How often do you change your oil?
12-31-2011, 09:32 PM
#31
Burning Brakes
Okay Medtech, now I know your reasons (you do indeed have plenty of reasons).
They are well thought out, and I see your point on the not wanting to pay for an expensive engine replacement or rebuild.
I hope you do get as much out of your Cayenne as you want.
I may not agree on doing more oil changes, but I agree on your right to present your logic behind it.
Wouldn't a urinalysis be more akin to an exhaust test?
Happy New Year!
They are well thought out, and I see your point on the not wanting to pay for an expensive engine replacement or rebuild.
I hope you do get as much out of your Cayenne as you want.
I may not agree on doing more oil changes, but I agree on your right to present your logic behind it.
Wouldn't a urinalysis be more akin to an exhaust test?
Happy New Year!
12-31-2011, 10:37 PM
#32
01-01-2012, 05:27 AM
#33
Much missed
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01-01-2012, 06:43 AM
#34
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What is this?
I want a classic "best oil" thread.
Focus on viscosity pls, can't do a Danica with just the intervals.
HNY!
PS.
Divot watch out, you are offering borderline dangerous sig material. At least PP members respect the signature rule and never alter them..
I want a classic "best oil" thread.
Focus on viscosity pls, can't do a Danica with just the intervals.
HNY!
PS.
Divot watch out, you are offering borderline dangerous sig material. At least PP members respect the signature rule and never alter them..
01-01-2012, 12:40 PM
#36
Race Director
I don't really need data on P!gs, since an engine is an engine for the most part. What I do have is common sense. Which tells me that if 10K is the max rated life of an oil, that using it to 20K is BAD, and changing it earlier is better. Exactly how much earlier is certainly up to debate, but it's CHEAP insurance for your engine. I can also look at my oil when I change it and touch the oil. 5K oil is clearer of hard contaminants than 10K oil. Contaminants increase friction. Friction=wear.
01-01-2012, 09:33 PM
#38
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I agree that sending your oil to Blackstone is better than flying blind. But the actual usefulness of that data is akin to me doing a urinalysis and a CBC (complete blood count) on you and telling you that you are in perfect health. Also, IMO, just because you're(SIC) Bimmer didn't blow up before you sold it, is not exactly "hard data". Unless you did a complete engine teardown prior to the sale, the true condition of your engine was nothing but a wild guess.
On the latest BMWs I do the same as I do on the Porsche - use 1/2 interval oil changes (it's easy to remember and seems to give me good test results.) It works out to about 7,500 mile changes.
FWIW - I do run a Yahoo group with about 1,100 BMW-E39 owners on it, and in the 10 years I've run it - I can't recall a single engine failure except a few in Europe when there were problems with the Nicasil block used in the small I6 engine they had. Some of these cars have reached > 300k miles and weren't exactly babied.
As far as the health of the engine - that's only part of the Blackstone report. The other part (which costs a bit more) is the TBN results. This measures the suspended solids in the oil, how much of the additive packages (VI improvers, acid neutralizers, anti-scuff and extreme pressure additives) remains and is useable, and the flash/ash-point (when the oil will start to carbonize.)
Those numbers are the ones that really tell you the condition of the oil and if it's suitable for continued use. They are much more then the CBC test gives an MD.
The two sets of data provide the information:
1. How is your engine wearing? (The trace metals found are usually easily traced back to specific wear components in the engine.)
2. How much longer will the oil continue to function as designed.
Without that data - it's still guesswork or voodoo. Not that there is anything wrong with excessive oil changes (aside from the cost, or the environment, or the claims by some oil sites that new oil doesn't lubricate as well as used oil..) and if it makes you feel warm and fuzzy - go to it. But what I don't agree with is discounting data and claiming that your way is best. My suggestion is that everyone who is concerned spend the $35 and have the complete Blackstone oil test done (with the TBN and extended use parts of the test.) Then base your decision on what you may.. discounting the test without ever seeing one or having one done just doesn't make sense to me.2. How much longer will the oil continue to function as designed.
FWIW - the actual number of oil CAUSED engine failures is probably down in the noise somewhere. And most of those will be an egregious problem, like no oil, or oil never changed, or some woefully inadequate oil being used.
I have learned from owning a 996, that as an engine wears, tolerances change and things can be lurking (think IMS). At that point the type of oil used, and frequency of oil changes CAN make a difference. Since changing the oil more frequently is about the only thing in my control, and the cost of doing that (myself or at an indy) is peanuts in the big picture of Porsche ownership, I choose to err on the side of caution. (I shoot for 5K, but realistically by the time I get around to doing it, it's somewhere between 6-7k.) Obviously, this will do nothing for me if say, my aluminum block cracks, or if I have a coolant failure, etc, etc.
I will now, respectfully get off my soapbox and shut up...
I will now, respectfully get off my soapbox and shut up...
I think we'll have to agree to disagree...
01-02-2012, 12:10 AM
#39
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In the fleet business this has been settled over a decade ago -- with millions of miles on every engine imaginable -- and these cars don't have nice garages and pampering owners.
Even when the current oil starts to degrade it is better then the stuff ten years ago new out of the bottle.
And don't forget we are talking about engines with 9 quarts!
Even when the current oil starts to degrade it is better then the stuff ten years ago new out of the bottle.
And don't forget we are talking about engines with 9 quarts!
01-02-2012, 03:45 PM
#40
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OK Say my oil IS good for 10K and the engine doesnt mind it like the manual says. What about the filter? You have to admit, the filters on these things are ****ty little paper elements. I replace my filter every oil change anyway, but 10K seems like quite a bit for those crappy little things. No?
01-02-2012, 08:23 PM
#41
Three Wheelin'
Actually the paper element is used in most filters and filters down to a very small micron size and has shown to be pretty efficient with little flow restrictions for the cost. I also second Deilenbergers suggestion that anyone arguing the point of this or that for their oil on here should go with an analysis from Blackstone labs. There have been many arguments one way or another but there are different models of Cayenne's out there that stress the oils in different ways with different climates & driving styles and most of all there are many different types of oils that we are all using. Any 996 or Boxster owner should check this out if you haven't already. And there is some interesting oil discussions on his website too. http://www.lnengineering.com/ims.html
01-03-2012, 03:08 AM
#42
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Entertaining thread. Somewhat educational. So my Qs: why are the people running different weights, running those weights (i.e., Xw-50)? And if I wasn't brainwashed into believing my V8 would explode if it did not bathe in Mobil1, what would be considered more premium oils? I heard some positive noise for Redline. What about Amsoil, etc.?
I'm not sure where I stand on the frequency of changes. I may just try to push a 50K interval since there are so many damn torx screws on the underbody panels. And, if I put in really good oil for double the duration, those factors will offset each other, right?
I'm not sure where I stand on the frequency of changes. I may just try to push a 50K interval since there are so many damn torx screws on the underbody panels. And, if I put in really good oil for double the duration, those factors will offset each other, right?
01-03-2012, 12:11 PM
#43
Race Director
Edited
I'm willing to bet that Blackstone oil tests can predict the IMS problem in advance of it failing totally. There will be wear metals showing in the analysis, and they are good enough and know enough about different engines to be able to point pretty accurately to the possible fault.
I think we'll have to agree to disagree...
I'm willing to bet that Blackstone oil tests can predict the IMS problem in advance of it failing totally. There will be wear metals showing in the analysis, and they are good enough and know enough about different engines to be able to point pretty accurately to the possible fault.
I think we'll have to agree to disagree...
http://www.aircooledtechnology.com/
Ah, found it, it's called the IMS Guardian, see:
http://www.flat6innovations.com/
01-03-2012, 12:59 PM
#44
Race Director
If anyone is looking to buy the Motul 8100 X-cess 5w40 in the 5 L jugs it's on sale at TurnerMotorsports.com for $39.95 per jug (I wish I had found that before I placed my order somewhere else).
http://www.turnermotorsport.com/p-24...liter-jug.aspx
Amazon is pretty cheap but they say 1 - 3 MONTH delivery.....
http://www.turnermotorsport.com/p-24...liter-jug.aspx
Amazon is pretty cheap but they say 1 - 3 MONTH delivery.....
