Sebring brake failure
#61
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#62
Rennlist Member
Mark, Laguna and COTA are not Sebring T7, which has gotten significantly bumpier in the last 18 months.
You can continue to spew dangerous nonsense and be a generally obnoxious tool, per your usual behavior patterns here, but the fact of the matter is that even a super skilled multiple downshift at THAT location on THAT track at THAT speed has a high likelihood of disaster.
Peter knows this. Frank and I know this and both of us witnessed what Frank described there. Many others familiar with Sebring know this. And the driver in this video, who is also a seasoned pro (unlike you) knew this.
You do not. By all means, continue embarrassing yourself.
You can continue to spew dangerous nonsense and be a generally obnoxious tool, per your usual behavior patterns here, but the fact of the matter is that even a super skilled multiple downshift at THAT location on THAT track at THAT speed has a high likelihood of disaster.
Peter knows this. Frank and I know this and both of us witnessed what Frank described there. Many others familiar with Sebring know this. And the driver in this video, who is also a seasoned pro (unlike you) knew this.
You do not. By all means, continue embarrassing yourself.
#63
Rennlist Member
just an FYI.... you get that car in to 3rd gear (which might only be one down shift for this guy) and you have 200ftlbs of torque available at near 5000rpm, multiplied through 3rd gear which would be around 5:1 thats, 1000ft-lbs of torque on both wheels, or 500lbs (each tire) of force decelerating the car at the limit of the rear tires and an ABS like force as well. it would almost stop the car in short order. try it sometime at the track. you dont coast for a half of a mile as you would if you leave the car in neutral and "see how far you go".
There, i thougth you would enjoy some "mind boggling" math this AM Dave!
the net net .... always do blip downshifts if you lose your brakes... even at turn 7 at sebring!
#64
Rennlist Member
Your ignorance of that track, like so many other things you pontificate on, boggles the mind.
Bye!
PS: to everyone else reading this who drives or will drive Sebring...DONT DO THIS IN T7 if you have comprehensive brake failure . Please.
Bye!
PS: to everyone else reading this who drives or will drive Sebring...DONT DO THIS IN T7 if you have comprehensive brake failure . Please.
#65
Rennlist Member
Mark, Laguna and COTA are not Sebring T7, which has gotten significantly bumpier in the last 18 months.
You can continue to spew dangerous nonsense and be a generally obnoxious tool, per your usual behavior patterns here, but the fact of the matter is that even a super skilled multiple downshift at THAT location on THAT track at THAT speed has a high likelihood of disaster.
Peter knows this. Frank and I know this and both of us witnessed what Frank described there. Many others familiar with Sebring know this. And the driver in this video, who is also a seasoned pro (unlike you) knew this.
You do not. By all means, continue embarrassing yourself.
You can continue to spew dangerous nonsense and be a generally obnoxious tool, per your usual behavior patterns here, but the fact of the matter is that even a super skilled multiple downshift at THAT location on THAT track at THAT speed has a high likelihood of disaster.
Peter knows this. Frank and I know this and both of us witnessed what Frank described there. Many others familiar with Sebring know this. And the driver in this video, who is also a seasoned pro (unlike you) knew this.
You do not. By all means, continue embarrassing yourself.
it is YOU that is embarrasing yourself here. what I am advocating , is the safest method for brake failure, PERiOD! no excptions!
no... downshifts there would have NO effect on keeping the under control, infact, would give more control for obvious reasons (maybe not to you)
It is you that is being a TOOL here, dave. please, dummmy up before posting more nonsense on the subject.
In fact, even if the driver just left it in gear, he would have been 10x safer. he didnt and thats why he had such a dramatic finish and almost could have killed someone!!!
there is NO chance of "disaster"" dave, for doing a couple of downshifts after brake failure, you wold be doing a downshift anyway for this approach.
you are reflecting on your experience. remember your braking failure caused you to end up in the sand trap.. mine caused no visible problem ..i was able to drive on.... why?? technique my friend..the proof is in the technique and results from the same event. you spin or beach the car... i drive on safely... what technique should you share with others??
#66
Rennlist Member
Turn 7 - the safety pin, doesn't have great traction to begin with - I've lost my brakes at this location before - luckily with a combination aggressive pumping and engine braking I was able to get the car under control on the service road - and turned right instead of left... to exit back on the track... He did well to get the car under control - that Camaro had some serious giddy up...
And just to confirm what VR said - I've seen someone first hand that's popped the clutch here, locked up the rears and spun into the wall totaling their car. This is my home track -
And just to confirm what VR said - I've seen someone first hand that's popped the clutch here, locked up the rears and spun into the wall totaling their car. This is my home track -
#67
Also, I'm surprised nobody posted the obligatory "That will buff out.". I imaging the fence did a number on the paint on the front clip while at the same time helped keep him off the public two lane blacktop.
-Mike
#68
Rennlist Member
Yeah,just listen to dave! just coast out the side gate and hope you dont run over someone! pleeeezzzz!!!!
yes, please listen! do a quick downshift, maybe two.... be patient and leave the car in gear.... thats the advice. and it is sound! but, do NOT coast in neutral!!
#71
Rennlist Member
Originally Posted by mark kibort
i have saved and continued on at laguna with total , catastrophic brake failure at turn 2.... downhill, to boot!! why did i survive??? survival techniques my big mouth pal!!
its simple
its simple
#72
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It was a Nissan V-6... Glad he wasn't hurt.
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#73
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I know this has turned into a childish argument with Kibort, but this is a serious subject.
I just don't think that you can just so easily say that downshifting,spinning,or purposefully crashing into the tires is not the best course of action sometimes.
Was Johnny O wrong?
I just don't think that you can just so easily say that downshifting,spinning,or purposefully crashing into the tires is not the best course of action sometimes.
Was Johnny O wrong?
#74
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On the 'Vette, the left front rotor exploded.
You can see it in the video.
That meant the right front brake worked and the left front did NOT.
That began the car spinning to the right (clockwise, looking from above), pivoting the car on the functioning right front SLOWING tire.
Johnny O said initially on the radio that the "right front brake blew up," but it was the left front rotor that exploded.
While Johnny O surely helped slow the car any way he could (going down through the gears, I can GUARANTEE you he wasn't "blipping"), the spin that slowed the car was begun by the failure and the dynamics OF the failure, not by the driver...
I love him to death, and there are very few drivers with the "heart" of Johnny O, but this was not "fine driving" that caused the damage to be less, it was automatic response after the failure and loss of control started it...
You can see it in the video.
That meant the right front brake worked and the left front did NOT.
That began the car spinning to the right (clockwise, looking from above), pivoting the car on the functioning right front SLOWING tire.
Johnny O said initially on the radio that the "right front brake blew up," but it was the left front rotor that exploded.
While Johnny O surely helped slow the car any way he could (going down through the gears, I can GUARANTEE you he wasn't "blipping"), the spin that slowed the car was begun by the failure and the dynamics OF the failure, not by the driver...
I love him to death, and there are very few drivers with the "heart" of Johnny O, but this was not "fine driving" that caused the damage to be less, it was automatic response after the failure and loss of control started it...
#75
Rennlist Member
I won't second guess what the driver did in the few seconds he had to react since I don't have all the facts and never will unless he decides to share them. Bottom line is that no one was injured.
It almost sounds like the car shut off. Listen closely to the video. Once he stops at the entrance to the Chateau, it sounds like he fires the car back up before driving through the parking lot.
*Listening watching it again and using my fancy Apple earbuds for audio, there are several seconds where I don't hear the V8 rumble at idle indicating the clutch was in. Sounds like three attempts to re-fire the car during the whole sequence of events.
It almost sounds like the car shut off. Listen closely to the video. Once he stops at the entrance to the Chateau, it sounds like he fires the car back up before driving through the parking lot.
*Listening watching it again and using my fancy Apple earbuds for audio, there are several seconds where I don't hear the V8 rumble at idle indicating the clutch was in. Sounds like three attempts to re-fire the car during the whole sequence of events.