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Welcome to the Club! My case was worst. I had to retap to the next size as there were a lot of damage in one of them. But it worked perfectly and you can barely tell the difference when you look (it;'s the one in the photo bellow that has a different nut)
Thank God I was able to retap instead of going with an insert to stay with the OEM bolt size.
My first stud kit was purchased from one RL vendor....it's stainless steel bolts cut with stainless steel nuts.
I found at a local specialty hardware store metric Grade-8 studs (not bolts) with a allen recess on the top to properly thread them.
What I did is re-use the Stainless nuts from the previous kit and Voila!
You need 1.5" long studs and they should thread in between 10 and 12 full turns
Here you have some pics.
Excellent! If I ever need to remove my headers for any reason, I'll be going back with a stud kit like this. I used Stage 8 bolts on my install, haven't added their locking tabs yet but have them in-hand. The idea of having studs that take the abuse away from the cylinder head threads is highly preferred. No cross threading into your high-dollar aluminum cylinder header either.
If we do it for the calipers why not for the headers????....I know you don't take them off often like calipers but trust me the OEM bolts will run you about the same as a good quality stud kit and you don't have to throw away every time you take the headers out.
But the real benefit is not damaging the threads on the cylinder head and installing the header is also easier with studs.
I got the studs today, so tonight went for the installation. The drivers side was very easy to get all the nuts on and torqued down, but the passenger side, at the end, closest to the front of the car... I can't get any tool I have in the small space to tighten it down at all. Does anyone have any tips on how best to tighten this one up?
Also, the header gaskets looked perfectly fine, but some people have said to replace them, to avoid exhaust leaks. What's the experiences been from others? I would sure hate to have to re-install everything again after finally getting this nut tightened down. Any advise highly appreciated! Thanks!
Did you install them? I'm having bolts fall out too and i'm going to order the same from your links, hopefully it'll solve this issue.
Not sure why no one has figured this out yet. But the flange on the OEM header is very thin. It is about the same gauge as a penny... as opposed to these aftermarket headers which have much beefier flanges. Therefore, if you re-use OEM header bolts on aftermarket headers, they will be too short. The stud kit is an option, or you can just get longer bolts to accommodate the thicker flange. Much easier option in my opinion.
... Therefore, if you re-use OEM header bolts on aftermarket headers, they will be too short. The stud kit is an option, or you can just get longer bolts to accommodate the thicker flange. Much easier option in my opinion.
Not sure "too short" is the right conclusion. Certainly there will be a bit less thread engagement though...
I got the studs today, so tonight went for the installation. The drivers side was very easy to get all the nuts on and torqued down, but the passenger side, at the end, closest to the front of the car... I can't get any tool I have in the small space to tighten it down at all. Does anyone have any tips on how best to tighten this one up?
Also, the header gaskets looked perfectly fine, but some people have said to replace them, to avoid exhaust leaks. What's the experiences been from others? I would sure hate to have to re-install everything again after finally getting this nut tightened down. Any advise highly appreciated! Thanks!
I used Stage 8 fasteners like these https://store.stage8.com/p/6910-gm-2...-v6-header-kit except 2 of them were 30mm long instead of 25mm, for the two that pass through the bracing bracket used on the newer style Cargraphic Sport headers.
These fasteners can be driven by a socket or alternately by an Allen wrench via the recessed hex. For the bolt you had trouble with, I took a 1/4" drive 12 point socket and sawed off all the length I could (by hacksaw) but just left barely enough depth remaining to fully engage the height of the Stage 8 fastener head. This made the socket about 12mm in total length. Next, I filed the ratchet drive end of this shortened socket down so it is now more cone shaped to give it a more trim profile. Then I sorted through my 1/4" u-joint drives for the one that had the smallest profile in diameter and length. Turns out I had 3, all Craftsman, and 1 of them was significantly more slim and trim. I then connected together a 6" long 1/4" extension with the U-joint and modified socket. It was still a tight fit and required a lot of patience, but I was able to get the socket on the header bolt and drive it on with a 3/8" ratchet using a 3/8" to 1/4" adapter to the 1/4" extension. I was able to use my torque wrench for final tightening, adding 15% for the jacked-up angle through the U-Joint. I have not yet applied the locking rings and tabs for the Stage 8 fasteners.
I used new gaskets. After about 2 hours of running time, I checked torque and all it needed was just a smidge of turn to get back to 22 lb-ft. After another 6 hours or so of driving, I checked them again and they needed a tiny smidge of turn to get back to 22 lb-ft. I will check them again tomorrow afternoon after about another 15 total hours of driving and will install the locking rings.
Edit: Added photos below of the modified 11mm socket connected to the more slim 1/4" u-joint. You can see an unmodified 10mm socket laying next to it for reference. The 11mm socket was the same length as the 10mm before I sawed it off. You can see how I filed the socket to give it a more slim profile where it connects to the u-joint. You can see how the two 1/4" u-joints, both Craftsman, have different diameters and slightly different lengths. Having a smaller diameter is more important for getting this bolt tightened.
Today I was planning on switching to one of the stock bolts (or longer bolt Cargraphic includes) for that position. I was thinking since its a smaller head, I could get a smaller socket, or 10mm open ended wrench on it somehow. Add to that, I figured they may of designed the header in such a way that the stock bolt + some combo of tools can be made to work?
I have the cargraphic race headers (without cats). The only issue I have with these headers is that it doesn't have the secondary O2 sensors opening to reinstall the sensors so I cant pass the new York state annual inspection. The errors codes comes up saying O2 sensors not ready although the cobb accessport eliminate the check engine light on the dash. The only 2 solutions are 1)fabricate the cargraphic stainless headers with a welded bung to reinstall the secondary O2 with a spacer or 2)reinstall the oem headers to pass emission, then go back to thee after headers once inspection is done.
Had my race headers installed on Thurs. Only had the chance of pulling it into the garage but the lack of cats makes the smell that much more pungent in the garage. The wife just stares, but she knows she can't fight it.
Today I was planning on switching to one of the stock bolts (or longer bolt Cargraphic includes) for that position. I was thinking since its a smaller head, I could get a smaller socket, or 10mm open ended wrench on it somehow. Add to that, I figured they may of designed the header in such a way that the stock bolt + some combo of tools can be made to work?
I think you will have better chances if you use a fastener that takes a smaller diameter socket. I think you may be correct that the OEM Torx style fastener can take a smaller socket compared to the fastener you are using with the stud there.
See the photos of my modified tools I added to my earlier post above. These changes I described took me from having no way to get the bolt tight to being able to torque it per spec.
One thing I didn't try but I believe it's not very likely to work is to try a crow's foot, sort of your idea about an open end wrench but it gets driven with a 1/4" extension.
I reinstalled the header with the stock torx bolt today, the head is clearly too long to get a socket around, so I aborted that idea. I'm going to go with your strategy and use a low-profile 1/4" 10mm universal socket. I ordered some ARP 25mm M8 bolts that take a 12 point 10mm socket, fortunately I'm bored and in no rush to finish. I'm more curious to find the most elegant way to do a good install. If all goes well, I'll post my recipe of nuts/bolts/studs later.
02-24-2018, 08:56 PM
