicide doors and excellent side impact behavior - if they are able to pull that off it will be due turning lemons into lemonade - i.e. using a low mounted high mass object to beef up the structural integrity to the point where a B-pillar is not necessary....
it will be interesting to see if that happens - my SWAG however is still officially no suicide doors and a normal car "B" pillar…
08-20-2018, 02:48 PM
#17
Instructor
Even with 2 door handles, you've got 2 people needing to be in 1 spot to get into the car. Its an annoyance in real life situations, particularly in tight/regular parking spaces.
The ingress/egress of suicide doors is just kind of awkward as a whole. The rear door needs to be fully open to facilitate entry/exit (the passengers *** is near the door rather than away from it as such in the front door) which just isn't super practical real world.
I'm much more worried about the rest of the car looking like the prototype (i.e. front fenders, overall roofline shape); the suicide doors are the least of my worries personally.
The ingress/egress of suicide doors is just kind of awkward as a whole. The rear door needs to be fully open to facilitate entry/exit (the passengers *** is near the door rather than away from it as such in the front door) which just isn't super practical real world.
I'm much more worried about the rest of the car looking like the prototype (i.e. front fenders, overall roofline shape); the suicide doors are the least of my worries personally.
08-20-2018, 03:43 PM
#18
RL Community Team
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Originally Posted by daveo4porsche
i]I think this is what some of us are hoping for![/i]
Having lived for one weekend with these doors on an i3 I would say I would have serious reservations about buying the vehicle with these. They are that much of a pain for me. I have two kids and use the rear doors frequently.
08-20-2018, 03:48 PM
#19
RL Community Team
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Originally Posted by Hansel
Even with 2 door handles, you've got 2 people needing to be in 1 spot to get into the car. Its an annoyance in real life situations, particularly in tight/regular parking spaces.
The ingress/egress of suicide doors is just kind of awkward as a whole. The rear door needs to be fully open to facilitate entry/exit (the passengers *** is near the door rather than away from it as such in the front door) which just isn't super practical real world.
I'm much more worried about the rest of the car looking like the prototype (i.e. front fenders, overall roofline shape); the suicide doors are the least of my worries personally.
The ingress/egress of suicide doors is just kind of awkward as a whole. The rear door needs to be fully open to facilitate entry/exit (the passengers *** is near the door rather than away from it as such in the front door) which just isn't super practical real world.
I'm much more worried about the rest of the car looking like the prototype (i.e. front fenders, overall roofline shape); the suicide doors are the least of my worries personally.
08-20-2018, 05:20 PM
#20
3rd Gear
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Here in Dubai, there can only be one company operating a brand's dealership. That being said, they can't take a deposit this early and I've registered an interest in the vehicle. My SA expects the car to be unveiled at the Geneva Motor Show and I'll be able to order the car in February. If the car's like the spy shots, I'm not gonna be getting the car. Tbh, this may seem petty but I kinda want the suicide doors; with or without the B pillars.
In conclusion, I want the concept Taycan...not the Nurburgring testing one.
In conclusion, I want the concept Taycan...not the Nurburgring testing one.
08-22-2018, 04:06 PM
#22
Addict
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The test mules have conventional B pillar, no suicides......the test mules are the car.
It'as fun to keep seeing pics of the 2015 design study though........beautiful.
It'as fun to keep seeing pics of the 2015 design study though........beautiful.
08-24-2018, 03:45 PM
#23
Here’s some more photos of the test mules:
https://carbuzz.com/news/take-a-firs...porsche-taycan
It’s clear these things are nowhere near production ready. Definitely still in the test mule stage for EV power, drivetrain and chassis. At least it has a cupholder for the test drivers!
https://carbuzz.com/news/take-a-firs...porsche-taycan
It’s clear these things are nowhere near production ready. Definitely still in the test mule stage for EV power, drivetrain and chassis. At least it has a cupholder for the test drivers!
08-24-2018, 04:37 PM
#24
Addict
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The interior of mules is usually 'utility'.
I'll be very, very, surprised if the bodies of all those mules turns out to be totally different than the final product. Hope I'm wrong.
Summer last year Blume said the 'design is fixed'.......October or so we started seeing the first couple black test mules.....then more and more..
I'll be very, very, surprised if the bodies of all those mules turns out to be totally different than the final product. Hope I'm wrong.
Summer last year Blume said the 'design is fixed'.......October or so we started seeing the first couple black test mules.....then more and more..
08-27-2018, 09:35 PM
#25
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Yup, not a thing. I love the concept, but reality is that very few modern cars have suicide doors, primarily for safety reasons. I suspect Porsche used them on the concept as a way to highlight the interior design, without a plan to ever bring them to production.
I’ve wondered if they had any idea how much interest the Mission E concept would generate and how many of us fell in love with the design. The 2015 reveal was both a blessing and a curse for them as that design, while beautiful, isn’t realistic for production. Here’s hoping the Taycan comes close!
I’ve wondered if they had any idea how much interest the Mission E concept would generate and how many of us fell in love with the design. The 2015 reveal was both a blessing and a curse for them as that design, while beautiful, isn’t realistic for production. Here’s hoping the Taycan comes close!
08-27-2018, 10:06 PM
#26
Pro
I’m not questioning the safety aspect but a practical explanation for why no suicide doors on modern cars is more likely found in the structural limitations of not having a B pillar. The Federal government, NHTSA, mandates that the roof structure for vehicles under 6,000 lbs GVWR be able to withstand a force 3x the unloaded weight of the vehicle. The Taycan is going to be a heavy car, by Porsche standards, so let’s say that roof has to withstand a force of 13,000 lbs. No B pillar... good luck with that. This is why new cars in the last decade have been designed with ridiculously oversized A pillars that often impede line of sight forward. Porsche has been using some really exotic Boron steel in the 911 but I suspect that what would have been required to do the suicide doors was beyond practical.
The safety issue is legitimate but this could easily be overcome by doors that do not unlock while in operation. There might be another mandate at the Federal level that restricts this, but the doors could also be designed to not allow the rear to open unless the front door is also opened... which brings up another point, I have never met someone who has suicide doors on a modern car (there are some) that has liked them. Everyone I have met, to a person, says they are really awkward to use.
The safety issue is legitimate but this could easily be overcome by doors that do not unlock while in operation. There might be another mandate at the Federal level that restricts this, but the doors could also be designed to not allow the rear to open unless the front door is also opened... which brings up another point, I have never met someone who has suicide doors on a modern car (there are some) that has liked them. Everyone I have met, to a person, says they are really awkward to use.
08-27-2018, 10:26 PM
#27
Track Day
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I’m not questioning the safety aspect but a practical explanation for why no suicide doors on modern cars is more likely found in the structural limitations of not having a B pillar. The Federal government, NHTSA, mandates that the roof structure for vehicles under 6,000 lbs GVWR be able to withstand a force 3x the unloaded weight of the vehicle. The Taycan is going to be a heavy car, by Porsche standards, so let’s say that roof has to withstand a force of 13,000 lbs. No B pillar... good luck with that. This is why new cars in the last decade have been designed with ridiculously oversized A pillars that often impede line of sight forward. Porsche has been using some really exotic Boron steel in the 911 but I suspect that what would have been required to do the suicide doors was beyond practical.
The safety issue is legitimate but this could easily be overcome by doors that do not unlock while in operation. There might be another mandate at the Federal level that restricts this, but the doors could also be designed to not allow the rear to open unless the front door is also opened... which brings up another point, I have never met someone who has suicide doors on a modern car (there are some) that has liked them. Everyone I have met, to a person, says they are really awkward to use.
The safety issue is legitimate but this could easily be overcome by doors that do not unlock while in operation. There might be another mandate at the Federal level that restricts this, but the doors could also be designed to not allow the rear to open unless the front door is also opened... which brings up another point, I have never met someone who has suicide doors on a modern car (there are some) that has liked them. Everyone I have met, to a person, says they are really awkward to use.
I also know that it can be annoying to open them, I guess I'm willing to deal with that (I think...!)
09-15-2018, 07:04 PM
#28
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Here in Dubai, there can only be one company operating a brand's dealership. That being said, they can't take a deposit this early and I've registered an interest in the vehicle. My SA expects the car to be unveiled at the Geneva Motor Show and I'll be able to order the car in February. If the car's like the spy shots, I'm not gonna be getting the car. Tbh, this may seem petty but I kinda want the suicide doors; with or without the B pillars.
In conclusion, I want the concept Taycan...not the Nurburgring testing one.
In conclusion, I want the concept Taycan...not the Nurburgring testing one.
09-15-2018, 10:44 PM
#29
Rennlist Member
@drives996 - there is less than a 1% chance you'll have suicide doors - so I'd start looking for GT3 now - why wait?
09-16-2018, 12:50 PM
#30
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Based upon what I'm reading in some of the other threads even with a B piller the doors seem equally unlikely. Would you mind if I bounce some GT3 questions off you privately?