Mike Murphy

I haven't seen a definitive thread on this?

After researching a few different sites (Jay Leno's Garage, Chemical Bros., Ammo NYC, etc.), a lot of folks are recommending the five or six basic things to consider.

Most are summarized here: http://www.detailingspot.com/?page_id=15

Who uses this two bucket method?
What products do folks use and swear by?

I ran into a number of problems:

I ended up trying the two bucket method last night on my wife's Audi Q5, and the Mothers soap I used still required a lot of scrubbing to get most of the dirt off the car.

I found some nasty (gooey) substance that's now stuck to my wash mitt and won't come off.

I ended up using and destroying quite a few microfiber cloths. One was just on the exhaust tips and I spent 20 mins with Mothers polish to get 90% of the carbon buildup removed. But I couldn't get it all removed.

The bottom of the car - the bottom of the bumpers and rockers - had some many forms of dirt, goo, debris - I found that the wash mitt was pretty nasty and I didn't feel comfortable using it again for fear of scratching the car.

I found that maybe I should get something to blast and soak bubbles instead of the wash mitt to apply the soap?

I found that using a leaf blower to remove excess water after the wash just left me deaf, and think a towel to soak up most water would be better, then finished with a microfiber drying cloth (that one worked great).

I found that once water was removed and blown out, it continued to trickle out again over the doors, so I had to re-dry those areas maybe 3-4 times.

In the end, it took a heck of a lot longer than I think it should have. There has to be better ways that are faster if done regularly.

David Fermani

I think the biggest thing to incorporate into a non-marring wash regiment is a power washer. This virtually eliminates the necessity for more than 1 bucket and even a grit guard for that matter. You're essentially removing all the abrasive material from the paint without any marring enduced friction (i.e. hand washing).


2nd biggest thing is to use a drying agent to soften the friction when doing the final drying.

Mike Murphy

The other problem I'm having are the exhaust tips. Using Mothers Mag and Aluminim Polish, after 20 minutes of rubbing, I still don't have completely clean chrome exhaust tips. Is this normal?

Av8tr737

The double bucket method does not make sense. I second the pressure washer. This removes all or most contaminants to the paint.

Sometimes I clay bar if I have time.

I have used a foam cannon for years and highly recommended it. I recently acquired fittings to connect my foam cannon to the pressure washer.

I wash with a boars hair brush.

Drying is easy with my leaf blower.

This negates the use of shammies, that can further scratch the paint.

David Fermani

20 minutes?!?! I'd confidently have to say no. Not normal.

I'd go with a more professional grade metal polish. And perhaps once you get them totally perfect I'd lock this newfound finish in with a ceramic coating to help with maintenance there after.

Detailed Designs

I disagree David. Soapy bucket #1 is for washing the car and the clean water bucket #2 is for washing the mitt free of the debris you inevitably removed from the car before it goes back into bucket #1.

In as plain speak as is possible:

The 2 buckets are not for the same purpose. 1 washes the car, the other washes the mitt to keep bucket #1 as free as possible of the stuff you are removing from the car....minimizing the paint's exposure to the stuff that scratches the paint.

I do agree that a pressure washer is also good for washing but not that it replaces the need for multiple buckets.

PorscheStrong

My method for a standard wash (i.e. not a more extended session in which I might do polish, wax, etc.):

1. Rinse car with water using hose, shower setting
2. Apply foam soap using foam cannon sprayer on pressure washer
3. Rinse foam using pressure washer (I have a high-powered electric, not gas; keep nozzle at least 18" from paint at all times). Includes body and wheels. This removes most of the grime.
4. Two-bucket method. As noted above, the "rinse" bucket cleans my wool mitt; the "soapy" bucket applies new suds. I rinse probably 6-8 times as I go around the car, and work top to bottom. I don't do the wheels or wheel wells with the mitt, and instead use a separate, sacrificial microfiber for those areas, since brake dust is a sworn enemy of paint and clear coat.
5. Important step: I then rinse with a separate hose line where I have a spotless rinse system. It's amazing. I rinse the whole car with it, then blow off with my master blaster, and finally, finish with spray-on wax and a microfiber towel. If there's any bug guts or other stuff, I'll spot-treat with clay bar. Master blaster is really helpful for door jams, seals, and brakes. Later is important to dry; otherwise, you'll get lots of rust on your previously clean wheels when you first drive off post-wash. I always wear ear protection -- same type I use on the gun range.

David Fermani

I think we may just have 2 different opinions on the process? I'm of the one that feels that proper and careful pre-washing via a power washer removes all of the topical surface particulates that i feel is the main culprit that causes wash marring as it gets wiped across the surface while hand washing. Removing this debris is the single best way to mitigate your chances from marring to occur. What may be left on the surface after this pre-wash step (at most) is the organic and inorganic road film residue that isn't really abrasive in nature under these circumstances. It's also the easiest type of bonded soiling to remove from a finish as well.

If there are no abrasives being swiped off from the surface with your wash media (sponge/mitt/towel) in the 1st place, I feel it's redundant for a 2nd rinse wash bucket to clean them off then. And this ultimately leads to nothing being redeposited and again not causing any hazard either. In fact, my soapy bucket is clean like new when I'm finished washing and there's zero abrasive particulate harbored within it either thus making an additional bucket/step unnecessary to me. I think the popularity gained by the multi-wash bucket mentality has been originated by the DIYer that didn't (or wasn't able to) implement a power washer into their regiment. A power washer is a much safer, efficient and effective alternative.

PorscheStrong

Not quite -- the point of having the two buckets is that even after the initial power wash, you still have plenty of stuff on the car (trust me, I have a white car, it's easy to see; in fact, even after the hand wash, you still have grime, hence the occasional clay bar treatment). So when you go around washing it by hand, when dirt comes off the car, it likely ends up in your mitt/towel. Having a rinse bucket with a grit guard at the bottom gives you a way to get the grit out in the rinse bucket (where it will float to the bottom, below the guard), versus dipping it in the soapy water and grinding it back into your paint. Is the rinse bucket vital? No. Is it full-proof? No. But it's better than one, and would generally be considered best practice.

Detailed Designs

David has likely washed 10's of thousands of cars. So he has a lot of experience. It's just a difference of opinion. But I agree with you. It's not that 2 buckets replace the need for a good pre-wash regimen. But when coupled with one, it is safer.

ProReflection

you can use as many buckets as you want if your towels are not soft and clean , and if the hand pressure is too much than you will damage the finish.

people get attached to their wash mitt , their towels, and then are surprised where all the damage comes from....
i like to wash cars with microfiber towel, has 8 sides , so each panel can get a new side , wash mitt has 2....
people fail to maintenance their car, wash it every 1-2-3weeks top , have a car cover when not driven for long , use the garage if available , than the maintenance will be much easier.... and of course use quality products.

David Fermani

Thanks for the props JC!

I agree with you ProReflections regarding too much hand pressure. I've instructed(even demonstrated to) clients tons of times on everything that they'll need to properly maintain their finish (including 2 buckets with grit guards as most don't have power washers) and marring still finds its way into their finish 9 times out of 10. Technique trumps products every time and it takes a great understanding of wash methodology to successfully wash a car without instilling marring. Especially on gentle Porsche finishes.

Case in point with the now ever popular low water wash systems (rinseless & waterless). You're essentially dragging a towel across a dirty painted surface with a whole lot less water than you would be with a conventional wash method, (and not pre-rinsing either) and if performed properly, is proven to me perfectly safe for your finish when executed properly. If you're able to keep an open mind with this, then my wash method, which doesn't incorporate multi-buckets/grit guards, seems quite a bit less evasive. I think it just goes to show that there's more than 1 way to properly achieve/maintain a swirl free finish.