Mr. F1 Fan

I want to start by acknowledging the massive wealth of knowledge and generosity in the RL community that has made my long term desire to get onto a track in a capable and safe car more fun than expected. I would also like to say thank you in advance, for all the advice and commentary.

I have broken my objectives into three categories/timeframes:

This year (summer/fall 2016) - Get my GT4 broken-in (expected mid-June), get to 2-3 DE track days (basically stock), and prepare for next year.

Next season (Spring/Summer/Fall 2017) – During the winter months, purchase wheel and tires along with various suspension components to allow for more optimal setup. Purchase roll bar and harness. Expecting some brake component upgrades once I wear out original parts. Hoping to hit 6-7 DE days with a couple away trips like COTA, Mid-Ohio or Watkins Glen.

Long term (2018 and beyond) - Power and tire compound upgrades if my skills support them.

It has been informative reading all the threads and posts about the GT4 and in particular all the folks who are putting them on track and reporting back on parts, setups, tracks, etc.

I feel well armed but a bit overwhelmed. I am at best, a beginner/novice and have decided that I need to start with the bare minimum to just get to a DE day and get on track. While finances play a small part in not dumping a bunch of money in to the car right away, I mostly feel as though I just want simplify things as I have very limited time during the summer which is my busy season for work. I have no problem with starting slow and learning from others so that hopefully I can build a car that I really love and can see, feel and sense the changes as they occur.

Here is where I need help. I will outline what I plan to do and ask for everyone to weigh in on whether that is a good way to get started.

1)Safety first – I wanted to buy a good helmet that will be comfortable, will last and that serve me as I get better. I am perfectly fine with spending up to $1,000 but figure $500-$700 will buy a great helmet. My order of importance is #1 Safety,#2 Comfort,#3 Weight. I suppose I was thinking full face, but maybe that isn’t necessary….or is it? How important is it to get a HANS device right when I start? Is there a good one that will work with the three point and later work with the full harness?

2)Insurance and which DE days – Just looking for the top 2 or 3 recommendations for US DE day insurers. I presently have GEICO for road insurance.
I live in Northern Virginia. Anyone local or familiar with the local tracks (Summit/VIR and Dominion) have an idea what are the good events to go to get started? I usually have some flexibility with weekdays, are those events usually less crowded. Which DE events should be avoided in general? I belong to PCA and BMWCCA.

3)The car – I have roughly 650 miles of break-in behind me and have only blipped past 4k a few times. I plan to change the oil at 1000 miles and then spin to 5500. Once I hit 1500 miles I will drive as I please. I plan to change the oil again before my first DE event which I hope will be shortly after the 1500 miles.
Next would be to have an alignment done on the stock suspension with stock (Dunlop) tires. What is the best setup for stock ? Anyone recommendations for good places in NoVA for this type of alignment?
I already wrapped the whole car in Xpel Ultimate so only planning on putting something on the lights for the DE day.

Is that enough to go out and have a good time for a day? What else am I forgetting?
Do I need to worry about fuel? What fuel should I be using? Are the stock tires and brakes going to be satisfactory for a couple of DE days and maybe 3,000-4,000 miles as well?

Hopefully there are other new guys out there that will also find this helpful. I love this car and I look forward to enjoying it in a safe environment.

Many thanks! -Ed

jphughan

For the helmet, see if you can find anywhere that will allow you to try them on, because fitment is very different across brands. More expensive is not safer. Typically it buys you extra features used more often in race cars -- built-in communication, piping for cooling, carbon fiber construction to reduce weight on your shoulders during long stints, FIA certification, etc. Get a SNELL 2015 or even 2010 helmet whose fit, looks, feature set, and price you like and call it a day. The differences between 2015 and 2010 safety requirements were minor, unlike 2010 to 2005. Full face isn't as important in an enclosed car, but I can see it being helpful if debris flies through the cabin in an accident, plus they look cooler. I have the Simpson SNELL 2010 Bandit with a smoked visor, which cost me about $450 I think, for which I got essentially built-in sunglasses and a striking resemblance to The Stig.

For insurance, most insurers say no track coverage at all these days. Amica Mutual in TX only excludes coverage when on track practicing for or participating in racing or a speed contest, and I've heard that State Farm is similar. Read the exclusions of your policy carefully, and if in doubt, get HPDE coverage from Lockton or OnTrackInsurance.

You can ONLY use a HANS safely with a full harness setup. Do NOT use them with a regular seat belt.

You can't do much more than the stock alignment specs with stock hardware, but in that case try to get as much camber as possible with 0 toe in front and leave the rear within the specs in the manual. Check the GT4 track wiki for more information on this.

For oil changes, do them every 5K miles if you want to be careful (official guideline is 10K), but Porsche says these cars can do 6K TRACK miles before needing a change, which is about 50 track days -- so don't throw money away here. Definitely change the diff oil more often though. The typical recommendation is 10K miles or every 12 days according to GTGears, whereas Porsche says every 120K miles, which is crazy IMHO.

Turbodan

join pca and sign up for more events than 2or 3 this year. Hang out with the participants and ask lots of questions. You probably don;t need any mods to that car until about 8-10 track days under your belt unless you are the next Senna. Your car is set up for a novice to use at track without any mods I think. Beginner (green)groups almost never have incidents so I would not worry about track insurance until you are at least intermediate.
most of all...have fun! congrats on a great new car!
you may also want to do some autocross to familiarize yourself to the car. and go on lots of drives.

PCarOMFS

Hi Ed, congratulations on the GT4. While I do not own one (yet) I have driven it and it is an amazing vehicle. I have a Cayman GTS and the GT4 is a hardcore version of my car. And my car is pretty fantastic too.

About the track, I would keep the car bone stock and learn it. You have a ton to learn and your car is so capable. I would master what the genius engineers at Porsche have given you from the factory. Once you've mastered it, start changing alignment, tires, put in a cage/harness, etc. I personally think you're money would be best spent at a Porsche driving school. I think most people on Rennlist would agree the limit will always be the driver and not the car until you've had an extensive amount of seat time.

As for the head and neck restraint, I have the Simpson FIA Hybrid and it's comfortable. It is 3-point belt compatible and I feel it's worth it any time you're on track. A HANS device will not adequately protect you without being strapped in by a harness. So if you're only using the 3-point belt you either drive with no head and neck restraint or the Simpson FIA Hybrid. You want to protect your neck against a sudden stop, which could happen at any time. The safety equipment is only worth it if you need to use it and God-forbid you ever need to use it. So I think it's money well-spent.

I use Lockton for track insurance. It's expensive, but I understand they are easy to deal with should you need to make a claim. That being said, my dad hit a deer in his GT3 at Summit Point. I really like that track but I won't be returning there. They know there are deer living within the Motorsport Park yet they don't do anything about it. Summit Point is out in the woods, so yes deer are going to be present, but it's a risk I won't take again. I go to VIR, Pocono, and Watkins Glen a few times a year with various PCA groups. I'm going to start running with Chin Motorsports next year as well.

Hope you enjoy your track time with the GT4!

-Mike

ExMB

1) Opinions are like .....
2) Read here,
3) Contact your local region.
4) Visit events in your area and talk to people.

This not a simple forum question. Nobody on here really knows you, only guesses at the persona you display. You have to do leg work to find out if it is for you and cannot base it on just internet chatter.

myBailey07

^What jp said, and

KEEP IT SIMPLE! With the GT4 you can throw on a helmet, show up and just drive and it will take you a long way before you really need to add much stuff. Don't over analyze, just show up and the lights will start coming on as you learn.

I would simplify it as:

1)Get helmet - Any snell 2010/2015 certified.
2)Get good stock alignment
3)Maybe add better brake fluid (Castrol SRF)
4)Get track insurance (what jp said above). Almost certainly won't need it, but it will relieve a lot of stress.

That's it...then just show up, have fun and learn.

https://rennlist.com/forums/gt4/9323...etup-wiki.html

needmoregarage

Simpson makes a hybrid device that allows you to wear a head/heck restraint (like HANS) with a 3 point seat belt. I know several people who have them, and it can significantly reduce injury in the case of a crash.

While I agree that beginner groups rarely have incidents - it can happen and I've seen it happen. It's not necessarily what YOU do - it's what can happen around you if you're in the wrong place/wrong time. I have gotten track insurance since beginning. Never had a claim but in a six figure car I'd rather know I'm covered than possibly have tens of thousands in damage or have to accept a totaled car (I've seen more than I'd like with other drivers).

Your GT4 will not need modification for quite some time. You should drive it, learn your track skills which takes a LOT of repetition (much more than 3 - 4 DE's in a season) and eventually as you learn what you like/dislike about the car - THEN you can consider mods. Out of the box the GT4 is a great car and despite noted under steer - for a beginner it will exceed your capabilities for a very long time (and I'd say even well beyond beginner status).

From your post you have a good attitude about willingness to be safe, to learn, to grow.

I'd say get a good, full face helmet and get some good coaching. Read the club's recommendations on what to bring (good tire pressure gauge, torque wrench for torquing wheels, maybe spare oil and brake fluid, water, snacks, a chair, layers for changes in temp, etc). Many clubs REQUIRE long sleeves even when it's hot out. Have a long sleeve all cotton shirt, and bring short sleeves if it's hot. Don't assume short sleeves are okay. Long pants are required as are closed toe shoes (like sneakers). Thin sole shoes are better for feeling controls. Some of these things are personal choice - but you need to check your tire pressures and torque your wheel nuts between sessions, and the rest is important to keep you hydrated and comfortable.

Brake fluid should be fresh and high temp (I'm told the factory uses DOT 4 fluid in GT4 so it should be good). But after your track events consider a caliper bleed so fresh fluid is available at each wheel. I flush the entire system yearly. I do caliper bleeds about every other track event and I am very conservative but it's easy, inexpensive and I'd rather not take a chance on this.

Remember to study the track BEFORE you go. You should be able to drive it in your head before you arrive. Watch videos and study the track map. Try to find an elevation map. It'll still seem different once you drive it - but if you memorize the circuit you'll come up to speed MUCH faster than someone who doesn't know if the next turn is right or left.

Also - know the flags COLD! Know where the corner stations are and glance at them every time. I test students to see if they see the corner worker (flagged) because they are your eyes ahead - the only communication you have as to what might be in front of you, and if you don't understand what a flag means, or if you don't see a flag you can become part of the problem instead of avoiding it.

Good luck and have a blas

Note in the time it took me to type this and edit it - several replies came in. I agree wholeheartedly with ALL the advice, especially that your car doesn't need much of anything!

Mr. F1 Fan

Massively Helpful!

I was overthinking it and was getting mired down in whether to try and get the car all sorted before putting it on track. Seems like A helmet, inspection, insurance, and basic paddock setup will get me by just fine.

Looks like track insurance from OnTrack is about $700 for a three day event. That sound about right? Is it usually best to try and do all three days of an event if you have time? How much track time do you usually get in a day?

Keep it coming!

TRAKCAR

Don't wait, just go now and hang out without signing.
Like a dry run, go to drivers meeting, talk to instructors and others why you are there.
Plus all the stuff you already know from reading RL.

jphughan

Sounds about right for a new GT4. Track insurance is usually per-event, not per-day, so you save cash on multi-day events. I'd always do multi-day events because you learn more in one of those than you do in the same number of days split across single-day events. Some organizers abandoned single-day events for that reason. A single day just isn't enough time to learn something and then spend enough time applying it that it will stick IMHO.

A typical track day gives you about 100 minutes on track broken into 4-5 sessions.

bk_911

I've done 3 track days with the GT4 and only done about 10 days total in my life so far. I still see myself as a beginner. I read all the threads here about alignment / suspension / tires blah blah. Here is some random first timer track advice:

1) get high temp brake fluid
2) buy a top notch, accurate tire pressure gauge - for me keeping the hot temp around the temps in the door has worked fine. ~32-33. One session I got to 35 on the front because I forgot to bleed some pressure then the Cup2 felt more slide-y
3) Get a helmet that fits. I second the advice to try them on. There is nothing worse than a helmet that doesn't fit right it can ruin your day.
4) read your car's track manual follow the track section
5) buy a good torque wrench and sockets to make sure your lug nuts are properly torqued before you drive
6) remove the valve stem covers before going on track
7) find your tow hook and install it before going on track
8) clean all loose junk out of your car
9) get coaching
10) bring water and food
11) get something to sit on
12) don't worry about alignment or fiddling with aero right away. I haven't and have already improved my laps just from technique
13) bring good window cleaner and your favorite towel(s) to clean bugs so you have a clear view of the track. my first track day I forgot this and the dead nation of bugs on the windshield was distracting and sometimes worse when the sun hit the windshield at the perfect angle.

Many of the guys here are *extremely* experienced track drivers that can get everything out of the GT4. So when they are talking about under steer, brake pads, tires and whatever a lot of it comes from someone that may actually gain time from those small tweaks. For me I know that those changes won't help as much as work on my technique. But everyone is different you could be the stig for all I know but I'd wait a few track sessions before dialing in the car.

What else? The tires (cup2) are awesome. They actually break free fairly progressively and will screech at you a bit if you're over driving just last week my 3rd track day I started finding the limit.

I still keep all the reaction/stability control on it seems not horribly intrusive so far.

Also drive as fast as you are comfortable. Point by cheaper slower cars. It's fine they just have more experience.

Dunno just sharing some stuff that helped me out when I first started and that I still use / think about now.

Hope it helps.

jphughan

^ Why remove the valve stem covers before going on track? I've had to deal with cars that couldn't adjust their tire pressure because gunk got jammed into the area around the valve pin, preventing it from being depressed. Not fun.

I actually like how the Cup 2s feel at 35 psi seen out on track, but this could of course be driving style dependent and maybe even track dependent. CotA for example has pavement that you can actually feel your shoes sticking to it as you walk on it. But 32-36 hot seems to be the preferred range for Cup 2s. OP, I'd recommend targeting higher pressures to begin with, partly because you may reduce tire wear a bit that way and partly because as a novice you won't be heating up your tires as much as more advanced drivers.

bk_911

I was told valve stem caps can melt if they get too hot. One of the older guys at OnEdge said the little rubber o-ring can melt and become lodged in the stem. I don't know if he has ever seen it happen specifically on a GT4 but other cars so it seems like either way you run a risk of that. Who knows. I was running with caps on before I heard that story.

I'm sure pressures are a big variable, I could have also been over driving a bit more that session because I was attempting to hang with a Nissan GT-R.

jphughan

Interesting....maybe that's what that gunk was in that valve stem I had to clean out. I'm going to look more into that -- thanks!

myBailey07

I thought about it today and realized that another reason why it is good to NOT modify your car at the beginning and to learn with a pretty much stock car is that you get a much better baseline to then understand and feel what the impact of different mods are as you get better, the lights start going on and you make mods.

For example, I drove my bone stock e92 M3 for quite a while, got very used to it, and was picking up decent speed. I could not understand why everyone made such a big deal about it understeering as I just know how the car drove. Besides, at that point I honestly probably also would not have been able to really tell the difference between under-, over- and tumble steer either ;-)

After quite a few weekends, I eventually put on camber plates and had an alignment with proper camber done. First session I drove the car, suddenly, when I turned the wheel the car would actually turn. First few laps I realized I am actually running over the apexes and wow! why is my back end suddenly wanting to come around on me if I am not more careful? That is when it clicked for me - Oh, that is what they were talking about when they talked about understeer and oversteer and how changes in camber actually make it feel - Valuable lesson for me.

But, we all come from different experience levels and learn in different ways. It was just one way that up to today helps me. I try and never make more than one change at a time, until I understand what that change is doing and how it affects the overall setup.