PCA rules: Requiring Arm Restraints for open roof cars during HPDE
10-27-2018, 05:30 PM
#16
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you can still comply with the rule and have your way by either using longer restraints that do not interfering with your motion or wearing restraints not connected to your belts. Last I checked no organization checked to see that your personal protective equipment was properly implemented on the grid.
I don’t care what someone’s personal opinion is on required safety equipment for the organization they’re running with.
To advocate that they intentionally flout or disregard the rules by defeating the purpose of the gear (too long an arm extension, such that the tips of their fingers are able to extend over the top of their helmet) or not even connect the restraints to their buckle is not only absurd, but wrong and potentially exposing them to actions that will shorten their competition career, either officially or through physical harm.
in thirty years of wearing these things, I’ve been checked on the grid so often, it’s not funny. Been caught out more than once or twice, too.
C’mon. Don’t tell people that ****, they might try it...
10-27-2018, 06:03 PM
#17
WRONGLY ACCUSED!
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That’s some of the first bad advice you’ve given on this forum, and I’m going to call you out on it. From a well traveled and experienced SCCA racer, too!
I don’t care what someone’s personal opinion is on required safety equipment for the organization they’re running with.
To advocate that they intentionally flout or disregard the rules by defeating the purpose of the gear (too long an arm extension, such that the tips of their fingers are able to extend over the top of their helmet) or not even connect the restraints to their buckle is not only absurd, but wrong and potentially exposing them to actions that will shorten their competition career, either officially or through physical harm.
in thirty years of wearing these things, I’ve been checked on the grid so often, it’s not funny. Been caught out more than once or twice, too.
C’mon. Don’t tell people that ****, they might try it...
10-27-2018, 09:09 PM
#18
I'm not advising it. I'm reporting on it. This is being done everyday! People don't wear their nomex socks. It is hot and their suits are unzipped. How many drive tintops with visors up? How many have oily or torn suits? I have seen guys refill cars spill gas on firesuits and not bat an eyelash. I know a guy who always wears his HANS "over" his 3" body belt. He is legal per the GCR.
Darwinism...I believe in educating people not babysitting them.
10-27-2018, 09:40 PM
#19
Instructor
I believe the GCR has wording that requires the safety harness, HANS, and helmet to be used properly. If you think not, then write them and they will add it to the next edition.
10-27-2018, 09:57 PM
#20
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I don't know. I must have the best grid workers, or the biggest SOB stewards around, because at many of the races I attend, they've checked JUST THESE THINGS.
Specifically, socks and shoes (and I've seen people sent back to the paddock from the grid for cotton or wool socks), busted zippers, et cetera.
I've had this happen at Road Atlanta, VIR, Summit, Savannah, Daytona, Lime Rock and the Glen in the last few years.
The Summit folks, even when I raised my arms and the restraints stopped the upward travel, came over, reached in the car and gave them a yank.
I have had my helmet strap caught undone a time or three (when rushing to the grid) by eagle-eyed grid folks. That said, they missed my HANS tethers being undone last month at VIR...
I don't think these violations in the proper use of safety equipment are near as common as you say...
Specifically, socks and shoes (and I've seen people sent back to the paddock from the grid for cotton or wool socks), busted zippers, et cetera.
I've had this happen at Road Atlanta, VIR, Summit, Savannah, Daytona, Lime Rock and the Glen in the last few years.
The Summit folks, even when I raised my arms and the restraints stopped the upward travel, came over, reached in the car and gave them a yank.
I have had my helmet strap caught undone a time or three (when rushing to the grid) by eagle-eyed grid folks. That said, they missed my HANS tethers being undone last month at VIR...
I don't think these violations in the proper use of safety equipment are near as common as you say...
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10-27-2018, 10:20 PM
#21
10-27-2018, 10:23 PM
#22
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I don't know. I must have the best grid workers, or the biggest SOB stewards around, because at many of the races I attend, they've checked JUST THESE THINGS.
Specifically, socks and shoes (and I've seen people sent back to the paddock from the grid for cotton or wool socks), busted zippers, et cetera.
I've had this happen at Road Atlanta, VIR, Summit, Savannah, Daytona, Lime Rock and the Glen in the last few years.
The Summit folks, even when I raised my arms and the restraints stopped the upward travel, came over, reached in the car and gave them a yank.
I have had my helmet strap caught undone a time or three (when rushing to the grid) by eagle-eyed grid folks. That said, they missed my HANS tethers being undone last month at VIR...
I don't think these violations in the proper use of safety equipment are near as common as you say...
Specifically, socks and shoes (and I've seen people sent back to the paddock from the grid for cotton or wool socks), busted zippers, et cetera.
I've had this happen at Road Atlanta, VIR, Summit, Savannah, Daytona, Lime Rock and the Glen in the last few years.
The Summit folks, even when I raised my arms and the restraints stopped the upward travel, came over, reached in the car and gave them a yank.
I have had my helmet strap caught undone a time or three (when rushing to the grid) by eagle-eyed grid folks. That said, they missed my HANS tethers being undone last month at VIR...
I don't think these violations in the proper use of safety equipment are near as common as you say...
A pit out person like this is a gold standard.
He also motions me to demonstrate that HANS tethers are attached and my chin strap is tight.
10-28-2018, 02:51 PM
#24
I'm in....
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We used to get arm restraints checked in SPBs all the time on grid with PCA but since they allowed roof nets instead, nobody seems to check anymore. They checked belts and HANs at every race I attended this year. They even caught that my radio had come unplugged at one race.
10-28-2018, 03:12 PM
#25
The Penguin King
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10-29-2018, 10:07 PM
#26
Perfect Angel
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Are you actually complaining about a safety device being required?
While the canvas top may not seem like much protection they are designed by serious engineer types to stay in place in an accident. A roof net provides similar protection.
No roof is no protection. The thin fiberglass fake roofs on some race cars are not designed by serious engineers to stay in place. They disintegrate. They are not protection.
And in our chapter, DE or race, the grid checks all your safety devices. All of them. Every time. Even of you are late for the session they don't let you roll on out to get track time. they stop you and check your safety devices.
You seem to have PCA specific issues. I think the answer to all your problems is pretty clear.
See the pictures at the end of this video:
While the canvas top may not seem like much protection they are designed by serious engineer types to stay in place in an accident. A roof net provides similar protection.
No roof is no protection. The thin fiberglass fake roofs on some race cars are not designed by serious engineers to stay in place. They disintegrate. They are not protection.
And in our chapter, DE or race, the grid checks all your safety devices. All of them. Every time. Even of you are late for the session they don't let you roll on out to get track time. they stop you and check your safety devices.
You seem to have PCA specific issues. I think the answer to all your problems is pretty clear.
See the pictures at the end of this video:
Last edited by Streak; 10-29-2018 at 10:57 PM.
10-31-2018, 05:39 PM
#27
Rennlist Member
As I said in my PM to you a few days ago, the wrist restraints are a known and proven part of the safety regimen and are only for YOUR safety. If you do not like PCA's stance on them, there are other organizations you can run with that do not require them.
Personally I think the biggest obstacle for you here is simply getting accustomed to putting them on and getting comfortable with them. I use wrist restraints all the time. Have I ever forgotten them? Yes, but it is extraordinarily rare.
I remember first using restraints and thinking how much of a pain in the butt they were. They felt restrictive and the routine of attaching them added some time to my getting in the car. Now I feel as naked without them as I would without a HANS. For that matter I recall that when I first wore a HANS I felt it was also restrictive and uncomfortable. Now I wouldn't dare go out without it on.
My wife and I have driven two Boxsters (caged with hard shell) and she now drives a Global Mx-5 (fully caged but no hard top). We also drive Formula Mazda and an Ariel Atom. Yes, wrist restraints all the time.
Please think about changing your stance.
You may be a great driver for all I know but you strike me as a bit green when you talk flippantly about issues like these and your attitude toward PCA.
Personally I think the biggest obstacle for you here is simply getting accustomed to putting them on and getting comfortable with them. I use wrist restraints all the time. Have I ever forgotten them? Yes, but it is extraordinarily rare.
I remember first using restraints and thinking how much of a pain in the butt they were. They felt restrictive and the routine of attaching them added some time to my getting in the car. Now I feel as naked without them as I would without a HANS. For that matter I recall that when I first wore a HANS I felt it was also restrictive and uncomfortable. Now I wouldn't dare go out without it on.
My wife and I have driven two Boxsters (caged with hard shell) and she now drives a Global Mx-5 (fully caged but no hard top). We also drive Formula Mazda and an Ariel Atom. Yes, wrist restraints all the time.
Please think about changing your stance.
You may be a great driver for all I know but you strike me as a bit green when you talk flippantly about issues like these and your attitude toward PCA.
10-31-2018, 05:54 PM
#28
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11-01-2018, 09:37 AM
#30
Three Wheelin'
Originally Posted by fhp911
I just came upon this thread and don't know the background.
What is the new PCA rule regarding DE?
Tia,
Fred
What is the new PCA rule regarding DE?
Tia,
Fred