Der ABT

I always accelerate....cause I drive flat out...Matt I thought you understood flat out physics


much like a seatbelt on the street, generally saves lives, but every So often, the person not wearing one makes out best...

some crashes a burm may save lives, some a tire wall, some a gravel trap.......it just depends

Coochas

No, not at all. This is the dysfunctional side of Rennlist at its best.
The memory of a fallen enthusiast and a seriously hurt instructor has been set aside for pettiness by the faux experts.

LuigiVampa

Yes.

Bottom line - its a dangerous sport and if you aren't aware of that you should hang up your helmet.

Amen.

Frank 993 C4S

mglobe

docwyte

None of us are being disrepectful of the two individuals involved. We're having a discussion on how to best avoid having this situation occur again, nothing more respectful than that. If you don't care to participate, that's your choice.

hf1

+1
I found the discussion interesting, illuminating, and not at all disrespectful.

DTMiller

+1. If something happens to me at a track, please use that opportunity to figure out ways to prevent it from happening again to somebody else.

Akunob

Veloce Raptor

None of you know what happened beyond rumor and supposition. Thus it is impossible to accurately discuss how to "prevent it from happening again ".

Geez.

docwyte

So we shouldn't have a discussion at all? I've found out that the car was running all oemsafety equipment. There's a discussion right there, that's already occured in this thread. What about not having right seat instruction? Yup, talked about in this thread. How about the earthern berm, or tracks that have grossly inadequate safety (cough, cough, Summit Point, cough, cough). Yup, talked about here.

I don't understand your point, are we to just put our fingers in our ears not try to affect a positive change?

Veloce Raptor

My point is that all we know for sure is the driver and vehicle failed to brake for T1, and the passenger had to steer to avoid impacting the vehicle ahead. When it went off track subsequently, it rolled.

I have seen vehicles roll over in T1 of COTA (arguably the "safest" track), T1 of the Glen, T1 of Road America, T1 of Road Atlanta, T1 of Summit Main, T1/T2 of TWS, T1 of MSR Cresson, T1 of CMP, T1 of Chuckwalla....the list goes on. See the common theme? T1 !!!

Until more FACTS are known, this discussion has no real merit.

DTMiller

No, you don't have to know every fact to discuss a concept. We can have a discussion inspired by the events that unfolded and reach conclusions, views and opinions without knowing anything other than that an incident happened.

It's believed that the driver had a medical event. If that ends up not being true that doesn't mean a discussion of whether medical screening could have value is not worth having. There's been a good discussion of the pros and cons of that already.

The car rolled over after hitting the berm. Whether that berm is the best available choice for that track is a discussion worth having.

etc
etc

Ritter v4.0

Manifold

Exactly. Incidents don't generally repeat themselves in every detail, but we can learn from each incident and especially from incident patterns. To avoid discussion intended to learn from incidents and prevent future incidents, instead chalking the incidents up to bad luck and asserting that the people involved knew the risk, and only they could potentially be at any fault, isn't a way to "respect" them.