Instructor killed at PBIR April 16 2019
04-18-2019, 01:05 AM
#17
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Very sad.
We don’t know all the details of what happened, but I have to wonder about the safety of the track, given that the car reportedly hit a concrete barrier with sufficient speed to kill the instructor on impact.
Has anyone else noticed that the person in the right seat usually has worse injuries when these track crashes occur?
We don’t know all the details of what happened, but I have to wonder about the safety of the track, given that the car reportedly hit a concrete barrier with sufficient speed to kill the instructor on impact.
Has anyone else noticed that the person in the right seat usually has worse injuries when these track crashes occur?
04-18-2019, 07:42 AM
#18
Rennlist Member
Terrible news, redesign the track would be good for many reasons and may not have to do anything with the reasons of the crash, but that’s a long straight for an otherwise slow motorcycle track with long slow curves.
04-18-2019, 11:04 AM
#20
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04-18-2019, 11:17 AM
#21
Rennlist Member
As someone who right seats as part of my driving hobby, committed to give back all the instruction I received over the years, these tragedies make keeping that commitment harder. Part of my engineering training wants to understand the safety equipment, skill level of the driver, tech readiness of the car, any factors that would help assess the risk and mitigate it if placed in a similar scenario. Unfortunately that will not happen, which makes getting in the next car harder. But I will do it next month at Sebring.
Prayers go out for the driver and any family and friends impacted by this. Hobbies shouldn’t kill you.
Prayers go out for the driver and any family and friends impacted by this. Hobbies shouldn’t kill you.
04-18-2019, 11:30 AM
#22
Rennlist Member
Sad news for all.
Something like this enters my mind each time I step into the passenger seat.
My last instructor gig was with a 18-20 year old kid with daddys new GT3 at Chuckwalla. He stalled it leaving the pits... First time on a track. Never raced a bycicle let alone a go kart at K1. Nothing.
When conducting the interview I concluded with softly stating "you understand the first time you dont do exactly what I say exactly when I say it were done for the for the day". You know what we discussed, Lift, brake, turn,... got it, yes said the young man. He was a great student and each session improved. But the first few laps were interesting.
My scariest ride was an old timer that had lost his reaction skills/timing and I had to tell him. After the first session I told the Chief Driving Steward he needed to bump the nice man down to beginner or sit him out. More importantly i refused to ride with him again. After my attempt to explain the slow down because you are missing every apex and nannies are loading every turn.... he was PO. Needless to say didnt like what I said.
Something like this enters my mind each time I step into the passenger seat.
My last instructor gig was with a 18-20 year old kid with daddys new GT3 at Chuckwalla. He stalled it leaving the pits... First time on a track. Never raced a bycicle let alone a go kart at K1. Nothing.
When conducting the interview I concluded with softly stating "you understand the first time you dont do exactly what I say exactly when I say it were done for the for the day". You know what we discussed, Lift, brake, turn,... got it, yes said the young man. He was a great student and each session improved. But the first few laps were interesting.
My scariest ride was an old timer that had lost his reaction skills/timing and I had to tell him. After the first session I told the Chief Driving Steward he needed to bump the nice man down to beginner or sit him out. More importantly i refused to ride with him again. After my attempt to explain the slow down because you are missing every apex and nannies are loading every turn.... he was PO. Needless to say didnt like what I said.
04-18-2019, 11:34 AM
#23
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Based on the available stats, I continue to believe that the absolute risk of instructing is quite low, and that risk can be reduced by being diligent about risk management. But I do find it unsettling to hear about these serious and fatal incidents. For a while, I've asked/pressured my wife to pause on any instructing, and my own appetite for instructing has been diminished (I personally know instructors who've been injured and killed, which brings it even closer to home). I wish I didn't have this apprehension about instructing, since I really do enjoy instructing, sometimes even more than driving myself, and my wife enjoys instructing too.
04-18-2019, 11:41 AM
#24
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Sad news for all.
Something like this enters my mind each time I step into the passenger seat.
My last instructor gig was with a 18-20 year old kid with daddys new GT3 at Chuckwalla. He stalled it leaving the pits... First time on a track. Never raced a bycicle let alone a go kart at K1. Nothing.
When conducting the interview I concluded with softly stating "you understand the first time you dont do exactly what I say exactly when I say it were done for the for the day". You know what we discussed, Lift, brake, turn,... got it, yes said the young man. He was a great student and each session improved. But the first few laps were interesting.
My scariest ride was an old timer that had lost his reaction skills/timing and I had to tell him. After the first session I told the Chief Driving Steward he needed to bump the nice man down to beginner or sit him out. More importantly i refused to ride with him again. After my attempt to explain the slow down because you are missing every apex and nannies are loading every turn.... he was PO. Needless to say didnt like what I said.
Something like this enters my mind each time I step into the passenger seat.
My last instructor gig was with a 18-20 year old kid with daddys new GT3 at Chuckwalla. He stalled it leaving the pits... First time on a track. Never raced a bycicle let alone a go kart at K1. Nothing.
When conducting the interview I concluded with softly stating "you understand the first time you dont do exactly what I say exactly when I say it were done for the for the day". You know what we discussed, Lift, brake, turn,... got it, yes said the young man. He was a great student and each session improved. But the first few laps were interesting.
My scariest ride was an old timer that had lost his reaction skills/timing and I had to tell him. After the first session I told the Chief Driving Steward he needed to bump the nice man down to beginner or sit him out. More importantly i refused to ride with him again. After my attempt to explain the slow down because you are missing every apex and nannies are loading every turn.... he was PO. Needless to say didnt like what I said.
04-18-2019, 11:58 AM
#25
Rennlist Member
Agreed.
Each student, their car and the track is unique.
Far more great experiences than bad ones for sure.
Each student, their car and the track is unique.
Far more great experiences than bad ones for sure.
04-18-2019, 02:32 PM
#27
In my experience (more than a hundred students, many dozens of checkouts, and training/evaluating new instructors), the most challenging students have been (a) younger aggressive drivers who don't respect the risks and don't always want to listen and (b) older drivers who fit what you described, and need to accept that driving on track isn't for them. But I don't want to stereotype based on age, since these challenging students are a small minority, and typical good students span the entire age range.
Bottom line is one always has to be on the ball - any student can potentially do anything. An attitude of "you don't listen we are done" is essential.
-Mike
04-18-2019, 03:07 PM
#28
Three Wheelin'
This is tragic news, and so sad for all involved.
Given the description of the accident, it made me wonder if there is an exotic car experience at PBIR where you can rent 3 laps in a Ferrari, Lambo, etc. and if that might have been involved. However this came to be, a most terrible outcome
Given the description of the accident, it made me wonder if there is an exotic car experience at PBIR where you can rent 3 laps in a Ferrari, Lambo, etc. and if that might have been involved. However this came to be, a most terrible outcome
04-18-2019, 04:50 PM
#29
That’s what I was thinking. An exotic rental experience. I went to an air show recently where the cross wind down the runway was severe enough that the parachute team didn’t do their act, and some of the aerobatic displays were pretty scary to watch. Despite that, a company was giving rides in a clapped out Ferrari 430. For $150, you could DRIVE the F430 at “150mph” on a side runway. No helmet, no training necessary. Just put your foot down and hold on apparently. (Facepalm)...
04-18-2019, 05:29 PM
#30
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Not surprisingly, the exotic rental experiences seem to have had more than their share of crashes. The format is a good recipe for problems. No way I'd ever 'instruct' at one of those.