superquant

Recent press and final production car images and specifications have me becoming increasingly interested in the 918 .. I will admit to being a major skeptic of the car when it was first announced because of both its weight and price but I am rapidly starting to think that it is in fact going to be the best all around vehicle of the current crop of hypercars.

The main things that attract me are

- usability / versatility
- build quality
- performance
- exterior and interior design

I am a CGT owner and could see the 918 complementing that car well, although the financial implications are such that it would be a significant stretch to keep both (in addition to the Singer I am building!).

My biggest question is around the wisdom of getting involved as original owner vs seeing what happens in the secondary market. I fear a repeat of the CGT situation and original owners getting pummeled while wise buyers save tons of $ on pre-owned cars. I also wonder whether this car has the timeless elements that the CGT has or if it is the first of a string of hybrid supercars that will get progressively better over the next 10 years, as battery tech improves for example. In my situation it would be a major bummer to find myself reselling the car and losing 200k after a few years.

Thoughts? The deal with the order is that I put down a 200k deposit that is refundable up until 6 months prior to the build date. The allocation I would slot into would be ~ Dec 2014 so I would have till June 2014 to figure it out, presumably test drive one, etc. My dealer told me there have been 500 orders thus far with 160 in the USA, so there are plenty of cars left.

Should I just sit tight, wait for my Singer and see what happens after that? Or should I get clever and scrounge up the deposit soon assuming the positive press about this car is going to fuel faster ordering?

Thanks for humoring my addictive personality.

mousecatcher

If you're worried about resale value or used discount vs new, even an iota, then may I humbly suggest that an $845,000 car is not for you?

Of course the tech will get better over the next decade. That's a given.

Assuming you register the car in CT, you'll lose $60k on day 1 due to sales tax.

niche

I would wait, but then again, I can't afford the thing.

superquant

I respectfully disagree in terms of worrying about resale value. I believe it is common sensical to consider this as a factor and unwise to ignore. Losing 200k on a car won't change my lifestyle but all things considered I would prefer not to. As such I am trying to weigh the probability of that happening rather than just blindly stroking checks.

I know folks for whom 800k is about 1 month worth of interest income and they are asking themselves the same question. It's simply foolish to burn money, no matter how much you have. At least that's my belief.

The sales tax I agree is a sunk cost.

XR4Tim

Register somewhere without sales tax. Montana, Alaska, etc.

tcsracing1

the car will depreciate.

I believe that some of them will indeed find the used market and have low miles due to lack of use.

Once out of warranty there is too much crap to worry about that is also becoming further dated each year.

The car will be a 5 year novelty.

I love the styling and performance however
Golf cart mode also appears cool for city driving.

008

I think the car is gorgeous and would sign up for a sub $500k version without the hybrid nonsense weighing less than 3k pounds. As it stands the car is likely to lose a substantial amount of value in the first few years. Just look at the sales velocity. No one is buying them now. The LaFerrari is impossible to get and was sold out in an hour of phone calls. The P1 is close to that. The Porsche on the other hand has been available and known about much longer yet there are plenty of cars. Granted they are building more of the Porsches but they're not building a lot. When the CGT was new but at the end of its production cycles, dealers were urged and incentivized to buy them for the floor as a showcase and most of those had significant discounts as new. I'd say pass if it meant getting rid of your CGT. Get an F12 for less than half, the ultimate expression of a GT car and likely also the last of its kind.

mousecatcher

Oh, don't get me wrong. I agree with you and would worry about it myself. As such, this car is not for me and I am suggesting it probably isn't for you. I care about it costing me $200k (plus the opportunity cost on the $700k) to own the car. Not to mention operating cost, and we know how high that is on the CGT. To me, $200k +/- isn't going to be worth the fun I'd get out of it.

I mean, I avoid the $40k rolex (which I can afford without blinking) solely because the depreciation on it is enough to buy the $10k rolex, and then some. So I opt for the base model.

If I had $100MM net worth of course I wouldn't care about $200k and would do it in a heartbeat.

zirrah

I think honestly, the fact that you need to ask answers the question. If it doesn't speak to you, why buy it?

Stephen Pitts

I think the 918 is very appealing from an intellectual point of view; its tremendous capabilities on and off of the track are more than remarkable. Its silent mode is fascinating. It quickly wins the mind over from an analytical point of view...

But the key question as well put by zirrah: does it speak to you? When I watched videos like these (https://vimeo.com/5583748 & https://vimeo.com/41087057), my heart just desired this car. When I see the 918 (and again, I am not currently a big race track fan), I think wow how fast can you zip down the track. Sure I definitely would want to try and drive it; but I just don't get that same indescribable crazy urge (at least not yet) to drive it like I do with the CGT. That being said, the cost is also an issue for me (although I have spent a lot on my CGT which I would never give up). So for now its se leve, but I do help the 918 continues to sell very well and I am sure there will be a day that some hot rod in a 918 will approach me on the freeway in my car and will want to prove that he's demonstrably faster -- and I will easily see him pass while I listen to the beautiful harmony HOWLING from my V10 engine as I follow him down the way (enjoying the scenery of the 918). And that same V10 engine will still cause excitement and fascination all over as I tour through new places in Europe. My heart is completely won over by it. If I was a serious track guy, though, or wanted a super car to drive every single day around town, I would pony up for the 918. But it would be driven by my mind. Nonetheless, all is good...

DreamCarrera

+1




Personally, if I were in the market for a 918 I would wait and purchase a pristine used example in about two years. In that time I think the car will depreciate at least 15% from MSRP. Porsche is simply building too many 918s for the car to hold its value and not depreciate from its lofty initial purchase price.

The only modern P supercar that we have to serve as an example is the CGT. In the case of the CGT, the car experienced 25% +/- depreciation after a few years on the market. Yes, Porsche did build slightly more CGTs than the planned number of 918 builds, however the MSRP for the CGT was only about half that of the 918 thus leaving the CGT with a much broader market base of potential purchasers.

In the end, IMHO, the 918s large build numbers combined with its high MSRP(not to mention the large number of competitor hypercars hitting the market now) almost guarantees a 15-20%+ depreciation curve over the next several years...after that, all bets are off.

mousecatcher

I don't quite understand this comment.

Porsche has already sold as many 918's as McLaren and Ferrari have sold of their respective cars. Sales velocity? There are plenty of cars because they are making more of them, not because of a lack of desire per se.

superquant

Thanks, I am similarly attracted by the car from the intellectual and curious standpoint too. I do love the way it looks and the technology within it although really hard to tell for me if it is just my normal impulsiveness that is driving this or something more long term.

The track capabilities are attractive although I have already determined that my likely next move for that type of entertainment is to purchase a dedicated track car like a Radical SR3SL or a Praga R1. Much less expensive and probably more visceral than using a road car on a track, even if its a 918.

The safe play is to wait patiently, see what happens over the next couple years to the cars as they land in owner hands. Thats what will very probably happen.

Stephen Pitts

Forgot to mention that I think the Singer is very cool and special (and comes partly from you) -- a real killer for the heart!

Anyhow, there are some interesting lines in the movie "the Beast" (by Eric Bana which is NOT recommended for a non-enthusiast) about cars after he wrecks his baby or "Beast" (which as we know, takes only a couple of seconds out of days of driving). Bana explains that he would never use his own car again in a race because it meant too much to him (and would just rent one as a tool for it).

Having been on so many adventures already in just one summer with my CGT, I have an awful lot of sympathy for that position (at least on the racetrack)! There will probably be 918 owners who overtime develop a similar level of affection for their car and we'll read about it here -- so that may blunt the way we see the car now (chiefly as a technological masterpiece). But, then again, it is in the same movie that Jeremy Clarkson notes that it is the faults in the car which make them more human and endearing. We also note just how big the classic car business has grown in the last 5 years: partly due no doubt to QE, but also partly due to that desire for the intangible charm that some of these cars possess.

So I think that the 918's appeal will continue be more at an analytical level (even the reviews sort of lean in that direction) -- a technological leapfrog that combines everything to date to produce an "everyday" supercar that simply redefines what both an average driver and a gifted driver can achieve on a track (and the point about the feeling generated from dedicated track cars above is an important one). But you've got to find 918 persons who are almost willing to spend collectively a billion dollars to want to own one... Probably doable. But I think that those that have pointed out the downside risk here probably have a good point (as apparently also happened with my beloved CGT, so nothing against the car)! 918 is just a lot of buyers even in today's world. Let's hope that it continues to go well...

brake dust

The other option is the much rumored 960 (918 without the hybrid) - but will that car be too much like the CGT in terms of its characteristics?