Bore Scoring
07-14-2019, 08:08 AM
#1
Three Wheelin'
Thread Starter
Bore Scoring
When did all this "Bore Scoring" start?
Is it just a Porsche problem....I had never heard of this a few years ago...
Did this just start with the introduction of the water cooled engines?
Is it just a Porsche problem....I had never heard of this a few years ago...
Did this just start with the introduction of the water cooled engines?
07-14-2019, 10:32 AM
#2
Rennlist Member
There are many reasons for it. It’s all explains in the Flat6Innovations bore scoring series on YouTube. Do a search it’ll come up...
07-14-2019, 11:15 AM
#3
Rennlist Member
Subscribe to Jakes Rennvision video series on YouTube an get all the info one could ask for.
07-14-2019, 12:37 PM
#4
Rennlist Member
And it’s not just a Porsche thing. Someone here experienced the same with a Hyundai their daughter owned. I’m sure there are other marques plagued with it as well.
Last edited by jllphan; 07-14-2019 at 01:04 PM.
07-14-2019, 10:48 PM
#6
Seems like I've read from Jake that he states that the bore scoring problem is the #1 and oldest mode of failure. It's just now that our cars have hit the 20 year mark that more are showing their asses. As others have said, check out "Rennvision" on YouTube and search for bore scoring. Jake spells it out better than anyone. This problem no only affects the M96, but M97 and 9A1 cars too. Yep, that means even the 991 with Alusil can suffer from bore scoring.
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07-15-2019, 09:08 AM
#8
07-15-2019, 09:32 AM
#9
Rennlist Member
Your listening, lot better than most do like finding fault in how its diagnosis or symptoms are presented.
Sorry to read this earlier, but good to hear that your going to address it properly.
I don't think anyone "hyped" you into this problem, but with Jake's help you were able to diagnose it properly.
whether you used his shop or not is to me irrelevant. though I do think he is a honest and trust worthy vendor..
Mke
07-15-2019, 09:49 AM
#10
^^^Thanks Mike.
I guess it upsets me when somebody "insinuates" scoring is not a problem just a sales technique and if it does occur it's still not a problem. Scoring is a problem in any engine when/if it occurs. My previous profession was a manager with a major railroad supervising the maintenance/repair/overhaul of diesel locomotives. I cannot tell you how many power assemblies we changed due to scoring. If it was all just "hype" we could have saved millions in material/labor/downtime. It is NOT hype! I've seen what scored liners can do to large engines in my work career as well as smaller engines in my racing endeavors. I wouldn't want that to happen to any car I own.
I know there are people who have run scored liner engines for long periods of time by just adding oil. To me that's rolling the dice and creating more internal damage. If that is what they want it is their car/pocket book. To each their own and more power to them if it works out.
End of Rant
I guess it upsets me when somebody "insinuates" scoring is not a problem just a sales technique and if it does occur it's still not a problem. Scoring is a problem in any engine when/if it occurs. My previous profession was a manager with a major railroad supervising the maintenance/repair/overhaul of diesel locomotives. I cannot tell you how many power assemblies we changed due to scoring. If it was all just "hype" we could have saved millions in material/labor/downtime. It is NOT hype! I've seen what scored liners can do to large engines in my work career as well as smaller engines in my racing endeavors. I wouldn't want that to happen to any car I own.
I know there are people who have run scored liner engines for long periods of time by just adding oil. To me that's rolling the dice and creating more internal damage. If that is what they want it is their car/pocket book. To each their own and more power to them if it works out.
End of Rant
07-15-2019, 10:17 AM
#11
Who exactly are you referring to when you say aftermarket vendors that "hype" the problem? Millennium Technologies? LN Engineering? Hartech? Flat 6 Innovations?
Which one are you referring to?
07-15-2019, 10:21 AM
#12
^^^Thanks Mike.
I guess it upsets me when somebody "insinuates" scoring is not a problem just a sales technique and if it does occur it's still not a problem. Scoring is a problem in any engine when/if it occurs. My previous profession was a manager with a major railroad supervising the maintenance/repair/overhaul of diesel locomotives. I cannot tell you how many power assemblies we changed due to scoring. If it was all just "hype" we could have saved millions in material/labor/downtime. It is NOT hype! I've seen what scored liners can do to large engines in my work career as well as smaller engines in my racing endeavors. I wouldn't want that to happen to any car I own.
I know there are people who have run scored liner engines for long periods of time by just adding oil. To me that's rolling the dice and creating more internal damage. If that is what they want it is their car/pocket book. To each their own and more power to them if it works out.
End of Rant
I guess it upsets me when somebody "insinuates" scoring is not a problem just a sales technique and if it does occur it's still not a problem. Scoring is a problem in any engine when/if it occurs. My previous profession was a manager with a major railroad supervising the maintenance/repair/overhaul of diesel locomotives. I cannot tell you how many power assemblies we changed due to scoring. If it was all just "hype" we could have saved millions in material/labor/downtime. It is NOT hype! I've seen what scored liners can do to large engines in my work career as well as smaller engines in my racing endeavors. I wouldn't want that to happen to any car I own.
I know there are people who have run scored liner engines for long periods of time by just adding oil. To me that's rolling the dice and creating more internal damage. If that is what they want it is their car/pocket book. To each their own and more power to them if it works out.
End of Rant
I guess if we start talking about head cracks and intermix, it's all fair game to troll Len Hoffman and make him out as an opportunist? He doesn't even fool with forums and I'm sure someone would accuse him of over-hyping the problem.
07-15-2019, 10:32 AM
#13
Three Wheelin'
Thread Starter
Just seems "new" to me...
Every engine/transmission has it's problems....
The first I remember was back in the 70's with the BMW 2800 engines, Bavaria/3.0's)..they had an overheating problem (solved by having a larger/ more core radiator made) , and a cam problem on one of the cylinders....
Next I remember the early 911's had to have Hydraulic oil lines for the lifters added and a "pop off valve"for backfires
As far as transmissions go...THEY seem to be much improved and "bulletproof"
Now its IMS and Bore Scoring...whats next?
Every engine/transmission has it's problems....
The first I remember was back in the 70's with the BMW 2800 engines, Bavaria/3.0's)..they had an overheating problem (solved by having a larger/ more core radiator made) , and a cam problem on one of the cylinders....
Next I remember the early 911's had to have Hydraulic oil lines for the lifters added and a "pop off valve"for backfires
As far as transmissions go...THEY seem to be much improved and "bulletproof"
Now its IMS and Bore Scoring...whats next?
07-15-2019, 10:40 AM
#14
Rennlist Member
That's it, just bury your head in the sand and pretend it's not making that "lifter noise"... Oh did I roll my eyes yet? 
07-15-2019, 10:50 AM
#15
The sky is not falling. These are great cars. Yes, they have their problems, but if you use good situation awareness and sound preventive measures, you'll get years of reliable use. I don't have time to get wrapped up in forum/vendor drama, but still wise enough to listen to trustworthy sources of information. After much research, I recognized that the plain bearing IMS design of the Mezger engine was superior to the sealed ball bearing that Porsche used in the M96/M97 engines. Therefore, I didn't mess around and had it changed out with the IMS Solution along with the RMS and AOS. I plan to do the same about the other known wear parts that could lead to serious engine problems.