GT4, DD, Sport Cup 2 and winter
07-23-2018, 10:09 PM
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GT4, DD, Sport Cup 2 and winter
Hello everyone,
I recently traded-in my 981CS for a GT4 and I’m still planning on daily driving it even in the winter.
I live in the Seattle area so during the winter we mostly see rain and a bit of snow here and there. When It snows I work from home and don’t drive the car (can’t leave my driveway anyway).
The car came with Sport Cup 2 and I was wondering how they would fare in the Seattle winter. Temperature rarely goes under 32F/0C but it’s wet pretty much all the time.
I’ve never had any issue with the 981 (for 2 years) but I had Super Sport on them (I actually got stuck on my way home once but the road was frozen).
Would it be smarter to buy 19" wheels and a set of « cheap » winter tires?
I recently traded-in my 981CS for a GT4 and I’m still planning on daily driving it even in the winter.
I live in the Seattle area so during the winter we mostly see rain and a bit of snow here and there. When It snows I work from home and don’t drive the car (can’t leave my driveway anyway).
The car came with Sport Cup 2 and I was wondering how they would fare in the Seattle winter. Temperature rarely goes under 32F/0C but it’s wet pretty much all the time.
I’ve never had any issue with the 981 (for 2 years) but I had Super Sport on them (I actually got stuck on my way home once but the road was frozen).
Would it be smarter to buy 19" wheels and a set of « cheap » winter tires?
07-23-2018, 10:25 PM
#2
Rennlist Member
I drove my 930 year round in Chicago with r comps. Guessing the car will be a handful. Hard to get temp into the tires and that means a bunch of slipping and sliding. Wouldn’t go so far as to suggest winter tires... but all season or three season sport tires are probably fine
07-23-2018, 10:40 PM
#3
Hey Skyounet.
I'm in Seattle also.
I bought my GT4 with SC2's (8000 miles on them but plenty of tread) in December of '17. They were AWFUL. I mean....really really bad in the wet+cold and once in the snow. Like driving on hockey-pucks. On ice. One another layer of ice. Sprayed with oil.
Wanting to enjoy the car in all weather, I replaced them with Michelin Sport 4S's and it transformed everything. Highly recommend looking that direction. The 4S's are as amazing in all weather (cold+wet or dry+warm) as the SC2's were crap in...crap weather. I'm sure they are amazing in warm+dry weather...but I never had a chance to try.
PM me if you want more details. Happy to share. And congrats on a great car.
I'm in Seattle also.
I bought my GT4 with SC2's (8000 miles on them but plenty of tread) in December of '17. They were AWFUL. I mean....really really bad in the wet+cold and once in the snow. Like driving on hockey-pucks. On ice. One another layer of ice. Sprayed with oil.
Wanting to enjoy the car in all weather, I replaced them with Michelin Sport 4S's and it transformed everything. Highly recommend looking that direction. The 4S's are as amazing in all weather (cold+wet or dry+warm) as the SC2's were crap in...crap weather. I'm sure they are amazing in warm+dry weather...but I never had a chance to try.
PM me if you want more details. Happy to share. And congrats on a great car.
07-23-2018, 10:40 PM
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Before that I also daily drove my 1986 911 3.2 (not as hardcore as the 930 but fun nonetheless).
The question was more: can I keep the Sport Cup 2 or should I change for other tires (winter or other).
The question was more: can I keep the Sport Cup 2 or should I change for other tires (winter or other).
07-23-2018, 10:44 PM
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Hey Skyounet.
I'm in Seattle also.
I bought my GT4 with SC2's (8000 miles on them but plenty of tread) in December of '17. They were AWFUL. I mean....really really bad in the wet+cold and once in the snow. Like driving on hockey-pucks. On ice. One another layer of ice. Sprayed with oil.
Wanting to enjoy the car in all weather, I replaced them with Michelin Sport 4S's and it transformed everything. Highly recommend looking that direction. The 4S's are as amazing in all weather (cold+wet or dry+warm) as the SC2's were crap in...crap weather. I'm sure they are amazing in warm+dry weather...but I never had a chance to try.
PM me if you want more details. Happy to share. And congrats on a great car.
I'm in Seattle also.
I bought my GT4 with SC2's (8000 miles on them but plenty of tread) in December of '17. They were AWFUL. I mean....really really bad in the wet+cold and once in the snow. Like driving on hockey-pucks. On ice. One another layer of ice. Sprayed with oil.
Wanting to enjoy the car in all weather, I replaced them with Michelin Sport 4S's and it transformed everything. Highly recommend looking that direction. The 4S's are as amazing in all weather (cold+wet or dry+warm) as the SC2's were crap in...crap weather. I'm sure they are amazing in warm+dry weather...but I never had a chance to try.
PM me if you want more details. Happy to share. And congrats on a great car.
07-23-2018, 11:01 PM
#7
Rennlist Member
I teach a car control class to corporate clients and the public at the local race track
The one thing we stress is to buy the correct tires for the conditions. Is it the ONLY contact you have with the road. It dictates how well the car stops. In bad weather it's usually stopping that's the problem.
Performance tires are not built for cold temps. They become hard as a rock! It's the tire compound that is not suitable, and most performance tires say they shouldn't be used in temps under 45 degrees Fahrenheit.
Do you really want to risk your personal safety, well-being over "cheap" tires, or trying to squeeze another season from inappropriate tires? Remember - if you put on winter tires you are extending the life of your other tires as they aren't being used for winter months. When you put the "summer" tires on - you're saving the winter set for poor conditions. Both sets will last longer because the wear is shared.
Yes you should get a different set. If you get wheels you can swap them at home easily at no expense. Or have them mounted/remounted but that's less than ideal if you have the resources for a second set of wheels and a place to store the extra set when not being used.
There are plenty of places in life to save money and cut corners. IMO tires is not a place where anyone should be "cheap". A set of decent tires is WAY cheaper than an accident (especially if it's your fault). Get an inexpensive set of wheels that are safe to use, and get a decent set of winter tires (better than all season tires which are "all compromise" tires) and enjoy your car all year round.
Best of luck!
The one thing we stress is to buy the correct tires for the conditions. Is it the ONLY contact you have with the road. It dictates how well the car stops. In bad weather it's usually stopping that's the problem.
Performance tires are not built for cold temps. They become hard as a rock! It's the tire compound that is not suitable, and most performance tires say they shouldn't be used in temps under 45 degrees Fahrenheit.
Do you really want to risk your personal safety, well-being over "cheap" tires, or trying to squeeze another season from inappropriate tires? Remember - if you put on winter tires you are extending the life of your other tires as they aren't being used for winter months. When you put the "summer" tires on - you're saving the winter set for poor conditions. Both sets will last longer because the wear is shared.
Yes you should get a different set. If you get wheels you can swap them at home easily at no expense. Or have them mounted/remounted but that's less than ideal if you have the resources for a second set of wheels and a place to store the extra set when not being used.
There are plenty of places in life to save money and cut corners. IMO tires is not a place where anyone should be "cheap". A set of decent tires is WAY cheaper than an accident (especially if it's your fault). Get an inexpensive set of wheels that are safe to use, and get a decent set of winter tires (better than all season tires which are "all compromise" tires) and enjoy your car all year round.
Best of luck!
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07-23-2018, 11:38 PM
#8
I would never run SC2 tires in freezing temps. There is a good chance you can damage the rubber compound in freezing temps... cracks in PSS were common... and it could ruin the tire. Not to mention it isn't a good traction option. If someone can afford a GT4, they can afford a set of all season or performance winter tires too 
07-24-2018, 06:00 AM
#9
Rennlist Member
....
There are plenty of places in life to save money and cut corners. IMO tires is not a place where anyone should be "cheap". A set of decent tires is WAY cheaper than an accident (especially if it's your fault). Get an inexpensive set of wheels that are safe to use, and get a decent set of winter tires (better than all season tires which are "all compromise" tires) and enjoy your car all year round.
Best of luck!
There are plenty of places in life to save money and cut corners. IMO tires is not a place where anyone should be "cheap". A set of decent tires is WAY cheaper than an accident (especially if it's your fault). Get an inexpensive set of wheels that are safe to use, and get a decent set of winter tires (better than all season tires which are "all compromise" tires) and enjoy your car all year round.
Best of luck!
07-24-2018, 04:59 PM
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I would never run SC2 tires in freezing temps. There is a good chance you can damage the rubber compound in freezing temps... cracks in PSS were common... and it could ruin the tire. Not to mention it isn't a good traction option. If someone can afford a GT4, they can afford a set of all season or performance winter tires too
Thanks everyone. I think I'm going to go with 19" wheels and "cheap" tires for the winter. It will be easier to swap the wheels than to have them mounted every time.
07-24-2018, 05:19 PM
#12
Burning Brakes
I won't disagree with anything else said so far in this thread, and if I was in your shoes I would buy different tires for winter months.
With that being said, I will quickly share my European Delivery experience. I was on the cut off (given the option) of Porsche putting winter tires on my GT4 when I picked it up (mid October 2015). I declined because I had track days planned at the 'Ring and Spa. A cold front unexpectedly rolled in and I was met with rain and temps in the mid 30s. I was really nervous: brand new expensive rare car, foreign country for the first time, Cup2s for the first time, unexpected cold/rain conditions, twisty roads. However, the tires held up splendidly. Granted, it must be said, whenever the weather is less than ideal I do not push the car whatsoever. This even goes for the off chance we get a warm rain here in San Diego (thats mainly because people freak out and can't drive, but you get the point). All I'm trying to say is that I had heard the horror stories and was expecting the worse, and was pleasantly surprised at how well they held up for me.
But yeah, if I knew I would be in those conditions ahead of time, I would just buy winter tires to have no concerns.
With that being said, I will quickly share my European Delivery experience. I was on the cut off (given the option) of Porsche putting winter tires on my GT4 when I picked it up (mid October 2015). I declined because I had track days planned at the 'Ring and Spa. A cold front unexpectedly rolled in and I was met with rain and temps in the mid 30s. I was really nervous: brand new expensive rare car, foreign country for the first time, Cup2s for the first time, unexpected cold/rain conditions, twisty roads. However, the tires held up splendidly. Granted, it must be said, whenever the weather is less than ideal I do not push the car whatsoever. This even goes for the off chance we get a warm rain here in San Diego (thats mainly because people freak out and can't drive, but you get the point). All I'm trying to say is that I had heard the horror stories and was expecting the worse, and was pleasantly surprised at how well they held up for me.
But yeah, if I knew I would be in those conditions ahead of time, I would just buy winter tires to have no concerns.
07-24-2018, 05:46 PM
#13
I also live in the Seattle area and my car came with the Dunlop tires. I don't daily drive, but I don't mind taking it out in all weather. For the most part I have never had any big issues with the cold weather performance if I'm driving normal. However, I can say that I can definitely feel the cold weather effect on them and there have been a few times I've thought to myself "wow, that was a little sketchy".
07-24-2018, 08:25 PM
#14
Rennlist Member
Many countries in Europe require winter tires by law (including Germany, Switzerland and others).
I believe Canada (or many areas in Canada) as well.
Winter tires be on Nov 1 until Apr 1.
The Germans know a thing or two about driving.
I believe Canada (or many areas in Canada) as well.
Winter tires be on Nov 1 until Apr 1.
The Germans know a thing or two about driving.
07-24-2018, 09:01 PM
#15
My two most extreme examples of used SC2 + wet + cold is first a hairpin turn near my home. I've lived in this neighborhood for over twenty years now and have taken this corner in both directions at least 1000 (total) times at this point. All variety of BMW's and Porsche's (none with SC2's) and a few pickup-trucks and 'regular' cars. In the worse weather, never an issue. Mind you...this is 'normal'/'boring' driving at a pace at or under 10 MPH around this corner.
In January with temps in the 40's + wet roads, I took this turn like I always have for the past two decades and the rear just rotated on me. It was such a surprise and at such a ridiculously low speed, I was utterly shocked and sat in the drivers seat doing nothing for a second or so as I felt and watched myself spin. Finally my 'drivers' brain kicked in and I corrected, caught the car and went on my way. The 4S's, on the contrary, grip and grip and grip around this same corner, wet or dry.
The other, more worrying example was with the same conditions, I could easily spin the tires in a 'spirited' straight-line acceleration in 3rd gear. And I don't mean red-line second to hard-shift third. I mean in third at 3K, gun it, and major wheel spin and rear-end wagging. I only did it twice. First time I was surprised and second I wanted to see if it was a one-off event. It wasn't. Again, none of that behavior with the 4S's. Very planted. Fantastic traction.
I'm not trying to diss the SC2's. They obviously are stunning when they are in their element....but wow. They scared the *stuff* out of me when there were not.
In January with temps in the 40's + wet roads, I took this turn like I always have for the past two decades and the rear just rotated on me. It was such a surprise and at such a ridiculously low speed, I was utterly shocked and sat in the drivers seat doing nothing for a second or so as I felt and watched myself spin. Finally my 'drivers' brain kicked in and I corrected, caught the car and went on my way. The 4S's, on the contrary, grip and grip and grip around this same corner, wet or dry.
The other, more worrying example was with the same conditions, I could easily spin the tires in a 'spirited' straight-line acceleration in 3rd gear. And I don't mean red-line second to hard-shift third. I mean in third at 3K, gun it, and major wheel spin and rear-end wagging. I only did it twice. First time I was surprised and second I wanted to see if it was a one-off event. It wasn't. Again, none of that behavior with the 4S's. Very planted. Fantastic traction.
I'm not trying to diss the SC2's. They obviously are stunning when they are in their element....but wow. They scared the *stuff* out of me when there were not.
