thebishman

CrazyFast

Part 3b: Porsche 2-day Masters course
I attended the Masters course with Porsche at Barber at the end of the driving season last year. So at that point, I had already completed 8 HPDE events for the year, as well as the AMG and Porsche 1-day courses. At that point, I was focused on getting into racing, and was intending to pursue the Porsche coursework through SCCA license.

The clientele at the PTX Masters course was slightly more advanced than the Precision course. I would say most of the drivers owned P-cars. However, only a small selection had taken theirs to the track. There was one cool guy who flew planes and tracked his car. There was a great driver from Brazil who owned a GT3 as well as a 350z for drifting. Apparently track time in Brazil is stupid expensive, so they drive at night. Through the city. While drifting. Go figure.

Class size was the same as the Precision course, with ~32 attendees. Group size and day structure was similar to the Precision course as well, with a mix of exercises and track time in the morning and afternoon for both days. The track exercises were similar: Wet skid pad (oversteer and understeer), Parking lot autocross, trail braking, lifting for turns to feel weight change.

The car selection was pretty similar to the 1-day school, although I don’t think we took the Cayman on track this time, or maybe it was only for the lead-follow. One other difference was that the GT3 had been substituted for the GT3RS by this point in the year. Apparently the cars only remain in the school for about 6 months, so you’re always driving a new car.

The biggest change from the Precision course is that you transition to Open lapping in the Masters course. So on the first day, we did the morning (3 track sessions) as lead-follow, and then the rest of day 1 and day 2 as open lapping. As you might expect, the open lapping is relatively restrictive, with only three passing zones on the longer straights and point-by required (with turn signals). While the pace was relatively quick, there was definitely a disparity in talent, and I got caught behind a slow car a couple of times and needed to wait a lap or two to get by due to the queue.

Coaching was also a little different from the Precision course. As the track time was primarily open lapping, the coaches were in the corners and provided feedback after each session. Made it kind of like drinking from a fire hose, as you were trying to learn so much so quickly, but I found if I really focused on one corner or section for a session, I could make marked improvements there, and then move to the next.

Prior to the open lapping sessions, we also did a track walk, and watched the instructors take specific turns. We also got to “corner watch” other students in between track sessions, which was pretty instructive to see good and bad lines.

Again, there was an autocross competition and Taxi ride at the end of day 2.

Pros:
Exercises: You’re doing effectively the same exercises from the Precision course, but you really get a chance to hone your skills. I found this especially valuable for the wet skid pad, where you were really starting to drift and connect corners by the end of day 2. Felt like an absolute ballet, and being able to do that with a rear engine car is pretty fun.

Coaching, Seat time, Porsches, Production – same comments from Precision course.

Cons:
Street prep (tires and pressure): All of the cars were equipped with OEM tires. While this is nice to learn how the car behaves with what it’s given, they were also aired to normal specs (the only exception was the GT3RS, for which they aired down the Cup 2’s). So as an example, when I was driving the turbo, my rear tire pressure got up to 52 PSI by the end of the sessions (wow). And when I was in the GTS, I was sliding through every single turn. Great to learn car control at speed, but when I was trying to catch the GT3RS in front of me (with Cup 2’s), made for some serious struggles.

Street prep (3-points): This is the reason I transitioned from PTX to Bertil Roos for my SCCA license. The cars are all driven with 3-point seat belts. No Harness, HANS, or Halo. While it’s great when you’re doing lead-follow, in open lapping, I actually didn’t feel that safe or anchored in the car. And, on the third day (during the Masters R course), the amazing Brazilian driver I mentioned above wrecked his car, got a bad concussion, and was sent to the hospital (it was raining cats and dogs, and he hydroplaned like crazy). I then committed to only driving on track with full safety gear.

The essentials:
See 1-day Performance review

Additional commentary:
I had a few interesting discussions with some of the coaches regarding why folks come to the school. It sounds like most folks are there to drive fast, but not necessarily to race. There were some cases where folks really enjoyed driving on track, but didn’t want to take their car. There were other cases where it was too expensive (Brazil) or painful to get to the track, so customers would use PTX as their track days. Some customers were absolute regulars, that came once per year to the 2,3, or 4 day schools.

I’m also intrigued by the 4-day post-SCCA license school. I would guess at that point you’re doing open passing without point-bys, but that’s pure conjecture on my part. What really scares me is that you would be doing this with folks you just met, and in street prepped cars. I’d be absolutely terrified of this.

Apparently at one point there was a Cup-car school, with arrive and drive similar to the PTX schools. However, the maintenance cost became prohibitive so they canned it. That’s a school I would sign up for in a heartbeat.

seanseidman

Great summary of the schools

jmartpr

Nice.....I just did the Master a few weeks ago and feel the same way.
My turn to do open lapping on the GT3RS came at the last hit on the second day. Car felt strange with not much grip so I went into the tire menu and guess what...47 PSI by mid session! They are short so didn't have time to pit and bleed some off.
I wasn't lucky enough to be able to add the Master R as a third day so planing next year to just do the Master RS (3 day).

CrazyFast

Part 3c: Porsche 1-day Masters R course
I attended the Masters R course at the end of the driving season last year, by tacking it on to the end of the 2-day Masters course at Barber. This was pretty common, as of the ~32 participants in the Masters course, we had about 20 stay on, and then another 4 or so join anew. It sounded intentional that they kept the R course a little smaller.

The structure of the day was kept similar to the other courses, with a mix of track time and exercises. The big difference was that you were now driving on the “proving ground” for the exercises, shown in the photo below. The exercises we went through were: wet skid pad (large version at proving ground), Wet skid pad (normal pavement instead of skid pad), friction circle (large figure 8 next to the classroom), data analysis.

The car selection was more focused this time – on track it was the GTS, GT3RS, and Turbo. In the exercises it was GTS and Cayman. All of the track time was open lapping, except for the folks who were not following on from the Masters course – they went through a couple lead-follow exercises first.

Here’s a little more description of the exercises:
- Wet Skid pad (large version) – This was a sealed paving area, quite large, so you could do larger turns. The goal was to fully drift the car around a figure-8. Very tricky to do in a 911, but once you get it you feel like an absolute hero. We did this exercise twice
- Wet skid pad (normal pavement) – This was more like what you’d see while driving in the wet on track, and in a little larger figure 8. We did the exercise in a Cayman, which was much more difficult to get to rotate. We did this exercise twice.
- Friction circle – This was done on dry pavement with a Cayman, but the tire pressures were crazy to enable the back end to break loose. I think something like 25 PSI in front and 80 PSI in the back. So they were deliberately changing traction balance to enable a drift. Unfortunately, we only got to do this exercise once…
- Data analysis –We got to look at our track data from the R or Masters course compared to the instructors on the Race-keeper Comparo software. Nice to have, but honestly kind of a waste of time as we weren’t there to get our lap times down.

One of the frustrating parts about my experience in the R day was that it was raining cats and dogs. For folks who haven’t been to Barber in the rain, there are a couple of spots on the straights that REALLY puddle up. On our first track session, I was in a Turbo and saw a driver in front of me move laterally about ½ track width. It was nuts. On the next lap, the Brazilian from 3b wrecked.

Took a while to clean up the carnage, but we then lost out on two track sessions. Understand that’s all part of driving on track, but it was a bummer to lose out on the track time.

Pros:
Exercises structure: The way the exercises are structured is quite logical, with Slick –> Wet -> Dry, forcing you to work more to get the rear end loose. This class was more focused on trail brake rotation and oversteer, so you really got to focus on those skills for the day.

Coaching, Seat time, Porsches, Production – same comments from Precision and Masters course.

Cons:
Track time: While it was nice to get more track time at the lovely Barber MSP, at this point I really didn’t want to be on track doing open lapping. I was there to learn how to control the car at its limits, and was hoping to really focus on those skills. The track-driving feedback was quite similar to the Masters course (more about the line), instead of car-control specific which is what I was hoping to receive. What would have been fantastic would be if they had split the track off into sections, and had us go through corners one-by-one trying different techniques (throttle steer, trail brake rotation, understeer recovery). In a controlled environment on track, this would have been amazing. Maybe too much to hope for and induces too much liability, but that’s my idea of a learning opportunity.

Exercise time: My biggest issue with the R course is how little time to you get to work on the “Dry” portion of traction control. We only had one go at the friction circle exercise, so maybe 5 min max. But, this is really what you’re at the school for. Everyone I talked to said the same thing – they were there to drift in the dry, and once they started getting it, they were done with the exercise.

The essentials:
See 1-day Performance review

Additional commentary:
In January, I got an email that there is a secret “2-day advanced car control clinic” taking place later this year. It’s invitation only and very limited enrollment (12 students per session) – not to say you couldn’t talk your way into it if there are openings. This is being done during the track repaving, so it may have just been a nice opportunity to try a new offering. Regardless, it sounds like this new course does exactly what I was really hoping for in the R course, with lots more time on the friction circle, and the entire two days spent in the proving grounds.

breljohn

Awesome write-up, thank you for sharing

Manifold

It's funny how chance events can change the course of our lives.

Years ago, I bought a new AMG, not knowing that it came with a free track day. When I got the letter informing me of the free track day, I had a prior prejudice that driving cars around a race track is a rather immature activity for adults to undertake, but I figured it's a $1,500 value, so I'll try something different. My wife and daughter came along for the ride up to Lime Rock, and as we got closer to the track, I was struck by how beautiful the area around Lime Rock is. The night before the track day, I hardly slept, due to being both apprehensive and excited about what I was about to do. As we rolled into the track, seeing all the cool cars raised my level of excitement, and my wife was jealous that she wasn't participating in the event.

Well, the event was great, the most fun single day I had in my life up to that point! I wanted to do more track days, but it took me a while to figure how to do track days without spending $1500 a day (not sure that tracking the GT3 is actually much cheaper, and I don't want to do the math to find out - if you know the answer, don't tell me). More than 200 track days later, I'm apparently still hooked, and looking forward to the upcoming track season. I still have my video from that first track day, and it's painful to see how slow I was, but I guess we usually have to begin at the beginning. My instructor took me for a hot lap that first track day, with all kinds of sideways driving, and I correctly thought then that I'll probably never be able to drive like that. In retrospect, seems a little crazy to allow novices to drive cars over 130 mph with another novice in the right seat, but I guess their incident rate is low enough that the perceived risk is a lot higher than the actual risk.

So, had I not bought that 'fun car' years ago, and had Mercedes not offered that free track day, I probably never would have driven a car on track. Oh, and my wife did wind up driving on track, and is now a PCA instructor with about a hundred track days under her belt (harness)!

CosmosMpower

Don't count on it unless you bought the M driver's package. They aren't giving away freebie classes like they used to.

CrazyFast

Part 4: Bertil Roos Advanced Racing course
I attended the 2-day Advanced course over the Christmas break, so at this point I had already completed 1 full season of HPDE, as well as the AMG 1-day, Porsche 1-day Precision, Porsche Masters, and Masters R courses. As mentioned in the previous post, I wanted to be in a fully track prepped car for my further schooling and racing so really looked only at the true race schools. As most folks know, the Skip Barber school has shut down, and reopened in a very different format. Other race schools include Bondurant and Allen Berg on the West coast and Lucas Oil on the East Coast. I chose the Bertil Roos school because of proximity (East Coast), the format (formula car with street tires), and the race series which I signed up for. The course I attended was at PBIR, and was held in conjunction with a three-day Road Racing School (Bertil Roos beginner school). I also took the option of an orientation day prior to the course, so had a total of three days on track.

The quote instructors like to share is, “You can learn to drive fast anywhere, but if you want to race, go to Roos.” This mentality is relatively accurate, as all of the students were looking to race. Our group had racers of all flavors: Chump car, spec Miata, Corvette, Ferrari, and P-car. Interestingly, the best drivers were in the beginner course that was running alongside ours. They were teenagers who had been racing karts since a young age, and looked well supported by their father / sponsor. Should have gotten their autographs, as I would expect great things from them.

Course size at this school was very small, with each group maxed out at ~8 students. I think the class size is really constrained by the number of running cars (more on that later). We were driving the old Skippy formula cars, which had ~135 HP connected to a sequential gearbox strapped to a ~1,200 lb vehicle. The tires are all treaded street tires.

You also get to drive their “slide cars”, which have the ability to release the rear end on a front-wheel drive car. The best way to describe this is like having an infinitely loose rear end. Trains you to really see and feel the yaw rate and control it through a turn. There is no better oversteer trainer.

The preliminary extra day was really just open lapping with designated passing zones on the straights. It was a great opportunity to get familiar with the cars and track before the school began. Most of the students attended the extra day and I would recommend highly.

The course was only a 2-day course, and was purely focused on racing. So, it’s assumed you already know how to drive a car at the limit, as well as how to drive a racing line on track (those are the focus areas of the beginner course). The overall structure of the two days was ~4 track sessions of 20-25 min each, interspersed with some slide car time, lectures and discussion.

On the first day, you practiced passing with other students and with the instructors in their own formula cars. By the end of the first day, the instructors are requiring you to force the pass, or if you don’t execute well, they’ll repass you. They were definitely being nice to us, but it’s a wake-up call the first time their tires are six inches away from yours in the braking zone. The discussion was focused on passing tactics, race strategy, race weekend strategy, etc. The instructors are a treasure trove of knowledge, so bring your questions.

The second day was structured like a race: 1 practice session, 1 qualifying session, and then two races with practice starts prior to the first race. The races are run with start positions based on qualifying, with a rolling start. Assuming you start the two races, you’ll be eligible for a full competition license with SCCA.

Pros:
The cars: Because you’re in an old-school formula car with all mechanical system (no power steering, no ABS, no nannies to speak of), you are forced to really drive the car. The tires are very progressive, so ask you to really push them in every corner. If you’re not sliding through a turn, you’re not going fast enough. But, it’s very easy to recover due to the nature of a lightweight formula car. They are also wonderful momentum cars, so any over-braking is punishable by a pass.

Coaching: The feedback from the coaches was just as good or better than the AMG and Porsche schools, and very race focused. They push you like crazy to brake LATE, turn tighter, carry more speed, throttle steer, etc. I loved getting asked, “Why are you going so slow in that turn? Too much trail brake!” They were certainly excellent at teaching car control and racing. That being said, the coaches felt like the B team compared to the AMG and Porsche schools, and were not as selfie worthy, if that’s what you’re looking for.

Racing: I can’t imagine a better environment to learn how to race. Spec formula cars, defined exercises for passing, instructors leading you through passes and critiquing your technique. Really amazing opportunity.

Cons:
Car reliability: While I absolutely loved driving the formula cars, they broke down constantly. During my practice session on race day, I went through three cars in a 20 min session. So when I was trying to refine my line for qualifying, I only got two clean laps. That was a serious bummer.

Production value: If the AMG and Porsche schools are white glove, this… is not. Granted, you don’t go to a school like this for the lunch or snacks, but it definitely left something lacking. Similarly, the schedule was… flexible. We were supposed to be there at 8, so everyone showed up by 7:30. But we didn’t get started until 9, and were lucky to be on track by 10:30. Not because of a long lecture or exercises, just because the mechanics were working on the cars. Just bring some snacks you enjoy and a magazine to flip through and you’ll be good.

The essentials:
Price per day: $1,270 - $1,750
Price to SCCA license: $6,350
Time to SCCA license: 5 days schooling
Track locations: PBIR, VIR, Roebling, NJMP, Lime Rock, Pocono
Unique offering: Race series, Car control clinic
Best for: Racers
Website: https://racenow.com/

Additional commentary:
As mentioned in a previous post, I signed up for their race series in 2019. It’s a total of 8 race weekends at 6 different tracks. Fully arrive and drive in their cars. They even provide suits and helmets if you don’t have them. What’s more amazing is that if you don’t want to commit to the series, you can sign up for a single race. It seems like a great opportunity to try out racing without getting too invested in a car, trailer, etc. And, you get to learn to race and test your skills against some really talented drivers.

CrazyFast

Part 5: HPDE – final chapter
Over the course of the last year (my first on track), I attended a total of 8 different HPDE events. These were spread across PCA (two different regions), Chin, and Trackmasters (WGI specific). These events were done at Watkins Glen, NJMP Thunderbolt, and Lime Rock. As additional context, I’m currently running in Intermediate run groups for PCA and Chin and Open track for TrackMasters.

For folks who haven’t been on track with HPDE, you’ll be initially placed in a “Green” run group with other newbie drivers. These drivers generally have 12 or less days on track, so anywhere from 1-2 years experience depending on how quickly they ran down the rabbit hole. A normal schedule will be to have 4 on-track sessions of 20-30 min each. This is also usually accompanied by some classroom sessions, and occasionally some exercises.

Coaching is done in-car, so you’ll need to have a two-seater with equivalent safety equipment. This has its pros and cons. For good instructors, they are helping you think one step ahead, and looking to the next turn, car, flag station, etc. For bad instructors, they are keeping you thinking about the last turn, how you missed the apex by 6 inches, and how you could have improved turn-in. And, having someone constantly chirping in your ear can be distracting to say the least.

Progression through different levels is highly host-dependent, but universally requires a “check-out” run, where you’ll have an instructor in car with you evaluating your driving capabilities. In general, the instructors are evaluating your ability to drive the beginner line on track, as well as your situational awareness and ability to pass and be passed with point-by’s. As an example, one of the tasks during one of my check-out rides was to call out each flag station and status of flags at that station. You can imagine it takes a lot of focus to drive the line while explicitly looking for and calling out flags. Here is a good example of run group criteria from NNJR PCA: https://nnjr-pca.com/wp-content/uplo...t-Criteria.pdf

Clientele at HPDE is almost as varied as the different events themselves. As an example, PCA is generally a very collegial group, where the off-track camaraderie is almost as important as the time on track. On the other end of the spectrum are “invite only” events and test day HPDE events that are like practice days for racing with open passing and no point-by’s. In general, I would say the spectrum for national events is something like: Make-specific (PCA/BMW) -> Chin -> HOD -> NASA -> Open lapping. Not comprehensive, and not trying to start a war here, but that’s at least my impression based on reading on the forums.

One of my biggest recommendations is to find a group where you will be doing exercises for on-track driving. My impression is that in many groups there is too much of a focus on learning to drive the line and point-by on the long straights. The problem then comes when you advance to a higher group and are expected to do late point-by’s and off-line corner entry. If you’re not comfortable doing this at a slow speed, introducing it at a high speed can be disastrous. One of the best exercises I did with Trackmasters, in their BEGINNER group was side-by-side driving. So, you were paired up with another driver and then drove all of WGI next to someone. Makes you much more comfortable with being off-line. Doing this in a controlled environment at moderate speed was way better than trying it for the first time in a White run group.

The second recommendation is to find a group that is more lenient with the “rules”. As an example, I did one event with a group where there was a strict rule to point-by in the direction of the upcoming turn. This is certainly best practice, but gets complicated when you have a transition situation. This happened to me where I was closing quickly on the driver in front coming out of a left hander. They fully tracked out right and pointed me by on the left, with an upcoming right hander. I took the pass, and subsequently got berated by the lead instructor. While I understand the logic, the problem is when you are trained with a mentality of “you must”, then the only thing you expect is for drivers to do what they must. When they don’t, you have a problem.

Another data point to back up the above is the “happy hour” at Chin events. What’s amazing about this is that you are on track with ALL run groups at the end of the day. You’re not trying to set down a record lap time, but it’s a phenomenal tool for situational awareness and to practice passing and being passed. When you’re approaching a driver and have no idea of their experience, I guarantee you'll approach it differently than if you expect them to only do the required point-by on the straight towards the upcoming turn.

Final recommendation is to work on car control both on and off track. There are some groups that have car control clinics (SCDA), and some that incorporate car control into their beginner and intermediate sessions. However, depending on how fast you want to drive, if you’ve never taken your car beyond the limits, it would be a bad idea to do this for the first time in a cup car with slicks. Maybe better to try it first at lower speeds on your street tires in a controlled environment.

I should also note that I did one day of Auto-X last year, and absolutely hated it. I think we had 4 runs through the course, and run times were maybe 1:30. So, total of 6 minutes of driving for the day. Not my cup of tea.

Pros:
Your car: If you have a car you love, HPDE is a great opportunity to get it on track. This is what initially brought me to track driving, as I didn’t want to go to jail for trying to push my P-car on public roads.

Track variety: You can drive any track in the world. Want to set a record at Nuburgring? Go for it!

Cost: This is likely the cheapest way to get on track. Especially if you have a daily driver sports car that you’d like to do a few track days per year, the track time, insurance, and running costs should be lower than schools and “experience” events

Coaches: For very little money, it’s possible for you to get some excellent coaching.

Cons:
Coaches: Unfortunately, it’s also possible for you to get some really bad coaches. And, your coach is being asked to ride in the car with you putting their life on the line along with yours. You can imagine the coaching is going to be a little more conservative than if they were doing so from race control.

Trains: This is highly variable, depending on the host, run group, etc. But sometimes the session gets a little crowded and you can get caught up behind someone who points by one car per passing zone.

Car variety: Every car needs to be driven differently to get the most out of it. Some are momentum cars, and some are more point and shoot. One of my most frustrating experiences on track was driving a fast-cornering GT4 riding up the gearbox of a Ferrari in every corner and then watching them pull away without a point-by on the straights. If you can find a group that has at least a few cars similar to yours, the on-track time becomes much better when you run together.

The essentials:
Price per day: ~$300 - $3,000+
Price to SCCA license: $2,00 (rough estimate of absolute minimum)
Time to SCCA license: ~1-2 years
Track locations: All
Unique offering: Car rental programs
Best for: All flavors
Websites:
ClubReg (PCA and other groups): https://clubregistration.net/
Motorsportsreg (PCA, SCCA and other groups): https://www.motorsportreg.com/
Chin: http://chintrackdays.com/
Hooked on Driving: https://www.hookedondriving.com/

Additional commentary:
The price to license is highly variable, and very much depends on the path you take, as the cost to run on track is highly dependent on the vehicle you’re running, the host of your events, and the coaching or other support you bring. As an example, professional coaching from a top-tier coach can be $1,500 per day, and tire costs can easily be $2,000 for a weekend. Here’s a link to a helpful spreadsheet that shows race classes and running costs (as always, the numbers are highly debatable): https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...gid=1940004030

Absolute minimum to get a PCA license is 12 days of race track driving experience, of which 6 must be with PCA. You could theoretically do 6 days on track, 6 days of Auto-X and then go racing with PCA. That would be pretty scary if you ask me, but it’s possible. Here’s a link to their application: https://pcaclubracing.org/wp-content...ation-Form.pdf

Final point if you are just starting this journey is that it is not cheap by any means, but it is an amazing sport that will push you along all dimensions as far as you let it. As Junior Johnson put it: The best way to make a small fortune in racing is to start with a big one.

seanseidman

Thank you so much-you have provided much clarity to a murky topic.

I would add that with PCA race licence- you must be signed off by the HPDE Chair in your region;not gonna happen with small driving history.
Re trains on track; stop in pit to change flow, and report the offending driver/s to the event coordinators.

CrazyFast

My pleasure Sean. Great point on PCA race license. Haven't gone down that route myself, so don't have any real knowledge of the process. Any additional commentary by you or other experienced folks on best practices would be great to add in.

Agreed on trains. Definitely taken that route more than once.

seanseidman

PCA awards a provisional race licence to new applicants.
An "X" must remain on the back of the car for 4 races (covering second event), and is removed when clean history can be documented.
The novice racer must attend the Friday test day,fun race and classroom sessions.

br911

Yes, I have the package and the credit has been confirmed - the only problem is that their Advanced school, which I can apply the credit for, is booked for the year. I am waitlisted, but it looks like it will have to be in 2020. They only offer the Advanced 2 day school 4 times a year in Thermal. I have no interest in their 1 day

chartersb

PCA requires 12 signed off solo days with PCA (or BMWCCA) as well as the region's Chief Instructor sign off. Track exercises are helpful but more solo laps with the fastest group are better. Tell your region's chief instructor that you want to go PCA Club Racing and let him (or her) help guide you. Your write-up was objective and informative, excellent work. Good luck