Mark Hubley

Here is the response I received today from Toyo:

Mr. Hubley,
Thank you for your patience while Toyo was in review of the tire concerns sent into Toyo Tires. Toyo Tires found no manufacturing anomaly with the R888R 295/30ZR18 and the few tires that were received one tire had a road hazard puncture and the others had signs of being ran under inflated.

Based off of your email it clearly shows that you are maintaining your tires and air pressures appropriately as your tires are performing as designed. If you ever feel you are having a tire issue it is best to have it removed from service and taken to a tire professional to inspect to assure its integrity.

We do always recommend after driving on the track that you make sure your air pressures have been brought back up to the appropriate pressure for regular highway use.

I have no idea if any of "the few tires that were received" include any of the tires that failed at Summit Point.

ExMB

I love the comment about "inspected by a professional". Does that include the run of the mill local tire shops or does that mean sending it in for them to evaluate?

the_vetman

This is the email I got:

"Thank you for contacting Toyo Tires USA. You would need to have your Toyo dealer return the tire for a warranty evaluation on your behalf. Please note tire that have been run flat to destruction can void the tire warranty as well as tires used on a track.
Your dealer can further assist you with submitting a claim on your behalf."

Good thing my dealer hasn't even responded yet. Then I have to pay for shipping to the dealer. Then I may or may not get any credit (not holding my breath).

Veloce Raptor

I am confused.

Is Toya claiming that using its TRACK tires on TRACK voids the warranty??

Mark Hubley

It seems that's the world we live in

With Toyo apparently pointing to improper inflation pressures as a cause of failure, I asked them for advice on proper pressures. I received this response:

Proper inflation pressures can only be determined through testing and measuring tire temperatures with a probe pyrometer. Monitoring temperatures across the tread will help you determine an appropriate set-up. There is not one pressure setting that will work for all vehicles, set-ups, driving styles, ambient temperatures and tracks.

OK, I get that conditions vary, but it annoys me that they will blame tire failures on improper inflation pressures and not give any guidance on what is best for the tires.

I wonder if the customer service department and the legal department at Toyo overlap?

David993S

That's how I read it too. In addition to the evasive, non-answer on inflation, the warranty being voided if used on track is interesting. If true, for general principle everyone should boycott Toyo tires and never buy another Toyo for track or otherwise. Would one receive the same kind of a response (i.e. tracking voids warranty) from Nitto, Bridgestone, etc.? I'm guessing it's a liability issue mandated by their lawyers.

GPA951s

Ah Crap, I have a brand new Set of these, but they are 17's ... Agree Hoosier is the way to go but Im not Racing YET! Just Built the car, wanted a Decent tire to shake it down with... So what is a good Alternative , Cost-wise, Im looking for something Track worthy that im NOT going to race.. once I get the car all squared away.. Then the Hoosiers go on..

LaSource

This is not an isolated issue with respect to the R888R tyres.

For a start just because Toyo did not have the imagination to come up with a different tyre name, let's not confuse the R888 and the newer R888R. They are different tyres, treads, etc. I do not believe any previous experience on R888 is all that relevant to the newer R888R tyres.

I also have a KTM XBow (lightweight track european track car). The German XBow forums have been reporting multiple R888R tyre failures on the 800kg XBow. Same issue - rear inside shoulder failure.

I also have an E46 M3. This time I had front wheel inner shoulder wear. Fortunately I spotted it prior to failure. When I removed the tyres it was obvious they were deteriorating from the INSIDE which you would not notice from the outside!

My view is these are to be avoided on all platforms - light or heavy. They are a very good track tyre (from a grip perspective), however the safety issue cannot be ignored imv.

Toyo have been informed in Europe and sounds like in US as well however the response seems to be the same luke warm response.


-----------------------
Reference material to back up the above. You may need Google translate

http://www.xbow-forum.eu/wbb/board58...35-semi-slick/

http://www.xbow-forum.eu/wbb/board58...r-die-zukunft/

Mark Hubley

Who can translate some German? Looks like a similar failure on a Lotus.

http://lotus-forum.forumprofi.de/the...ure-t2479.html

https://goo.gl/images/RQWkEp

Mark Hubley

OK, looks like that's another reference to the X-Bow incident.

ghostofpain

Hard to tell if the tire is the bad boy here. The load index and the tire pressure are bound together. If you lower the pressure u do lower the load index. So if you start with a too low cold pressure, the damage could be instant. I have seen pilot sport cup2s with cracked side wall cause of too low cold pressure. Hot pressure is 2,55 bar... on the rears. Wouldnt be too clever to start with 1,8 bar cold.
Maybe the these tires with specific DOT were made during night shift...

On the other hand, the tire isnt made for speeds over 186mph.

I do use toyos R88 and i am quite happy with them. Maybe i give the R888Rs a chance, since the are so much more cheaper than the yokos A058.

steved0x

I am running 225/45/17 and 255/40/17 on my track Boxster and have been running a set of Maxxis RC-1 for the last 5 track days (2 open days at Roebing, 2 PCA days at Roebling, and 1 day at Road Atlanta), and also driving to/from these events on the tire (maybe 1200 street miles in addition to the track driving. The tires have worn just a tiny bit more than 1/32" (6/32") new.

Lap times were 1:28 at Roebling and 1:52 at Road Atlanta (I am still learning )

The RC-1 makes little growl you can hear and feel when sliding at the limit (at least for understeer) and the new patches of pavement at RA they will squeal.

If you are an SCCA member there is a discount code on the SCCA website under the About->Member Benefits section.

Might be a good candidate for a shakedown tire? Or wait for the next holiday and get a set of NT-01 at a discount from Discount Tire Direct?

Good luck with your shakedown!

Steve

Blue Chip

Just a heads up - 2 more cars had the same issue within a couple of weeks of each other down here in FL... sidewall issues on the R888R's.

Just be careful.

mmuller

I have had 4 sets on my 991 GT3 in the 20 inch sizes and no problems at all. Ran them on very hot days and just come back from a very rainy weekend at WGI. No problem at all with them.

I still maintain people are running to low of a pressure in them. I have probably had 20 or 30 sets of these and never seen an issue.