TXE36

I know this is a Porsche forum, but as an American, it is satisfying to see Ford and GM make credible efforts at building machines that track rats can appreciate rather than stoplight dragsters.

How so? Can you say flat plane crank V-8? Can you say keeps up with a GT3 on a racetrack?

2016 Ford Shelby GT350/GT350R Mustang: First Drive

I didn't discover the "why" to European machines like BMWs, Porsches until getting older, having grown up outside the Motor City. Once I did, the domestic offerings were a bit of a let down. But with some of these latest, Mustangs, Camaros, and 'Vettes they are getting much better.

I had a student with a Camaro ZL1 and was pleasantly surprised, not by the gobs of motor, but by the braking, balance, and handling. I came away from that weekend with an appreciation for a student that took instruction well and for what a sweet car that Camaro was - the later part of that is something I thought I would never think.

-Mike

Veloce Raptor

Sounds nice but it weighs 43,217 pounds...

TXE36

Really? At 3,655 lbs it weighs less or the same as an E46 M3.

They aren't perfect, but they are an order of magnitude better then their examples from the beginning of this century.

-Mike

Veloce Raptor

True.

Meanwhile, with my 210 pounds plus a full tank of fuel in it, this is the weight of a stock C7 Z51. Pretty light car without both, considering... 31xx pounds

jj1

^Thats not bad! I'd much rather that car with 30k+ in my pocket than the z06.

E46 is more like 3400lbs. GT350 is really cool but if I was in the market, the weight is a deal breaker for me too. If I was only willing to buy a new car and had a ~35k budget, I will say the standard GT blows everything else out of the water.

Jon Moeller

Mike,
I'm with you, it's solid progress from the US. Between the CTS-V, the ATS-V, the C5-C7 Corvettes, the Vipers, the Camaros and now the Mustangs, the manufacturers are starting to get what makes a real enthusiast's car.

The weight on all cars has gone up, and I doubt we'll see that improve, anytime soon. My real complaint with the Camaros and the Mustangs is visibility. I want a bigger greenhouse, and that's the one thing that would keep me from considering either of those cars.

I instructed a guy with a ZL1 at COTA, and it was a truly impressive car. Great balance, sick grip, power, brakes, if it wasn't for it overheating in the last session, I would have said it was the entire package. 100 degree heat is tough to deal with, though.

ShakeNBake

E46 was under 3400 if you took the backseat out, with an exhaust, and and and....ask me how I know.


IMO Ford TOTALLY dropped the ball on weight...there is no reason in this day and age that they could not have shaved more off, but I might forgive them for that engine MEOWWWW

Thundermoose

Stock E46M is 3415. Mine is 2750 with 1/2 tank a gas and no driver.

d15b7

a 2015 BMW M3 is (according to Car and Driver) 3600 lbs. that's very similar to the GT350R.

Personally, I'd rather have the flat plane 5.2 liter V8 than the turbo six from BMW. BMW is going the 'wrong way' in my opinion -- remember when they were turning out 8k+ rpm V10 screamers making 500 hp? that was an engineering marvel! the previous gen M3 V8 was amazing too. I just can't get as excited by the new crop of 4 and 6 cyl turbo power plants that they are turning out now. sure they make good power and torque, but do they inspire?

the Porsche GT3 flat six still does. so does the one in the Cayman GT4.

as does this new offering by Ford. its bold (and probably a slightly risky decision, given the development costs, and that 'most' regular folks who are looking at a mustang probably have no idea what the new motor entails, or even really care. or will ever go near a racetrack with it. still, it's a bold move by Ford. I love it; (the fact that it can circulate a racetrack at the same pace of a new GT3? huge kudos!).

but we here on this list are all made up of that 0.1% that understand/appreciate that sort of thing.

after 25 years of wanting one, I was finally able to recently afford (and find) the dream car of my youth; a car of similar ilk as the GT350R. I bought a 1990 ZR-1 with the LT5 motor -- it was SO far advanced and beyond what the Corvette ever had been at that time; the LT5 was so incredibly well engineered and manufactured and capable. a handful of consumers 'got it' and cared and purchased the ZR-1. and used it accordingly. but most were bought and collected and in all very few were sold and the car/engine went away. hopefully this doesn't happen to the GT350R (and Z/28).

MUSSBERGER

i scored an invite to the Lime Rock portion of the track tour. Looking forward to it

Mark Dreyer

I'm doing the track tour next month at Sebring. This car is really enticing. I may try to get one. Stopped in at a Ford dealer today, and they had a sign posted that the GT350 was available for a $10k markup, and the R version a $20k markup. I walked right back out the door.

MUSSBERGER

That's what I'm afraid of. Though i admire Ford's efforts and the Ford family I might have to check out the "VR" edition Corvette. "Veloce Raptor" edition. That has a nice ring to it. Dave you should trademark it.

Matt Lane

Too bad you didn't take 2 more minutes and give a well deserved finger to the manager, at a minimum, if not for him to pass it along to the owner.

stuntman

3,650lb car with full of fuel running wider tires than a 991 GT3 full of fuel, which is ~350 lbs lighter.

jdistefa

Sounds fantastic. Tempting car indeed.