Camaro ZL1-1LE Nordschleife Lap: 7:16.04
06-23-2017, 07:46 AM
#16
Race Car
I'm guessing they paid attention to the Z/28 issues and fixed them on the new generation car. Eric (provoste) is a VERY fast driver. I stopped up to Mid Ohio last weekend on a really humid 90 degree day and watched his 1LE run circles around everyone without any heat issues at all. If the standard 1LE car is that impressive I can't wait to see one of the ZL1 cars in action.
06-23-2017, 07:59 AM
#17
Rennlist Member
Originally Posted by paradocs98
Saw this earlier in the week and was very impressed. I can't wrap my head around why these high-level Camaros are so good, especially compared to their Corvette siblings. It's the same Z06 drivetrain, but in a significantly heavier car, with a higher center of gravity, a less track-focused basic platform/design, and a much less slippery body shape. How do they get the Camaro to be so competitive given these seeming liabilities?
06-23-2017, 08:31 AM
#18
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
Yeah those help- but they aren't it all. I'm actually running smaller track tires than OE on my SS 1LE (285 square) and it's just insanely good. The alpha platform that underpins the 6th gen Camaro is the main reason. My brother is a ride and handling engineering manager at a major OEM- and he told me 3 years ago when they announced the 6th gen Camaro would use the Cadillac ATS chassis- that I needed to get a 1LE when it comes out. He said the alpha platform is one of the best F/R chassis in the world. Very happy I heeded his advice. 1st GM product I've ever owned, sold a 986 S to buy it.
06-23-2017, 03:42 PM
#19
Addict
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
06-23-2017, 03:50 PM
#20
Yeah those help- but they aren't it all. I'm actually running smaller track tires than OE on my SS 1LE (285 square) and it's just insanely good. The alpha platform that underpins the 6th gen Camaro is the main reason. My brother is a ride and handling engineering manager at a major OEM- and he told me 3 years ago when they announced the 6th gen Camaro would use the Cadillac ATS chassis- that I needed to get a 1LE when it comes out. He said the alpha platform is one of the best F/R chassis in the world. Very happy I heeded his advice. 1st GM product I've ever owned, sold a 986 S to buy it.
06-23-2017, 04:47 PM
#21
As capable as the car is, and though it may be the bang-for-buck performance champ, I STILL can't get my head around the thought of a $70k Camaro.....gotta get those 70s-80s memories out of my head
Gary
Gary
06-23-2017, 06:16 PM
#22
Rennlist Member
Big thread in the GT3 forum about this. The driver joined the discussion too. Very interesting:
https://rennlist.com/forums/991-gt3-...-the-ring.html
https://rennlist.com/forums/991-gt3-...-the-ring.html
06-23-2017, 11:14 PM
#23
RL Community Team
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
Saw this earlier in the week and was very impressed. I can't wrap my head around why these high-level Camaros are so good, especially compared to their Corvette siblings. It's the same Z06 drivetrain, but in a significantly heavier car, with a higher center of gravity, a less track-focused basic platform/design, and a much less slippery body shape. How do they get the Camaro to be so competitive given these seeming liabilities?
06-24-2017, 07:13 PM
#24
Rennlist Member
I'm going to try to not sound like Debbie Downer here. We as car enthusiasts are so lucky to have such amazing performance available to us these days, at arguably reasonable cost. GT3s, high-end Corvettes, and this Camaro are faster than real, dedicated race cars were 15-20 years ago. My concern is safety. My 2011 E90 M3 was significantly slower than any of the cars above, but was fast enough that more than one knowledgable instructor recommended that I do more for safety. A Schroth QuickFit 4-pt harness and stock seats weren't enough.
So when I moved on to a 991 Carrera S, and now the GT4, I've made it a point to focus on safety upgrades. Rollbar, fixed bucket seats, real 6-point harnesses, HANS device.
It amazes me that these new cars that are faster than my GT4 don't come with such track safety features at least as a factory option. Most Corvettes I've seen at the track use only a harness bar if they mount 5 or 6-point harnesses. No rollover protection. Saw a C6 Z06 at the Glen three or four years ago that completely pancaked its A pillars in a rollover. Luckily the driver was okay. Who knows what the aftermarket is like for rollbars for these GM cars--I don't know if it's as extensive as it is for Porsches. I talked to another C6 Z06 owner at the Glen a couple of years ago who proudly showed me his custom-fabricated rollbar that apparently cost 5 figures because of the special techniques required to mount it to the body of the car.
The GT3 at least has a rollbar as a factory option, but of course it's not available in the U.S. market.
I'm certainly not Ralph Nader, but I do think the manufacturers do us a disservice when they actively market these cars as trackday weapons, but then fail to provide basic safety in the form of seats/harnesses and rollover protection.
So when I moved on to a 991 Carrera S, and now the GT4, I've made it a point to focus on safety upgrades. Rollbar, fixed bucket seats, real 6-point harnesses, HANS device.
It amazes me that these new cars that are faster than my GT4 don't come with such track safety features at least as a factory option. Most Corvettes I've seen at the track use only a harness bar if they mount 5 or 6-point harnesses. No rollover protection. Saw a C6 Z06 at the Glen three or four years ago that completely pancaked its A pillars in a rollover. Luckily the driver was okay. Who knows what the aftermarket is like for rollbars for these GM cars--I don't know if it's as extensive as it is for Porsches. I talked to another C6 Z06 owner at the Glen a couple of years ago who proudly showed me his custom-fabricated rollbar that apparently cost 5 figures because of the special techniques required to mount it to the body of the car.
The GT3 at least has a rollbar as a factory option, but of course it's not available in the U.S. market.
I'm certainly not Ralph Nader, but I do think the manufacturers do us a disservice when they actively market these cars as trackday weapons, but then fail to provide basic safety in the form of seats/harnesses and rollover protection.
06-26-2017, 10:12 AM
#25
The new Camaro has received universal praise for being not just crazy fast (1:26 at Willow in the regular non-1LE version of the ZL1 !!!) but also being a wonderful driver's car.
I have an '03 ZO6 and absolutely love it. Not just a great performance value, but an absolute top notch driver's car.
Wait until the new ZR1 is introduced. Can't wait for a comparison track test between it and the new GT2!
I have an '03 ZO6 and absolutely love it. Not just a great performance value, but an absolute top notch driver's car.
Wait until the new ZR1 is introduced. Can't wait for a comparison track test between it and the new GT2!
06-26-2017, 11:25 AM
#26
Originally Posted by paradocs98
I'm going to try to not sound like Debbie Downer here. We as car enthusiasts are so lucky to have such amazing performance available to us these days, at arguably reasonable cost. GT3s, high-end Corvettes, and this Camaro are faster than real, dedicated race cars were 15-20 years ago. My concern is safety. My 2011 E90 M3 was significantly slower than any of the cars above, but was fast enough that more than one knowledgable instructor recommended that I do more for safety. A Schroth QuickFit 4-pt harness and stock seats weren't enough.
So when I moved on to a 991 Carrera S, and now the GT4, I've made it a point to focus on safety upgrades. Rollbar, fixed bucket seats, real 6-point harnesses, HANS device.
It amazes me that these new cars that are faster than my GT4 don't come with such track safety features at least as a factory option. Most Corvettes I've seen at the track use only a harness bar if they mount 5 or 6-point harnesses. No rollover protection. Saw a C6 Z06 at the Glen three or four years ago that completely pancaked its A pillars in a rollover. Luckily the driver was okay. Who knows what the aftermarket is like for rollbars for these GM cars--I don't know if it's as extensive as it is for Porsches. I talked to another C6 Z06 owner at the Glen a couple of years ago who proudly showed me his custom-fabricated rollbar that apparently cost 5 figures because of the special techniques required to mount it to the body of the car.
The GT3 at least has a rollbar as a factory option, but of course it's not available in the U.S. market.
I'm certainly not Ralph Nader, but I do think the manufacturers do us a disservice when they actively market these cars as trackday weapons, but then fail to provide basic safety in the form of seats/harnesses and rollover protection.
So when I moved on to a 991 Carrera S, and now the GT4, I've made it a point to focus on safety upgrades. Rollbar, fixed bucket seats, real 6-point harnesses, HANS device.
It amazes me that these new cars that are faster than my GT4 don't come with such track safety features at least as a factory option. Most Corvettes I've seen at the track use only a harness bar if they mount 5 or 6-point harnesses. No rollover protection. Saw a C6 Z06 at the Glen three or four years ago that completely pancaked its A pillars in a rollover. Luckily the driver was okay. Who knows what the aftermarket is like for rollbars for these GM cars--I don't know if it's as extensive as it is for Porsches. I talked to another C6 Z06 owner at the Glen a couple of years ago who proudly showed me his custom-fabricated rollbar that apparently cost 5 figures because of the special techniques required to mount it to the body of the car.
The GT3 at least has a rollbar as a factory option, but of course it's not available in the U.S. market.
I'm certainly not Ralph Nader, but I do think the manufacturers do us a disservice when they actively market these cars as trackday weapons, but then fail to provide basic safety in the form of seats/harnesses and rollover protection.
06-28-2017, 09:09 AM
#27
Rennlist Member
I'm going to try to not sound like Debbie Downer here. We as car enthusiasts are so lucky to have such amazing performance available to us these days, at arguably reasonable cost. GT3s, high-end Corvettes, and this Camaro are faster than real, dedicated race cars were 15-20 years ago. My concern is safety. My 2011 E90 M3 was significantly slower than any of the cars above, but was fast enough that more than one knowledgable instructor recommended that I do more for safety. A Schroth QuickFit 4-pt harness and stock seats weren't enough.
So when I moved on to a 991 Carrera S, and now the GT4, I've made it a point to focus on safety upgrades. Rollbar, fixed bucket seats, real 6-point harnesses, HANS device.
It amazes me that these new cars that are faster than my GT4 don't come with such track safety features at least as a factory option. Most Corvettes I've seen at the track use only a harness bar if they mount 5 or 6-point harnesses. No rollover protection. Saw a C6 Z06 at the Glen three or four years ago that completely pancaked its A pillars in a rollover. Luckily the driver was okay. Who knows what the aftermarket is like for rollbars for these GM cars--I don't know if it's as extensive as it is for Porsches. I talked to another C6 Z06 owner at the Glen a couple of years ago who proudly showed me his custom-fabricated rollbar that apparently cost 5 figures because of the special techniques required to mount it to the body of the car.
The GT3 at least has a rollbar as a factory option, but of course it's not available in the U.S. market.
I'm certainly not Ralph Nader, but I do think the manufacturers do us a disservice when they actively market these cars as trackday weapons, but then fail to provide basic safety in the form of seats/harnesses and rollover protection.
So when I moved on to a 991 Carrera S, and now the GT4, I've made it a point to focus on safety upgrades. Rollbar, fixed bucket seats, real 6-point harnesses, HANS device.
It amazes me that these new cars that are faster than my GT4 don't come with such track safety features at least as a factory option. Most Corvettes I've seen at the track use only a harness bar if they mount 5 or 6-point harnesses. No rollover protection. Saw a C6 Z06 at the Glen three or four years ago that completely pancaked its A pillars in a rollover. Luckily the driver was okay. Who knows what the aftermarket is like for rollbars for these GM cars--I don't know if it's as extensive as it is for Porsches. I talked to another C6 Z06 owner at the Glen a couple of years ago who proudly showed me his custom-fabricated rollbar that apparently cost 5 figures because of the special techniques required to mount it to the body of the car.
The GT3 at least has a rollbar as a factory option, but of course it's not available in the U.S. market.
I'm certainly not Ralph Nader, but I do think the manufacturers do us a disservice when they actively market these cars as trackday weapons, but then fail to provide basic safety in the form of seats/harnesses and rollover protection.
06-28-2017, 09:37 AM
#28
Rennlist Member
Now THAT'S exactly what I'm talking about. Forum member supercup has an allocation for one of these. Brilliant, Ford: https://performanceparts.ford.com/FP350S/
06-28-2017, 10:09 AM
#30
"For a little more the Viper ACR E is about to break the all time production car record .........you will read about it in a couple of weeks"
Please explain. Didn't they already test at the Ring last year? the Viper is not in production anymore.
Please explain. Didn't they already test at the Ring last year? the Viper is not in production anymore.