waveforce

Hi,

I need some help from the hive mind of Rennlist in confirming that my Bay Area dealer is basically totally BS'ing me.

I own a 970 (aka Panamera) Turbo S -- 2013 model year.

Back in August last year (2015), I decided I needed a map update -- most glaring annoyance was the new Eastern Span of the Bay Bridge; back in 2012, when the maps on my 2013 Panamera were made, the old span was in place.

The Panamera map update available at the time were part # 997-044-907-61 -- this is actually the same PCM 3.0 map update available for the 997.2 and 987.2, and is very well described in the Suncoast website here: http://www.suncoastparts.com/product/997PCM30.html).

*Production* date of the *map* is 05/2014, which is almost 2 years after the new span was inaugurated. Update was released in March of 2015.

Long story short -- I went to the dealer, left the car, they claim they did the update. Paid for it. Drove around, it it seemed that the map had not changed at all. Drove over the Bay Bridge -- OLD Eastern Span still in the map.

Went back to the dealer, they checked out the car, said the map didn't take. Left the car for a few days, they said it was NOW really done -- drove around, nope, same map, same old Eastern Span.

Went back to the dealer a THIRD time, they kept the car for TWO weeks, they claim the map didn't take again, they claim they got a new nav disc -- got back my car, and well -- same old maps, same old Eastern Span, no change that I can see.

... although I did notice my PCM FIRMWARE version (not to confuse with the map) went BACK to version 3.42 (it was 3.43 a year ago). 3.42 was actually released in 2013...

So now I'm basically fed up and tell them I want my $450 back (that's how much they charged me for the map + dealer installation and activation).

Once I asked for a refund they came back and said this (direct quote):

"Spoke to the tech who worked on your car. That is the way the maps are going to be on your car due to the generation of the PCM it has. In order to take the map update, the PCM version software had to be downgraded a version [3.43 to 3.42] in order for it to take the maps. "

I totally call BS on this one -- especially since firmware 3.42 is specifically dated 07-MAR-2013, which is more than one full year before the maps where even made. Firmware 3.43 is dated 28-APR-2014 which is still before the newest maps (that I paid) where *produced*.

Plus if that was the case they would have either declined to sell the map to me OR told me the above back in August 2015, not after I've gone in 3 times and left the car for several weeks combined.

I also checked the History log that comes up when you press the INFO and SOURCE button and then the "History" button and there's no sign of them ever updating the maps to the latest release -- there's entries of many upgrades and downgrades of the FIRMWARE -- but no sign of an entry showing a change in the MAPS.

My theory is that they actually have no idea how to do the map update and/or have the old 2013 map update and just keep re-applying that one instead of the new one.

So... my questions to you guys are:

1. Is what the dealer saying making any sense to you?
2. Has any of you who own a 970.1, 997.2 or 987.2 gotten the 997-044-907-61 map update? What was your experience? Can you send me a pic of what shows up in your INFO + SOURCE -> History log *and* "Current System" log? What's your current firmware version?
3. Specifically, can anybody who owns a 970.1, 997.2 or 987.2, has installed a nav map update and lives in the San Francisco confirm they have the new Eastern Span in the right place? What dealer did you go to?

This is totally driving me bonkers. HEEEEELP!

sambb

stories like this one push me into thinking about tesla. What a story.

DES GTS

Sorry to hear that. I can tell you is that my SA is reluctant, for some reason, to update the NAV in my 2014 Panamera even though I've asked him about it a couple of times. This may be part of the explanation. I'll follow up with him next week.

waveforce

I actually don't think there is an update for the 2014 Panamera... That's the 970.2 model which has a different PCM I think... Mine is a 2013 which is a 970.1.

DES GTS

I always assumed that they updated the maps each year, but I guess they don't.

waveforce

Well, I decided to take matters into my own hands and test a theory.

The theory was that the dealer did do the PIWIS licensing procedure -- they applied the license key that comes in the 997.044.908.61, by running in the PIWIS system and then applying it to the car with PIWIS connected -- Step 1 in the Porsche instructions -- but never performed Step 2, which is to load the actual new Navigation Database, that is part # 997.642.271.58.

Given the actual navigation database DVDs (997.642.271.58) are under $50, I took the plunge and ordered them from another dealer.

I just loaded them up -- following Step 2 of the instructions that Porsche provides -- and voila! MAPS ARE NOW UPDATED and the bridge is in its new place!!!!

So my theory was correct, and even after 3 trips the dealer never actually applied the new maps! They just licensed them and expected that they would magically come from the ether or something. What morons!!!

My next battle will be to recover what I paid for the Navigation Database DVDs (the actual maps), although given the small amount (in relative terms) I'm not going to push it too much. I'm going to thoroughly rub their incompetence in their faces though.

Final note: I confirmed that the 100% accurate way to verify that maps have been updated is to look for an entry, under INFO + SOURCE -> History log, that looks like this:

Source XXDNNNNN (e.g. 08D21511)
Date: YYYY-MM-DD Time: HH:MM:SS (should be the day/time they applied it)
A.B.C PCM31_NA_N3YY_HHMM_CC (where "YY" should be the year the map data is from -- in this case, "14", and the rest is the time the map data is from).

Example 1:

This is what shows up for the OLD maps, with 2013 data (that were sold in 2014 as the 2015 model year update):

Source: 07D21349
Date: 2015-09-16 Time: 10:24:26
4.6.4 PCM31_NA_N313_1349_P7

This is what shows up for the NEWEST maps, that have 2014 data (that have been sold since 2015 as the 2016 model year update):

Source: 08D21511
Date: 2016-04-22 Time: 17:09:31
4.7.4 PCM31_NA_N314_1511_P6

So: the key identifying element is really the "N314" bit in the "PCM31_NA_N314_1511_P6" string, that tells you it's the 2014 data for the PCM 3.xx firmware.

If anybody has any questions, feel free to ask... I learnt way more about map updates during this than anybody should as a customer (and clearly more than dealers).

P. Viby

Do you say that you can just buy a DVD with updated maps and then load them into the PCM system without using Piwis or anything ?

waveforce

Only *after* the dealer has applied the license using PIWIS. It's always a two-step procedure, and the dealer HAS to do the first step -- my dealer was simply too ignorant to do step 2, but they did do step 1.

ckershner

So, the Dealer HAS to do the first step - Where can I purchase the $50.00 maps and do I need to purchase something else for the first step?

waveforce

Yes, you have to purchase something else for the first step -- you need to purchase an activation code from Porsche. And that's $250 to $300 depending on what dealer you buy it from.

As to the maps, also from a Porsche dealer.

ckershner

Thanks for the info. To bad my garmin updates won't work.....

Mark in Baltimore

Thanks to the user who reported the above post as possibly being spam. There are no embedded hyperlinks nor has the user's IP address been blacklisted. If someone sees a change or anything out of the ordinary, please feel free to flag the post.

Bob Rouleau

I deleted the post since it incites copyright violation. PAG watches us closely.

Best,

ckershner

Hope the spam comment is not about me. I am definitely not spam.

JAG2009

Hello waveforce,
I'm also getting the run-around from Bay Area Dealers on updating the Navigation. From "there is no update" to "purchase the disk from Navteq'' which was bought out years ago and does not have Porsche maps.
Suncoast has disks for PCM 3.0+ and v1.4 or later. But before I purchase these, I need to have confidence that a dealer or someone else has sufficient skill level to complete the update.
Do you have any recommendations? Is there a good resource with instructions? After the dealer does the PIWIS licensing procedure, can I do this myself?
JAG2009