TXE36

Adding to that, an instructor does not have the authority to require a student do anything unless it is required for safety. For example, I had an instructor once who wanted me to rev the motor to the limiter, my response was "I'm not going to do that, let's work on something else."

As instructors, we must never forget the students are the customers. Our primary job is to keep them safe and enable them to have fun. With luck, they will learn something in the process.

I too like Chin's policy, paraphrasing "No, unless the student asks, and then if something happens, it's on you." It has been discussed at every Chin instructor's meeting I've attended.

-Mike

RickBetterley

3 different levels of 'Instructor driving student's car' to think about:
1st - Novice - At the (many) events I instruct at, mostly PCA, instructors are encouraged to drive first couple of laps so novice student can see the track, which is often their first time. This gives them a chance to begin learning where the flaggers are, when to turn right not left, and get their toe in the water. Students are allowed to decline. These laps are at 3/10ths (maybe less...)
I ALWAYS ask the student if they would like me to take the car and try to make it clear it is ok to say 'no.' If yes, they get The Speech - 'Understand that I am not responsible for your car no matter what; whether its damage due to my driving or someone else's driving, oil/antifreeze/debris/animals on the track, or a mechanical problem, I'm not going to pay for it. Is this OK with you?'
I occasionally get a hesitant 'OK' so I ask if they are sure. Any doubt, I suggest they might prefer to do all of the driving and that's quite alright. No downside.
This is done in a friendly but no nonsense manner. Not a bad way to start off a day or more of instructing.
2nd - Trying to Show Them Something and/or Get a Feel for What I Am Doing.
I almost always do that in my car, partly to minimize that risk, partly because I know it better. Hopefully CI has given me a student in a similar car to mine.
IF they need the demo in their car (or prefer it and I agree), they get The Speech. Same deal. Obviously driving faster but nowhere near 10/10ths (I admit to never having driven a 10/10th lap in my life, and wouldn't do so with a passenger).
3rd - Thrill Rides - DON'T DO THAT WITH A STUDENT, its too risky and probably disrupts their learning. OK with fellow advanced drivers where permitted, of course. And that wouldn't be a thrill ride, it would be learning from each other.
Now, before I hear "its not in writing, no witnesses, won't hold up' - I get it (I earn my living in the risk field). I am mostly trying to reduce the chances of hard feelings. Because I don't get paid enough to pay for the student's car.

Slakker

Timely thread. I've been asked to instruct for the first time this weekend. 1st time novices who may or may not care what I have to say. Any tips?

ExMB

I'm not sure where you get your information, but that is not true. It may be region specific, because it definitely doesn't apply unilaterally across all regions.

ProCoach

Engage in a conversation. Keep it simple. Maintain order. Have fun!

Slakker

I can do that.

RickBetterley

Congratulations!
Lots of good tips - one is don't mention its your first time. You and your student will both be relying on your ability to influence him or her from the right seat. If the student isn't super confident in you that will be harder to achieve.
Oh, and get to know a few of the experienced instructors and don't be afraid to ask them for advice. You are back to being a novice!

Honkity Hank

A few.
1. Ask them about their car, get them comfortable, some are more nervous than others but talking cars can help break the ice.
2. Get to know them a little before jumping in the car.
3. Ask them what they hope to achieve, where they want to go. Most novices don't seem to have clear goals, if that is the case suggest that you begin by learning the line and working on learning how track driving is different from the street.

Keep it fun for the student and enjoy the experience.

Qwickrick

Question that pops out at me....you have been "asked to instruct" without any instructor training?

TXE36

+1 (Raises eyebrow).

-Mike

Slakker

Ok. Good stuff. Thx guys.


I know right! This ain't no PCA DE that's for sure.

DTMiller

slakker, people with a lot of experience are hinting (not all that subtly) that this is a bad idea. Perhaps consider whether they are correct and then, the important part, follow that advice. Things can go bad fast out there.

Slakker

Isn't that always the case on the track? And I ALWAYS listen to and take into consideration everyone's advice on this forum. It's least I can do if they are going to take the time to give it.

In this particular case, there are 21 novice drivers and 6 instructors, including myself. I do believe I can provide more benefit than no instruction at all. If that's a poor decision on my part then I will have to live with that. But I am planning on approaching it with a humble and encouraging spirit and to make use of the information provided here as well as the instructions I will be given by the CI.

Veloce Raptor

+1

RickyBobby

@ Slakker pm sent