wellcoached

Let the rules people know you oppose unless to want to run lesser shocks or move up to Prepared !
crrules@pca.org

Wanted to post a Poll but not sure how to .....

LuigiVampa

I'm in prepared but still think it is a stupid rule.

wellcoached

Let the rules people know please

crrules@pca.org

LuigiVampa

yup - that is the email I will be sending tonight while drinking beer and smoking a stogie!

ltusler

So what part of the word stock don't you understand?

RallyeChris

That is how it has been in BMW CCA Club Racing from the beginning. Stock vehicles were not equipped with remote reservoir shocks, so why allow them in stock classes? Helps keep costs down, allows folks to get into club racing without dropping $5k on shocks to start. Club Racing typically draws from DE participants. The guy with a cage, Bilsteins, Springs, sways would have to throw another $5k at the car just to start. Now, he can just get his license and not feel that he is being out-spent before he even enters his first race.

IMO, brakes should be as-delivered from the factory in stock classes also. Only pads, fluid and ducting free. Aftermarket rotors, of course free.

coryf

Sachs makes a 4 way adjustable through rod shock that doesn't have a remote reservoir. They cost a lot more than 5K a set and would still be legal because they aren't remote reservoir. PCA would have to disallow all adjustable shocks. Teams would then just have multiple sets of shocks with different valving. Someone will all ways find a way to spend money on what they feel would be an advantage. In the end it would end up costing people more.

If the argument is stock means stock, then what about aftermarket limited slips, wheels, dot "r" tires, adjustable sway bars, performance exhaust ect....... PCA stock classes are way too far along to make a dramatic change. If someone wanted to race their bone stock car with just the required safety equipment, perhaps they can run one class lower than the listed stock class.

RallyeChris

Good point. I believe we were limited to 2 adjustments on dampers in stock classes.

wellcoached

I wouldn't use BMW as a model or argument, if you look at their entries they seldom get more than half a dozen cars per class.
Love the group ,I raced there, but very limited class participation.

RallyeChris

When I raced with BMW, in 2005-2008, there was a lot more participation. I do believe they have too many classes, which dilutes the class field. The classes I ran, JPrepared and SpecE36, had 10-15 cars per class on average. Regardless of current participation, I do believe the class structuring is sound. Stock is still pretty-much dead. A new class, sport, was added a few years ago. It was essentially stock engine/brakes/aero with prepared suspension allowed. It seems that the average level of DE car prep had advanced since the stock class inception. Most DE guys already had adjustable dampers/camber plates, so the new class helped compensate for that. Keep costs down by not opening the engine, and make the transition from DE to racing more fluid.

Perhaps the same is true in PCA. If most DE guys are already running remote-reservoirs, then it makes some sense to allow them in the entry-level racing class. Or, they can add a new class like BMW did. But, it can cannibalize the other class' car count.

RallyeChris

Dusting-off my old BMW rule book, remote reservoirs were only allowed in Modified classes. Stock, Sport and prepared allowed 2-way adjustable. No remote reservoir.

It's been too long since I looked at my rule book. My point was that if the allowance reflects the current progression of DE-level car prep, and the allowance will help make it more attractive for DE guys to get into racing, then it makes sense for the racing program.

GT3DE

This old premise that a guy (or gal) takes their street car to a DE and then progresses to club racing with only mandated mods (cut-off, extinguisher, roll bar, seat) is nonsense. I am sure someone has an example but I personally have not seen anyone in the last few years drive a car to a race and race it, much less race a car they drive on the street.

Too many ways around a shock rule with no remote res. All of which will be more expensive and time consuming and totally necessary to win.

GT3DE

I am guessing this "proposal" was started by someone(s) that feels he/she could win if all the "rich" guys weren't out-spending him with expensive shocks.

Hell, Evan says almost as much to me about my res shocks compared to his non-res shocks (yet he beats me anyway, lol).

944hal

I know a guy who runs an SP3 car that drives it to the track. Puts his track tires, jack and some tools in the back.

wellcoached

Well by all means lets rewrite the rules to accommodate that one guy !