718 GT4?
03-18-2018, 02:14 PM
#631
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Then it's not the same motor with a simple tb and tune change. It's a very different motor just like the last GT4, which is my point. I think assuming it's the GT3 motor simply detuned is wishing and hoping. It's gotta have either different internals or a much higher price tag.
Currently some people are upgrading their GT4s with larger throttle body, X51 and even 4.0L.
The next GT4 (if it in fact gets the GT3 motor) will see owners eventually making the engine more in line with the GT3 for their additional power desires.
03-18-2018, 02:20 PM
#632
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the next GT4 if it has the GT3 block, will be same deal. Shops will be adding the the GT3 spec upgrades to the motor to get the higher hp.
03-18-2018, 02:24 PM
#633
Originally Posted by tcsracing1
It will most likely be the same block as GT3 but built using different parts etc. So not exactly a complete GT3 engine package, but it is the same base as used in the GT3. So everybody will refer to it as "GT3" motor.
Currently some people are upgrading their GT4s with larger throttle body, X51 and even 4.0L.
The next GT4 (if it in fact gets the GT3 motor) will see owners eventually making the engine more in line with the GT3 for their additional power desires.
Currently some people are upgrading their GT4s with larger throttle body, X51 and even 4.0L.
The next GT4 (if it in fact gets the GT3 motor) will see owners eventually making the engine more in line with the GT3 for their additional power desires.
03-18-2018, 02:27 PM
#634
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It seems pretty clear the next GT3 will have a turbo motor with 550+ hp and torque to rip your eyes out. The 991.2 will be a nostalgia piece for those wedded to the NA motor, but as a track weapon, it will be overwhelmed by the newer car. So why not give the 4.0 motor a proper sendoff and put at least 475 hp of it into a GT4 RS, with real RS underpinnings, and sell a limited number for $135K — in addition to a less potent but more streetable base GT4? Porsche will sell every one it makes and have a better option for its GT4 customer race car. The 911 fans will still think the Cayman is inferior, and if the GT3 track junkies find themselves getting beaten by the GT4 RS — and they will — they will get the new turbo version that much sooner. The factory wins.
Having a Cayman with too much power would put it too close to the 911 GT3.
Porsche feel the Cayman market is sufficiently covered with the GT4 as top of line Cayman with no need for an additional RS model.
It will be very interesting to see what happens with the 992 GT3 engine..... given that the 2017 Cup cars are going to be running without turbos for awhile, perhaps we shall see no turbos in the 992.1 GT3 series.
I wonder if porsche will eventually make hybrid GT3 and Cups?
03-18-2018, 02:35 PM
#635
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Im just not really sure what the 991.1 Carrera 3.8L motor had in common with the 991.1 GT3 3.8L motor. Perhaps somebody here could chime in on the similarities and differences?
I know they were not plug and play, whereas I assume the next GT4 will be if they are sharing from the GT3 parts bin.
03-18-2018, 02:53 PM
#636
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The cayman/boxster is a side show to the 911. Too many iterations of the Cayman would be excessive as the top of the line Spyder and GT4 is really as far as they need to go.
They cannot have a GT4 that will run with the GT3.... and seeing as the next GT4 will be just behind the GT3, there is no real room to increase it slighter higher with a special model.
I also do not think they would make just one model GT4 and call it "GT4RS" They tend to save "RS" badge for the 911 line so not to dilute the appeal.
Of course they would be able to build and sell a "limted" RS version, im just not sure what it would do to the non RS version from a sales and marketing stand point.
03-18-2018, 04:15 PM
#637
Drifting
You may very well be right, but if that happens you don't have a GT motor; you have a Carrera 3.8 with another 200ccs. The GT motor is basically a 9A1 block with all the things added that you just took away (along with a few others of course.) If Porsche were proposing a Carrera motor bumped up to 4.0 liters but with the same redline (7800) we currently have and the requisite 25-30 hp bump that comes from the 5% displacement increase and a little bit of tuning, I don't think people would be getting too wild about it. Not that it wouldn't be a great GT4; just would be evolutionary, not revolutionary. Like the difference in the 3.8 GT3 motor and the 4.0 GT3RS motor (991.1)
Yes, it is, but it's modified by the things Professor Gascan speculated might be removed to make a low-revving, lower power version of the current GT3 motor. So I was just saying, if you "unmodify" a GT3 motor in those ways, you've basically created a 9A1 Carrera motor, only in 4.0 rather than 3.8 variety.
Up until 2013, GT3s used an entirely different motor from the block up than the Carrera line did, and it would have still been special even if detuned a bit. Or I should say, it still IS special, even in 3.6 liter, 380hp 996.2 form.
Up until 2013, GT3s used an entirely different motor from the block up than the Carrera line did, and it would have still been special even if detuned a bit. Or I should say, it still IS special, even in 3.6 liter, 380hp 996.2 form.
It was basically refered to as the 991 Carrera motor.
Im just not really sure what the 991.1 Carrera 3.8L motor had in common with the 991.1 GT3 3.8L motor. Perhaps somebody here could chime in on the similarities and differences?
I know they were not plug and play, whereas I assume the next GT4 will be if they are sharing from the GT3 parts bin.
Im just not really sure what the 991.1 Carrera 3.8L motor had in common with the 991.1 GT3 3.8L motor. Perhaps somebody here could chime in on the similarities and differences?
I know they were not plug and play, whereas I assume the next GT4 will be if they are sharing from the GT3 parts bin.
Here's a more definitive thread on the subject:
Exploded view and part number differences between 9A1s in GT3 and Carrera
Cheers!
03-18-2018, 04:52 PM
#638
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As I pointed out in Posts 558 and 562 above, many components are identical, including the blocks as far as I've ever been able to ascertain. So if you strip out the expensive internals that allow for 9k rpm (con rods, oiling system) and the expensive externals that support the additional power with air and fuel (intakes, heads), you're left with... VOILA! a 9A1 Carrera motor. On the other hand, if you leave the internals in but intentionally "hobble" them with restrictors and software that prevent spinning to 9k and prevent making 500hp, A) you make it awfully easy and cheap for tuners to just turn it back into a GT3 motor, and B) you've still got a very expensive motor that you aren't getting the comparative value out of.
Here's a more definitive thread on the subject:
Exploded view and part number differences between 9A1s in GT3 and Carrera
Cheers!
Here's a more definitive thread on the subject:
Exploded view and part number differences between 9A1s in GT3 and Carrera
Cheers!
For the 718 GT4, I imagined Porsche would just add the X51 power kit. Easy peazy.
However, all this talk about using a GT3 motor has me wondering if they would bi-pass the simple X51 route in favor of giving the GT4 engine something interesting internally from the GT3?
I would love to see them use the GT3 engine with the only difference being throttle body, intake and software. (without those parts the fancy internals are kinda wasted of course...)
And as some people have said, that might drive up the price of the car which is to be expected.
03-18-2018, 08:53 PM
#639
Three Wheelin'
Agreed. I have an s54 too and know what you mean. I'm 98% sure that is due to the extra long gearing in the GT4. More power in the next GT4 would be nice but shorter gearing would be better imho. Even the current power level is plenty for the street and I'm not paid for faster lap times.
03-19-2018, 03:18 AM
#641
Rennlist Member
Absolutely agree
03-19-2018, 07:21 AM
#643
Originally Posted by RocketGuy3
So... Geneva has come and gone. Is the hope for a 718 GT4 dwindling? I would think it would be a 2019 MY car, which they're running out of time to reveal.
03-19-2018, 07:52 AM
#644
Hope dwindling??
They are DEFINITELY making a 718 GT4 and Spyder.
The only thing in question is the specs.
They are DEFINITELY making a 718 GT4 and Spyder.
The only thing in question is the specs.
03-19-2018, 08:34 AM
#645
Why not a 991.2 turbo engine?
I’ll go against the grain and guess the new car will have a Carrera S engine, as ours did two years ago. It’ll have a nice jump in power, and won’t be nearly as costly as using a GT3 engine. The exhaust pipes on these mules look the same as a present-day 911, so I’ll guess it’ll have about 420HP or a bit less from it’s turbo motor.