Rennlist - Porsche Discussion Forums - Mr. SU Dong Chen & Essence of Evolution

NOTICE: this is copy/paste from some of the posts I made on emptyflower. lots of close minded ppl there I don't think I will be posting there anymore. Although it is still a pretty good source from random information. At lesat some people on there knows what they are talking about....

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I was just in Tokyo, Japan for 3.5 days and I spent about 2.5 days with Mr. Su Dong-Chen from Essence of Evolutions. He is super practical and his web site is extremely impressive. He is probably the single most colorful person I've met in my life thus far... he is kind of crazy... hahaha. But we got along awesome, I slept at his house 3 nights. heheh. Mr. Su is master of XY, BQ, and TJ. I can learn a lot from Mr. Su. For those of you who are studing XY, BQ, or TJ you should definitely check out his web site. Amazingly, he had produced the web site all by himself. Not bad for an 53 years old who didn't know much about computers before.

http://www.essenceofevolution.com/11aenglishmenu.htm

I've had quite a training... it was all about eating and talking... Cheesy Grin We just talk about lot of things, ideas and stuff, and his philosophy, experiences. Since I speak perfect Taiwanese and Mandarin, it was easy for us to talk about many things in depth. Since I did not have much time we didn't really get to do any actual training. besides, my background (zero martial arts training, recently just started chi-kong and basic push hands with Master Yan Yuanhua) is too weak to get big benefits from Master Su at this stage. But I will get to learn everything the correct way with the shortest learning curve (I hope).

My journey has barely begun. It's like, baby step number 1. The road is long, and I want to find the quickest way. It's not like I'm seeking to become a good martial artist in 1-2 years of time. I intend to train for the rest of my life. I've already seen/heard students/masters who train the wrong way and basically remain stagnant for a long time.

Kevin, although I've had hours and hours of conversation with Mr. SU, we didn't cover enough grounds. I can't quite say I understand his whole philosophy yet. But I think he talks a lot about two words, Essence, and Evolution. During our conversation, I think he has said XY and XY Liuhe is the same. Nobody usually say Liuhe Quan anymore.

Mr. SU talked a bit about his "full body" exercise. I think that is what he intends to teach. Martial Arts is his passion in life. He has done lots of studying. He has a lot more plan in the works for the web site. Videos too. So the best is yet to come. I was embarrassed to tell him that I did not have time to study up on EOE web site before I met him. But I explained to him how busy my schedule has been... so I think he was ok with it. I certainly didn't mean to disrespect him. I just wanted to visit a true Master since he happens to be near where I was visiting in Tokyo. Hopefully he and I will get to spend more time together in the future.

Here are some photos of Mr. Su and I.

http://www.ejlin.com/albums/su-dong-...1561.sized.jpg

http://www.ejlin.com/albums/su-dong-...2072.sized.jpg

http://www.ejlin.com/gallery/view_al...su-dong-chen-e oe-0207

What's interesting is, Mr. SU does not believe in Chi-Kong! He was giving me lots of ****s for saying it is real (since I feel it myself). I was afraid he was going to kick my ass right then and there. LOL. He was slightly buzzed at that time as he was drinking good old chinese liquor for a bit. I almost cut the meeting short... but I shutup about chi-kong and chi and eventually we talked some more... and then we talked for hours more. This was the 1st day.

I GET him. So that's why we had so much to talk about. He is really a character... absolutely amazing. HARDCORE LOVE for TAIWAN TOO. Heheh. If I didnt' speak Taiwanese, I don't think we would've connected so much. At one point, we were talking about relationship with fathers and I shed a few tears.... ahhh. GOOD TIMES.

I learn a LOT of things. I kinda wish I had the camera rolling so I can review everything Mr. SU said, and then translate them to English for him. For those of you who have trained with him, I think I can say this, one of his favorite quotes is something like, "God/Jesus, please forgive them, because they do not know what they are doing."

heheh.

Master SU is fluent in Taiwanese, Mandarin, and Japanese. His English is decent. Pretty darn good for a kung fu master. He has pretty good English Vocabs. I can honestly say we bonded well. He is 20 years older than me. But he's a good 10 years younger than my dad. So he's kinda of like half older brother, half father to me.

His personality is straight up out of wu-xia books. Hao han. (good men). No fear of death. Live life how he thinks should be. He's had a pretty tough life, some of it is kind of by choice.

He was rather amazed that I would show up at his door step since I basically don't know much about martial arts. He told me he thought either I was really stupid, or, I have no fear. LOL. My intent was simple, I was already going to Tokyo already, since he was near Tokyo, I thought I'd make the effort to visit a legendary master even if I can not fully appreciate him yet.

I am a very open minded person. I saw some of the materials Mr. SU is working on. When Mr. SU was super anti-chi, he was a little buzzed. Under normal conversations he was not against chi as much. Mr. SU's whole point was he believe chi does not exist, and it is BS. But for myself I know for a fact that it is real. But until I reach a certain level, I probably can not prove it to anybody. I already told Mr. SU that hopefully in the near future I can prove it. Mr. SU is very practical when it comes to martial arts. He will then ask, can chi-kong help you fight. Based on my understanding of chi, it has a lot to do with relaxing the body, and having the correct postures. So while Mr. SU has said he doesn't believe in chi, he has huge emphasis on body mechanics and using the body the right way. As long as I don't talk about chi, there are still many common grounds.

The best aspects I like about Mr. SU is he has researched a lot about the WHY's of doing certain forms. Too many practitioners actually have NO IDEA on why they do the things the way they do. They either accepted it as they were told, or simply blinded follow some text or they may have wrongfully interpreted things. Mr. SU's form looks unorthodox sometimes but he can back it up by demonstrating power and he can clearly explain why.

BTW, I got Mr. SU started on myspace. Smiley so you guys can add him. http://www.myspace.com/essenceofevolution I will also get him started on youtube as well. Mr. SU has lots of plans for new video and photo releases. Smiley

Actually, little buzzed was an understatement. It was around 5 pm, and we had been eating and talking and drinking at the 2nd restaurant since around noon time. Mr. SU drank 3 bottles of hard Chinese liquor by himself. I had but 1 shot glass. So it was definitely heart to heart talks not just two strangers talking. I thought it was time for me to leave but actually, the conversation was just getting started. Cheesy According to Mr. SU's long time friends (over 20 years) who was also present at the restaurant, he was drunk at that point. lol. But he was still logical, if not a bit emotional at times. Smiley

There are several key things that Mr. SU discussed with me that will not be shared to the public. (don't worry about it, it doesn't not affect training) Grin Cheesy Some of it has to do with tradition and going against it. You were not there when Mr. SU was getting a little pissed off about chi. Heheh. He was like, "who the **** are you to come to Tokyo and talk about chi, when you dunno **** about fighting." Embarassed I thought I was getting my ass palmed right then and there for sure. Tongue Alcohol definitely helped us bond. That's why I was crying at one point when we were talking about relationship with our own father, about family love, and many traditional values in Taiwanese culture.

For true martial arts lovers like Mr. SU, it REALLY piss him off when people who really should not be teaching tries to teach. Especially the ones who do not get the "martial" aspects of the internal arts.

Taiji is way advanced stuff. Unfortunately, over 99% of Taiji practitioners out there are merely posing. They do not understand what it is really about. It is an advanced fighting form, first and foremost. According to Mr. He Jing-Han, TJ is even more advanced than BQ! According to some, it was Yang style made TJ very popular. But unfortunately, to spread it around faster, it was "reduced" to make it easier to understand for the masses. BQ on the other hand, is not as wide spread.

Hi Adrian, I had an awesome trip to Japan and Taiwan in Jan 2005. But I'd have to say this trip is even better!! I'm fortunate to have meet three awesome Masters in YAN Yuanhua, SU Dong-Chen and HE Jing-Han all in about 1 month time. Any one of them is awesome to learn from... but each is a little different. The road is long but I have no doubt that I have some of the best teachers in the world to guide me. Now it's time to train hard. Smiley

BTW, I talk to Mr. SU often, so if you guys have questions about why he does the things that he does, feel free to ask. I will try to translate and pass it to Mr. SU. But basically Mr. SU's stuff looks un-orthodox at times because the things that he does are all about the martial aspects of it. If you show him your training form, he will ask you to thinking about what is it the training is suppose to do, and how can it be applied to fighting. If you do not know why you are doing it... why are you using it to train?!

Apparently, lot of traditional artist do not like Mr. SU for the fact that he is not orthodox. But over the past few decades he has been proving everyone wrong in Japan. That is why he is so legendary there.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vlkIys9GHYQ

That's your opinion. I have repeatedly said I dunno **** and I'm a noob at martial arts. Lot of stuff I write about, are quotes and words from my teachers. I do not claim any of the stuff as my own. Some of the stuff I write about (chi especially) are based on my own feelings and experience. And when I talked to Master YUAN about my experience with chi and Yoga, he has never said I was wrong.

You are welcome to interpret me however you like. I really don't care. Smiley I'm here just posting my learning experience... so just take it for what it's worth.

While I am a novice at martial arts, I have great deal of experience with learning and teaching. Hell, we've all been "learning" since we were born. But specifically, I have been learning about road racing for 12 years, and I've been teaching high performance driving for 6 years. So I understand the process of learning and teaching. This is first hand experience. It can be applied to anything, including martial arts.

Anyways, those of you who have expressed interest in Mr. SU. He is going to be in USA later in Feb.

Please check his calendar for more information.

http://www.essenceofevolution.com/14gyoujiyotei.htm

There's a saying call Lian Tsai Er, Sho. What it means is, you teach as much as the student can absorb. If the student isn't ready for chi/qi or internal stuff, they are not going to teach you. Also, traditionally, virtue is very important. They do not teach advanced techniques to you if they consider you "evil" or have evil intentions.