Ranfurly

I think Porsche has dug itself a big hole in its User base.
SUV = family
New 911 = 60+ owner

All you need to do is to look at Giltrap forecourt to know where the market has gone.

PDK is a reality of who drives the car, and traffic conditions.

Porsche needs to produce a stripped back car that allows a transition into ownership.

2 cents worth that may be off the mark.

Cheers
Richard

O2GO

Enjoyed a catchup read on here. My big question is for Dave. Is your garage floor painted now? <grin>
I'm absent from NITT this year but coming on the SITT. Havent been to a track day in a while as I've been preferring back road runs.
I navigated on the TargaNZ rally 2 weeks ago for Mark H in his 1984 Carrera 3.2 race car. Starting at Hampton Downs and ending up 750km of closed road stages later in Wellington. I really enjoyed it. In the older car we are not crazy fast getting air over humps like the main field so its much more relaxed. Were slow so in the first 10 cars to leave on each stage and less likely to suffer from a stage closing due to accidents. The 3.2 was faultless after 12 targas and a life of racing apart from blowing a guage fuse and loosing our instruments. After that stage we agreed it was even more fun, another challebge thrown at us and we were left to simply read the road and drive.

O2GO

In the post above i tried to correct a typo and accidentally hit the tick to post.... The TargaNZ tour was popular. I didnt count but it felt like 50 cars. The rally was down on numbers, 48. It is going to the South Island every 4 years and will be there next October. Fast open roads and a different proposition. Some participants are happy others less so. To me there are a couple of SI stages which are just amazing. Crown Range and Q'town to Glenorchy (provided they are in again).
This year one GT4 had an off and was then followed and crashed into. We saw tte car that hit it and it was substantially munted. A real bugger and likely a write off of both.
All the best for the NITT. I was tempted but are saving myself for the SITT in March LOL. Looking forward to visiting Kaikoura onour way down in early Feb. we leave the car in Qtown for 3 weeks and fly home (to work sadly).

Pel

True, had not looked at the pricing, I assumed it would be the cheapest 911 available, yep saving 20kg is not enough, for me, what puts me off new cars is all the tech cluttering in the centre console, it becomes redundant too quickly, admittedly a plastic parcel tray in place of PCCM is what drew my attention to the T. Obviously asking more whilst giving less is understandable in a GT3 however asking more whilst only offering up 20kg less doesn't stack.

I must say im in a bit of a hole at present, have been looking round for a new car but nothing takes my fancy. I sold the GT4 as coming from a 996GT3 it didnt feel "special" enough. I could jump back into my old GT3 but at 125k the price delta to a new Carrera is 50k, under warranty and no deferred maintenece lurking, however like the GT4, its a new car and probably not special enough haha.

Still really enjoying my SC, had a fantastic Raglan drive, ran perfectly. Chasing Jake & Sam on the run back had me sweating, hugely rewarding, however at 180hp I wish it had a bit more shove sometimes, being 6ft plus with a full cage, harnesses etc is a pain in the backside to get in and out.

Took a Megane for a run Friday, fantastic bang for buck, seriously thinking about picking one up tomorrow to run on SITT over a Porsche, mods are reasonable too (bolt in half cage 595gbp). Mark what do you think of the Megane comparitive to your Focus?

Could be wrong but I think comparatively, a new 911 has never been cheaper, I remember my old boy purchased a new 930 Targa Turbo in the 80's, cost the same as an Auckland house.

Not sure what a base Cayman costs (120k?), ive got a guy renting off me who spent nearly 90k on a kitted out Ford Ranger, not his work car either, go figure...

Kudos to Mark & Yourself, 180kph in the old girl on Tarmac must feel flipping fast.

John McM

I didn’t realise Targa was in the South Island next year. It will have to be 2019 for me.

O2GO

John are you thinking of doing a Targa Tour? They run 2-3 rally's per year, 1-2 x 2 day events (South Auckland/Rotorua/BOP plus the big 5 day one in October.

John McM

Yes, the big 5 day one. Run up the back of the classic group, probably in the Silver C4 as it has a few stone chips already.

Maxem

Hi Doug, unfortunately not. Going to get a new concrete floor first and the main beam still to go in to clear the full 78m of floor space of the existing supporting posts down the middle. At the moment there is a red SC jammed in with building materials and an old kitchen. No room for the T which is down in Pirongia. Long story but getting there slowly.

O2GO

Dates for Targa 2018 are being released about now (2 weeks post last event pending some final details being confirmed)

Macca

I agree Richard. Id hoped for a 1370kg Carrera with 6 speed box only option (from 991.2 GT3), a composite hood and side windows, less furniture/sound deadening and interior tech. On sports suspension with a forged 19" dedicated/designed wheel and sports exhaust as standard and lightweight battery as an option, this would have been a real winner for the "enthusiast" market. I think this would not have been to hard to achieve, but instead they have given us a marketing hyperbole...

Macca

Wow. I must start getting back to this page more regularly!

By now Pel is the owner of a new Renault Megane RS 275 Cup. A number of these became available to RSG members at a deeply discounted price last week. Tony B and myself bought one and I believe all cars are now either sold or reserved pending buyers confirmation, although its possible one may be left.

The RenaultSport Megane RS is a favourite of track junkies in Europe and UK. They are very popular at the Nurburgring and are run by the RSR Nurbugring team there to great effect:

http://www.rsrnurburg.com/car-rental...t-megane-rs265

Here is an interesting excerpt from the above link:

"ABOUT THE CAR

In many ways, and many parts of the world 'Front wheel drive' is a dirty set of words. But Renault's RS265 Megane will break all stereotypes and preconceptions, and will leave you absolutely amazed.

Trick differentials up front, a surprisingly powerful 265hp motor and great handling makes this car a must try for anyone - even if you've never driven a Front wheel drive car before. Forget your Porsches, your BMW's and anything starred and striped - when it comes to the Nürburgring - there is no better all around car out there. Lap after lap, visit after visit.

In the wet weather almost everything else will be left behind you, as you put the RS265s balance of easy driving, confidence inspiring capability to the track. It simply shows when everyone who drives this car comes back raving, only feeling a twang of pain when it's realised that this car is simply not available to purchase for yourself in certain markets - we're looking at you, USA!

AT A GLANCE

Easy to drive, safe car
Good for first timers and those who've been here before
The best all around car in our fleet
Good for all weather conditions - faster than Porsches in the wet!
Good for drivers comfortable with a Manual Gearbox
Left hand drive and Right hand drive options available"

They also have a track enhanced version and this is the upgrade path we will be deploying on the local cars:

http://www.rsrnurburg.com/car-rental...65-rsr-edition

Macca

So the upgrade path for the Meg RS begins!

We are aiming to break this down into small logical steps over a reasonable time frame so each stage can be exploited before the next. We will follow the well established and tried and tested upgrades that have been worked hard on tracks all over in Europe/UK.

The end goal is to have less than $45K invested in this vehicle including the brand new base RS275 Cup, all parts and labour etc.

In terms of track benchmarks, ultimately we wish to create a low cost, multi use vehicle (track, Targa and general back road/town driving duties), which is cheap to run (targeting generally 35-40% vs Porsche) and reliable. Most important of course it must be an engaging and rewarding car to pedal hard in all conditions.

Having researched it to death and applied local knowledge Im thinking this vehicle should beable to achieve by the 4th and last stage of the project a hero lap at various NI tracks in the dry as such:

HD National - 1.15/1.16
Taupo Full - 1.44/45
Manfield Full - 1.17/1.18

Stage 1 - First up we will run the stock car on road tyres on the NITT. The only upgrades at this time will be Ferodo DS1.11 pads and SRF fluid for brake pad/rotor longevity and to manage the thermal stress on the Brembo set up. Im not expecting miracles out of the box here but somewhere in the 1.49 at Taupo and 1.20/21 at Manfield would be nice if its dry.

Stage 2 will be later in Nov with Torque Performance booked to do a dyno remap the car after the decat pipe and airfilter are installed. They have experience with these cars and their findings are consistent with Europe/UK. Looking at +45bhp and +86NM - so 320bhp and 445nm at crank. Key is to make sure the AFRs are spot on across the range as the car will see alot of "spirited use".

Again will benchmark at Taupo after the tuning. Road tyres and pads like before for baseline. Predicting a drop in lap time sof around 1.2-1.5s a lap. So high 1.47s would be target.

Stage 3 - Next up is some R comp style track rubber. As the factory set up has no camber adjustment my first tyre choice (Cup2 as its good wet/dry + road/track) is probably not a smart option due to the aggressive wear that will be exhibited on the front wheel shoulders. Instead we will probably look at Dunlop DZ03G as it has a chunkier shoulder profile and is a well tested tyre on these cars on Europe tracks. The great news is the car runs 235/40R18 square so we choose an asymmetrical tyre and car rotate diagonally etc. There is also a very good selection of track rubber in this fitment.

Ideally we would see a drop in lap times over a road tyre at Taupo of around 1.8s a lap using the DZ03G. That would hopefully see us in the late 1.45 early 1.46s.

Stage 4. The factory Cup suspension has no camber adjustment and the car rides very high. KW have a dedicated Clubsport package for the RS 265/75 which can be landed, installed with corner weight balancing for around $4800. That a quality tried and tested 2 way shock set up with top mounts and camber plates which will allow us to address negative camber, lower the chassis for better COG and we can then run Cup2 tyres with some longevity (thinking 4 track days with rotation). Obviously the car will also handle better once set up and can be adjusted for specific applications with ease.

Ideally this would happen prior to SITT. We would probably replace the battery with LiOn at same time and get the weight down around 1370kg without loosing any "comfort".

Im purely speculating here but my guess is by removing 20-30kg from the car, setting it up KW Clubsport, lowering 25-30mm etc we should see the lap times at Taupo drop by around 1s a lap. So late 1.44/early 1.45

All up this 4 stage project is very cost competitive (total parts and labour for all above approx 8K inc GST). Running costs of the vehicle on the track will be around 45% of running a 911/Cayman at similar pace on the track. Pads/rotors are about 1/2 the price, tyres around 2/3s but other consumables dead cheap (filters, suspension parts etc).

In terms of pace with seat time set up stage 4 above in dry conditions it will probably be a car playing mid field fast group. I think the fastest pre 991 GT3 is Nigel C at 1.43.3 at Taupo. A typical GT4 is 1.43-4. A fast 997S maybe 1.46/7, a well set up Cayman 1.47-1.48 etc

You can see it could be a very effective package for the money sitting just behind the GT3/4 and ahead of the 911s. In the wet Id expect it to punch further above its weight.

So thats the Renault Sport programme. Its already underway with Stage 1 + 2 parts purchased and everything confirmed and booked. Im envisaging 2-3 others in the group joining me on this adventure and we will likely follow the same or similar paths. Always nice to have others share the journey etc....

gt38088

You should also check out the Ohlins R&T adjustable coilovers that were specced for the Trophy R Macca. Check this out - Evo test

gt38088

sorry sccidental double post deleted if this works

Macca

Thanks Graeme.

Yes I researched those. Very trick set up with composite springs.

Was a bit disappointed by the nominal 0.4s lap time difference over a Manfield length track in that video.

Was certainly more impressed by the noticeable benefits on fast road and overall feel the Ohlins coliovers provide...


The bottom line is the Ohlins cost around $10k landed vs the KW Clubsport at $4K.

The Ring junkies with Trophy-R claim the KW Clupsport is a better track set up (stiffer springs?) although they concede the Ohlins works better on the road but all are unanimous both set ups are a noticeable improvement in overall compliance on back roads etc than the stock non adjustable cup suspension...