greymda

thats a bummer

JB911

Hello,

I've posted on the other rennlist Piwis threads to ask opinions on which system and vendor to consider purchasing from. I'm also still on the fence between getting a Launch Tech USA Torque or Turbo which offers support for multiple vehicles.

As the Piwis III systems are coming down in price I compiled a list of what seems to be current. Some vendors are offering free shipping to US and other countries. I have a MacBook Pro that's getting older and wouldn't consider the VM option that users took with Piwis II listed on that thread, unless there are Piwis III success stories on Mac/VMware that would justify me buying a new MacBook laptop.

So here's a list of links of what I assume are new vendor sales options, and some might be the same vendor with different websites. Laptops seem to be Panasonic(more expensive)Lenovo Yoga, T440 and T450. Ram varies from 4 to 8GB, and all seem to be I5 CPU, touchscreen, and 2 versions of Piwis software included. Most require sending in SSD for updating, the more expensive ones can be updated online. The newer ones seem to use the PT3G VCI. I'm still trying to find more info and options(windows 7, 8, 10, XP)
It's taken quite some time reading but I see some posters went ahead and bought their systems and seem to be satisfied with vendor and option.

From obdcartool.com, free shipping,
Lenovo T440
$1159.89
https://www.obd2cartool.com/porsche-...-to-use-p-1675

Lenovo Yoga
$1299:
https://www.obd2cartool.com/porsche-...13ijlbcmlv2911

From uobdii.com, free shipping:
$1199
https://www.uobdii.com/wholesale/por...-software.html

$1599, Panasonic CF-MX3 laptop, "Free Update Online. There will be usb key in package for you to update online when new version release. No Need to Return SSD back"
https://www.uobdii.com/wholesale/por...al-driver.html

From vxdas.com, Lenovo Yoga:
$1319 plus shipping:
https://www.vxdas.com/products/oem-p...96b314fb&_ss=r

$1599 plus shipping, Piwis III for Porsche with V39.500.025 Piwis Software SSD Installed on Panasonic CF-MX3 Laptop Windows 8, Update Online with USB Dongle (SP44-1):
https://www.vxdas.com/products/piwis...32431552135250

$1399, this one has the different VCI. Does anyone know the details and difference? It says:

• New VCX-DoIP J2534 Piwis 3 Interface diagnostic technique based on Ethereum
• VCX-DoIP J2534 Piws 3 Diagnosis Tool for luxury vehicles but without lots of requirements:

https://www.vxdas.com/products/vcx-d...96b314fb&_ss=r

From autonumen.com, free shipping on some kits, not all(?) Lenovo T450:
$1195
https://www.autonumen.com/goods-7119...50-Laptop.html

$1324 Lenovo Yoga S1, but not free shipping:
https://www.autonumen.com/goods-7050...12-Laptop.html

$1138 Lenovo T440,V39.900 + V39.700 Software, free shipping
https://www.autonumen.com/goods-7127...dy-To-Use.html

$1480, Panasonic CF-MX3, plus shipping:
https://www.autonumen.com/goods-7125...X3-Laptop.html

$1481 with Dell E7450 laptop, not sure if it's touchscreen, +shipping

https://www.autonumen.com/goods-6920...X3-Laptop.html

$1188, VXDIAG VCI, Lenovo T440P, free shipping
https://www.autonumen.com/goods-6826...0P-Laptop.html

From obd360.com
Panasonic CF-MX3, free shipping
$1599:
https://www.obd360.com/wholesale/por...r-piwis-3.html

Lenovo T440
$1179:
https://www.obd360.com/wholesale/por...dy-to-use.html

From vxdiagshop.com
Panasonic CF-MX3, Update: Free Update via U disk, connect U disk to laptop, reboot laptop, enter update page, then contact us. No need return laptop.
$1599, free shipping:
https://www.vxdiagshop.com/wholesale...stic-tool.html

Lenovo T440, Windows 8, 500GB drive, 4GB Ram
$1199, Free shipping:
https://www.vxdiagshop.com/wholesale...with-t440.html

From obd365.com
Lenovo T440, 500GB drive
$1199, free shipping
https://www.obdii365.com/wholesale/p...-with-ssd.html

From hobdII.com. This vendor also says "Get Best Price Please Contact: sales@hobdii.com"
Panasonic CF-MX3, Free Update via U disk, connect U disk to laptop, reboot laptop, enter update page, then contact us. No need return laptop:
$1487
https://www.hobdii.com/wholesale/por...al-driver.html
Lenovo T440
$1115
https://www.hobdii.com/wholesale/vxd...novo-t440.html

runbuh

I can tell you who NOT to buy from: vxdas. Support has been horrible. Also - verify IN WRITING before you purchase that the VAS6154 (the OBD2II dongle) will work with a system set to the current date. Many of us are having to set our computer's date back to "anything in 2020". it's trivial, but a pain to remember as you're likely not using this every day.

If you buy from vxdas, be aware of the following (many of these points probably apply to other clones, but at least other companies probably provide better service):

- You will get a used laptop (my battery is good for 30 minutes, but I know how to replace it)
- The laptop will be BIOS locked (supervisor and user passwords, you will NOT be given the supervisor password). User password will be 123456 (vendors typically state this on their web site). The newer Thinkpads that they use cannot be easily hacked to clear the password by shorting two pins.
- The hard drive will be encrypted and locked to that laptop (but you can swap that out, at least, but you need an image from somewhere else)
- SD card slot is disabled
- Pretty much any USB storage device is disabled.
- You will likely experience strange behaviors/inconsistencies when using the touch screen functionality (sometimes it works great, sometimes it doesn't work at all)
- The VAS6154 dongle will be a no-name cheap knockoff. No Porsche logo, no wifi endcap/battery (which you shouldn't use anyways), and worst of all, no status lights.
- No case for storing all of this sh*t together/securely (it's just a laptop, power supply, VAS6154, and a long USB cable - you can figure out a nice way to keep it all together)
- You may need to do a little work on the system to get everything to show up in the desired language. Be aware the portions of coding while in engineering mode (aka developer mode, aka Mode E) will be in German. You can't change that. Use Google Translate on your smartphone - it works very well.

Despite my whining above - the darn thing works (once you set the laptop's date back to 2020).

You can PROBABLY roll this yourself, for significantly less $$ (and lower risk), by getting the image from elsewhere, getting some sort of decent/similar laptop, and the VAS6154 from one of the sources you listed above. I don't want to break forum rules, so PM me and I'll tell you where I got my image Go where @FerdinandAG lists above. I am glad that I got an image because I can rebuild the system if something breaks, I loaded the image onto my Mac running Fusion (does NOT work with Parallels so far), and it comes with the PET software for doing parts lookups. I have not tested actual coding with my Mac/VM setup. The Cayenne is my wife's DD, so I'm not risking it. Someday, I'll try it on my Macan.

I would also strongly recommend checking whether or not the Launch product line will suit your needs. It seems to be much easier to deal with, well documented here, and more suitable for the long term, if it actually supports your flavor of p-car.

If you are not really a computer nerd with an extra computer or two sitting around to help you load the image, then just go with one of the pre-built kits, or with the Launch family. They are pretty much plug and play.

Don't forget that you need external power for your car's battery if you're going to be doing a fair amount of coding. Coding off Auto start/stop on my Cayenne (9YA) while the engine was running did not work. It's at least a 30 minute coding job for that, so I added some external power when I did this the second time (and it worked).

JB911

Thanks for your review and tips. I think I listed most of the available vendors and some of them seem to address the date issue. On the other Piwis threads I posted about what I've researched on the Launch X431 models.
The Global versions sold on Amazon(Mini Pro, V and V+), and the Launch Tech USA X431 Torque, Throttle and the new Turbo.
It's not really possible to compare them unless you buy them all-the ferrarichat forum was a good source for info, and there you can see that the X431 Torque does indeed provide the latest support for their cars-430s, 459s, 599s etc.
There's a shop that rents a Torque for those installing a new clutch. Normally a dealer would calibrate the clutch/F1 system after the new parts are installed. The shop offers their Torque for rent and support. Others in the thread bought the global X431 and from what I saw only the US version Torque had the capability(Throttle and Turbo models also have the same software)

Buying an X431 means it's new with warranty and usually 1 year of updates.
These Piwis laptops are used as we know, and probably 4-5 years old. Some of the models I posted on the long list of links do updates so one would need more details. Updates for how long? And those kits are about $1600.

The idea of having the Piwis is nice, same tool the dealer has. The service manual says what to do, so you can then follow those directions. With the X431 that might be the case too. How to determine if all modules can be reached or not would depend on people posting to compare, I guess. On the Cayenne coding thread, the Oil Level procedure seemed identical.
So for DIY guys the X431 is probably perfect. People that own shops and are buying damaged cars to fix and sell might need the Piwis-

And it's good to hear from those who had a bad experience/no support from the vendor they chose. Some vendors claim to be there for "after sales support", and maybe they are.

I think of the 3 threads I'm following on rennlist, this is the one where people bought the complete system with laptop.
It took a while to compile all those links. I'll open all of them in side by side tabs and keep reading-

Thnx again
JB

runbuh

I am glad to help, or at least try to. We are all on a quest for information and experience.

Could you list what you want to do with the device? Are you after coding, or just doing maintenance (emergency brake release, battery change, TPMS reset, etc.), or all of the above? You're not planning on enabling features on newer models that require activation codes and PIWIS III's (that must be online with Porsche, as I understand it). My understanding is the any of the Launch devices you listed can do coding and maintenance, depending on the vehicle. My x431 Pros Mini should be here this week (from Amazon). One way or another, I really want/need to do some coding and maintenance on my two p-cars.

I cannot prove this, as I clearly am lacking in knowledge, but I have been told that the newer versions of PIWIS are losing their ability to do coding. If that's true, then maybe updates from Porsche might impact what you're after.

You mention the service manuals. If you have access to one, does it happen to mention what steps to follow in PIWIS in order to do something like disable the rear hatch beeps in any Cayenne or Macan made from 2014 forward? I've really been searching hard for that info (just to understand the navigation required in PIWIS versus the x431).

JB911

I only have 911 up to 997 service manual, maybe the Cayenne thread has the info you need? I was first checking the Piwis2 thread since it's more affordable-the procedure they did was to get the Planet-9 linked software and run it on Mac with VMware and buy the VCI to get it to work. Then the PIWIS3 complete with Laptop seemed like a good choice for a bit more for about $1200 and that's why i'm considering it.
My aim would be mostly maintenance. But if let's say a PCM burns out I don't know if an X431 can code a new one in. Maybe it can. So the Piwis is dependent on a good vendor, if the laptop will last a few more years, etc. Parts for an X431 including batteries, touchscreen, LCD etc are available, so after warranty you can fix it-I'm sure batteries for these laptops are also available.
Those vendors indicate quite a few sold, and generally I haven't read complaints. PayPal supposedly offers protection
I also skyped a guy on mhhauto forum and he kept trying to sell me a real German Porsche OEM VCI for $2300 Euro, out of Slovakia-

So I'm reading, comparing before deciding-
Thnx

runbuh

Good luck in your search!

JB911

Funny thing is the review in the first page of this thread has been pasted on vxdiagshop.com, but the original poster said he bought his from vxdas.com. Or maybe he made a mistake when posting, confused the vendor names or the vendors are the same with different name and multiple sites:
http://blog.vxdiagshop.com/2020/08/0...laptop-review/

But wait! Here's the same review doctored and pasted on autonumen.com!

https://www.autonumen.com/blog/2020/...re-my-reviews/

And there are a few more. So maybe they all really liked the review, pasted out on their site for testimonial, or those vendors are the same, and I guess they're reading this thread

I'll continue reading and searching. Hopefully more testimonials from others and if they're satisfied after purchasing.

JB

FerdinandAG

I only bought software 38.2 for $ 250 and VAS 6154 for $70
Now I can always restore my Piwis 3 if something happens.
The seller uses the latest versions and licenses, since he makes the software himself, mhhauto sells old versions that were once bought from this seller

runbuh

Where did you get your VAS6154, and does your laptop PIWIS recognize cars if your system date is current (2021)?

FerdinandAG

I bought here http://garageforum.org/Thread-Piwis-...-Vas6154-clone
I have not changed the date, I have set the current date - 2021

hermansoa

I've been try the eobdtool, vxdiag, obd2cartool, vxdas, uobdii, obdii365, piwis3,net piwis3,com. obd2tool for some experience, know some stories of piwis 3

All Piwis 3 above website offer is not original, no matter it is $5000 or $1000, genuine piwis 3 get from ACTIA or Porsche authority budget over $8000, confirmed by the mates who have been get the genuine device for workshop

all this piwis 3 is modified by VAS 6154 clone & original VAS 6154 actually, do not support online programming. but some seller advertise it is original with porsche logo & support online to attract ordering

all the Panasonic CF54, Lenovo T440, Yoga, Dell laptop is used, they announce "refurbish" or tell 99% new, just check how much does the Amazon offer brand new laptop, it will clear

Now have VAS 6154 clone solution with piwis 3 software available, good luck guys

JB911

I'm pretty sure everyone reading this thread is quite aware the laptops are used, starting with the first post on this thread, and the other two Piwis threads on rennlist. These vendors claim to offer a year warranty if you have problems. Will they honor it and offer support? That's the purpose of this thread-offer reviews and point out problems. Some or most of these vendors also sell a lot of other merchandise like Autel, Launch and many other products. How far does PayPal protection go? Probably just enough to cover an item that doesn't arrive or is dead on arrival(?) On the original rennlist thread for Piwis 2, buyers were being charged a PayPal fee on top of shipping. On the list with links I made, most vendors now offer free shipping, some say from US or UK warehouse.

So it could be some vendors do have them all ready to go in the continent you live in, they will indeed offer support, and buyers end up satisfied with their purchase. It will take more testimonials from those who purchased these and point out flaws and shortcomings.

runbuh

I got mine originally from vxdas. I did not expect the machine to be so locked down, but I should have read up more. What I don’t like is their support. I believe other posters have gotten an updated SSD from their vendor without having to send their old SSD in. vxdas will not do that. They will also not update, or swap, my VCI for one that works when the system time is set to the current date. Crappy service, and I do not recommend them for that reason. I will say that they shipped my order quickly, from China to the US, and it wasn’t a horrible delay, even during the December 2020 holidays/pandemic. Go with FernandoG’s link and build your own system, if you know what you’re doing and can invest some time. If you don’t know PC’s and/or don’t want to invest any time, then the vxdas system works, but you’ll have to get your support from rennlist.

Body In White

Did the seller give you the software as an image or mail you an SSD?