Dangerous? Auto Engine Stop engages too early when decelerating
03-15-2019, 01:46 AM
#1
Instructor
Thread Starter
Dangerous? Auto Engine Stop engages too early when decelerating
2019 Cayenne Turbo. The Auto Engine Start/Stop is good for EPA ratings and all but it does make us drive differently - I've driven meekly during the past month, afraid of every stop sign in the snow.
I feel that the auto engine stop engages too early when coming to a stop, causing the steering to lock (guessing the pump stops?), and the Brake Assist to engage - causing the car to come to an uncontrollable jolting halt, like stalling a stick-shift . The engine stops before the car comes to a complete stop and before all inertia is gone. Therefore, if you're driving on an icy patch of road and decelerate to a stop, the engine will shut off before your momentum dies. I don't know if the car can steer itself with the steering wheel locked and compensates for the driver, but it is a scary feeling to have the steering lock before you are stopping on ice. I'm guessing that the Auto Engine Stop won't engage if the ABS or PDCC intervenes but I don't have a safe closed course to test that.
Also it is annoying to have the engine suddenly "stall" when I pull into a parking space and decelerate before inching forward the last few inches. The speedometer still reads 2 mph when this happens. It's just feels wrong that the Auto Engine Stop engages at this point... unless it is not computer controlled, but rather controlled by a physical sensor that's measuring fuel injection levels or something that cuts off way before the actual speed is zero.
I feel that the auto engine stop engages too early when coming to a stop, causing the steering to lock (guessing the pump stops?), and the Brake Assist to engage - causing the car to come to an uncontrollable jolting halt, like stalling a stick-shift . The engine stops before the car comes to a complete stop and before all inertia is gone. Therefore, if you're driving on an icy patch of road and decelerate to a stop, the engine will shut off before your momentum dies. I don't know if the car can steer itself with the steering wheel locked and compensates for the driver, but it is a scary feeling to have the steering lock before you are stopping on ice. I'm guessing that the Auto Engine Stop won't engage if the ABS or PDCC intervenes but I don't have a safe closed course to test that.
Also it is annoying to have the engine suddenly "stall" when I pull into a parking space and decelerate before inching forward the last few inches. The speedometer still reads 2 mph when this happens. It's just feels wrong that the Auto Engine Stop engages at this point... unless it is not computer controlled, but rather controlled by a physical sensor that's measuring fuel injection levels or something that cuts off way before the actual speed is zero.
03-15-2019, 06:27 AM
#2
3rd Gear
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2019 Cayenne Turbo. The Auto Engine Start/Stop is good for EPA ratings and all but it does make us drive differently - I've driven meekly during the past month, afraid of every stop sign in the snow.
I feel that the auto engine stop engages too early when coming to a stop, causing the steering to lock (guessing the pump stops?), and the Brake Assist to engage - causing the car to come to an uncontrollable jolting halt, like stalling a stick-shift . The engine stops before the car comes to a complete stop and before all inertia is gone. Therefore, if you're driving on an icy patch of road and decelerate to a stop, the engine will shut off before your momentum dies. I don't know if the car can steer itself with the steering wheel locked and compensates for the driver, but it is a scary feeling to have the steering lock before you are stopping on ice. I'm guessing that the Auto Engine Stop won't engage if the ABS or PDCC intervenes but I don't have a safe closed course to test that.
Also it is annoying to have the engine suddenly "stall" when I pull into a parking space and decelerate before inching forward the last few inches. The speedometer still reads 2 mph when this happens. It's just feels wrong that the Auto Engine Stop engages at this point... unless it is not computer controlled, but rather controlled by a physical sensor that's measuring fuel injection levels or something that cuts off way before the actual speed is zero.
I feel that the auto engine stop engages too early when coming to a stop, causing the steering to lock (guessing the pump stops?), and the Brake Assist to engage - causing the car to come to an uncontrollable jolting halt, like stalling a stick-shift . The engine stops before the car comes to a complete stop and before all inertia is gone. Therefore, if you're driving on an icy patch of road and decelerate to a stop, the engine will shut off before your momentum dies. I don't know if the car can steer itself with the steering wheel locked and compensates for the driver, but it is a scary feeling to have the steering lock before you are stopping on ice. I'm guessing that the Auto Engine Stop won't engage if the ABS or PDCC intervenes but I don't have a safe closed course to test that.
Also it is annoying to have the engine suddenly "stall" when I pull into a parking space and decelerate before inching forward the last few inches. The speedometer still reads 2 mph when this happens. It's just feels wrong that the Auto Engine Stop engages at this point... unless it is not computer controlled, but rather controlled by a physical sensor that's measuring fuel injection levels or something that cuts off way before the actual speed is zero.
03-15-2019, 10:27 AM
#3
2019 Cayenne Turbo. The Auto Engine Start/Stop is good for EPA ratings and all but it does make us drive differently - I've driven meekly during the past month, afraid of every stop sign in the snow.
I feel that the auto engine stop engages too early when coming to a stop, causing the steering to lock (guessing the pump stops?), and the Brake Assist to engage - causing the car to come to an uncontrollable jolting halt, like stalling a stick-shift . The engine stops before the car comes to a complete stop and before all inertia is gone. Therefore, if you're driving on an icy patch of road and decelerate to a stop, the engine will shut off before your momentum dies. I don't know if the car can steer itself with the steering wheel locked and compensates for the driver, but it is a scary feeling to have the steering lock before you are stopping on ice. I'm guessing that the Auto Engine Stop won't engage if the ABS or PDCC intervenes but I don't have a safe closed course to test that.
Also it is annoying to have the engine suddenly "stall" when I pull into a parking space and decelerate before inching forward the last few inches. The speedometer still reads 2 mph when this happens. It's just feels wrong that the Auto Engine Stop engages at this point... unless it is not computer controlled, but rather controlled by a physical sensor that's measuring fuel injection levels or something that cuts off way before the actual speed is zero.
I feel that the auto engine stop engages too early when coming to a stop, causing the steering to lock (guessing the pump stops?), and the Brake Assist to engage - causing the car to come to an uncontrollable jolting halt, like stalling a stick-shift . The engine stops before the car comes to a complete stop and before all inertia is gone. Therefore, if you're driving on an icy patch of road and decelerate to a stop, the engine will shut off before your momentum dies. I don't know if the car can steer itself with the steering wheel locked and compensates for the driver, but it is a scary feeling to have the steering lock before you are stopping on ice. I'm guessing that the Auto Engine Stop won't engage if the ABS or PDCC intervenes but I don't have a safe closed course to test that.
Also it is annoying to have the engine suddenly "stall" when I pull into a parking space and decelerate before inching forward the last few inches. The speedometer still reads 2 mph when this happens. It's just feels wrong that the Auto Engine Stop engages at this point... unless it is not computer controlled, but rather controlled by a physical sensor that's measuring fuel injection levels or something that cuts off way before the actual speed is zero.
03-15-2019, 10:53 AM
#4
Agree with you all. Don't like the fact that the engine turns off before coming to a complete stop.
Saying that, as soon as the car senses any steering input from the driver, the engine should come back on immediately. So you shouldn't technically be experiencing any steering lock longer than a fraction of a second. If it's longer than that, I would probably have the car checked.
Also, if the car senses you're maneuvering in a parking situation, it disengages auto stop automatically. However, the system doesn't usually recognize that right away as you are slowly pulling into a parking spot.
I have set up a shortcut on the Home screen to activate/deactivate auto start/stop. You can also set up your diamond button on your steering wheel that way so that you can easily turn this feature on and off.
Saying that, as soon as the car senses any steering input from the driver, the engine should come back on immediately. So you shouldn't technically be experiencing any steering lock longer than a fraction of a second. If it's longer than that, I would probably have the car checked.
Also, if the car senses you're maneuvering in a parking situation, it disengages auto stop automatically. However, the system doesn't usually recognize that right away as you are slowly pulling into a parking spot.
I have set up a shortcut on the Home screen to activate/deactivate auto start/stop. You can also set up your diamond button on your steering wheel that way so that you can easily turn this feature on and off.
03-15-2019, 11:23 AM
#5
Yes, I disable my start/stop in the individual settings. So right after starting mine, I quickly select individual. Totally agree, the savings in gas is not worth the driving experience of the auto start/stop.
03-15-2019, 01:56 PM
#6
Auto stop/start
2019 Cayenne Turbo. The Auto Engine Start/Stop is good for EPA ratings and all but it does make us drive differently - I've driven meekly during the past month, afraid of every stop sign in the snow.
I feel that the auto engine stop engages too early when coming to a stop, causing the steering to lock (guessing the pump stops?), and the Brake Assist to engage - causing the car to come to an uncontrollable jolting halt, like stalling a stick-shift . The engine stops before the car comes to a complete stop and before all inertia is gone. Therefore, if you're driving on an icy patch of road and decelerate to a stop, the engine will shut off before your momentum dies. I don't know if the car can steer itself with the steering wheel locked and compensates for the driver, but it is a scary feeling to have the steering lock before you are stopping on ice. I'm guessing that the Auto Engine Stop won't engage if the ABS or PDCC intervenes but I don't have a safe closed course to test that.
Also it is annoying to have the engine suddenly "stall" when I pull into a parking space and decelerate before inching forward the last few inches. The speedometer still reads 2 mph when this happens. It's just feels wrong that the Auto Engine Stop engages at this point... unless it is not computer controlled, but rather controlled by a physical sensor that's measuring fuel injection levels or something that cuts off way before the actual speed is zero.
I feel that the auto engine stop engages too early when coming to a stop, causing the steering to lock (guessing the pump stops?), and the Brake Assist to engage - causing the car to come to an uncontrollable jolting halt, like stalling a stick-shift . The engine stops before the car comes to a complete stop and before all inertia is gone. Therefore, if you're driving on an icy patch of road and decelerate to a stop, the engine will shut off before your momentum dies. I don't know if the car can steer itself with the steering wheel locked and compensates for the driver, but it is a scary feeling to have the steering lock before you are stopping on ice. I'm guessing that the Auto Engine Stop won't engage if the ABS or PDCC intervenes but I don't have a safe closed course to test that.
Also it is annoying to have the engine suddenly "stall" when I pull into a parking space and decelerate before inching forward the last few inches. The speedometer still reads 2 mph when this happens. It's just feels wrong that the Auto Engine Stop engages at this point... unless it is not computer controlled, but rather controlled by a physical sensor that's measuring fuel injection levels or something that cuts off way before the actual speed is zero.
03-15-2019, 03:20 PM
#7
Instructor
Thread Starter
The steering needs about 15 ftlb of input for the engine to re-engage. It feels like a 65 Chevy pickup. It’s really disconcerting for smaller drivers and us with arthritis.
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03-15-2019, 06:14 PM
#8
Evidently, what we're experiencing is not a glitch. Porsche actually designed the Autostart/stop that way. This section is taken from a Jalopnik article posted in one of the sticky threads above:
"The transmission’s shift-by-wire setup is new, and the monostable shifter lever throws are now shorter. In addition, autostart/stop doesn’t wait until the car has come to a halt, but can actually shut the engine off even as the car coasts at speeds up to 4 mph. That autostart/stop functionality, like on other vehicles with the technology, is aided by an electric trans fluid pump, which makes sure the transmission’s fluid pressure-activated shift elements receive pumped automatic transmission fluid even when the engine is not running."
This section only addresses the transmission functionality when the engine is not running. It does not talk about all the other vital functions.
"The transmission’s shift-by-wire setup is new, and the monostable shifter lever throws are now shorter. In addition, autostart/stop doesn’t wait until the car has come to a halt, but can actually shut the engine off even as the car coasts at speeds up to 4 mph. That autostart/stop functionality, like on other vehicles with the technology, is aided by an electric trans fluid pump, which makes sure the transmission’s fluid pressure-activated shift elements receive pumped automatic transmission fluid even when the engine is not running."
This section only addresses the transmission functionality when the engine is not running. It does not talk about all the other vital functions.
03-15-2019, 09:49 PM
#9
Burning Brakes
I don't think I've ever been more shocked in seeing a Rennlist thread as I am reading this one... This sounds like a horrible design flaw... Can a software fix be requested from Porsche?
03-16-2019, 11:07 AM
#10
Same issues for me..... and dangerous feature in some traffic situations as noted ....dealer told me this turn-off feature can no longer be programmed on the Individual setting (..he said Porsche changed the software in recent shipments )...I have put this option in my home screen anyway but annoying to ritually turn off each time you get in the car......just a useless design overall.
I will test Individual mode if this can be programmed in it.
I will test Individual mode if this can be programmed in it.
03-16-2019, 12:37 PM
#11
Thank you sir for saying what I've been trying to say for a long time, you are 100% right, anyone about the purchase the cayenne has to be aware about this, it can change your mind on your purchase and this is not an exaggeration.
add to that, even when slowing for speed bumps the system engages, it feels extremely weird and uncomfortable knowing as you're approaching the bump that the car is about to shut off and you don't want it to. same thing applies to every time I'm about to park the car anywhere.
The system needs an immediate re-design and a software update (hopefully) to fix this.
I'm surprised how this has not been raised before by Panamera drivers? or is it maybe different and little bit better there?
to admins: I think this needs to be a sticky as well, any future buyer has to be aware about this IMO. SAs are not mentioning this I believe.
add to that, even when slowing for speed bumps the system engages, it feels extremely weird and uncomfortable knowing as you're approaching the bump that the car is about to shut off and you don't want it to. same thing applies to every time I'm about to park the car anywhere.
The system needs an immediate re-design and a software update (hopefully) to fix this.
I'm surprised how this has not been raised before by Panamera drivers? or is it maybe different and little bit better there?
to admins: I think this needs to be a sticky as well, any future buyer has to be aware about this IMO. SAs are not mentioning this I believe.
03-16-2019, 01:11 PM
#12
Rennlist Member
I was hoping that Porsche would have reprogrammed the start/stop function for the new Cayenne. Doesn't appear to have happened. What you describe is very similar to my 2016 CGTS and have been discussed in the 958.2 forums. It's a real pain. There are some areas where I use it which is mostly at Florida traffic lights since they are so long.
03-16-2019, 01:45 PM
#13
So the car won’t remember you turned off auto start/stop? You have to program it into a user profile or every time turn off when you get in the car? The car should just remember the last setting and keep it off...
03-16-2019, 01:45 PM
#14
Same issues for me..... and dangerous feature in some traffic situations as noted ....dealer told me this turn-off feature can no longer be programmed on the Individual setting (..he said Porsche changed the software in recent shipments )...I have put this option in my home screen anyway but annoying to ritually turn off each time you get in the car......just a useless design overall.
I will test Individual mode if this can be programmed in it.
I will test Individual mode if this can be programmed in it.
03-16-2019, 02:19 PM
#15
Burning Brakes
Thank you sir for saying what I've been trying to say for a long time, you are 100% right, anyone about the purchase the cayenne has to be aware about this, it can change your mind on your purchase and this is not an exaggeration.
add to that, even when slowing for speed bumps the system engages, it feels extremely weird and uncomfortable knowing as you're approaching the bump that the car is about to shut off and you don't want it to. same thing applies to every time I'm about to park the car anywhere.
The system needs an immediate re-design and a software update (hopefully) to fix this.
I'm surprised how this has not been raised before by Panamera drivers? or is it maybe different and little bit better there?
to admins: I think this needs to be a sticky as well, any future buyer has to be aware about this IMO. SAs are not mentioning this I believe.
add to that, even when slowing for speed bumps the system engages, it feels extremely weird and uncomfortable knowing as you're approaching the bump that the car is about to shut off and you don't want it to. same thing applies to every time I'm about to park the car anywhere.
The system needs an immediate re-design and a software update (hopefully) to fix this.
I'm surprised how this has not been raised before by Panamera drivers? or is it maybe different and little bit better there?
to admins: I think this needs to be a sticky as well, any future buyer has to be aware about this IMO. SAs are not mentioning this I believe.
The problem does not apply to my 2018 Panamera 4 E-Hybrid, of course, which will turn off if in E-Hybrid mode provided that the engine is warm, but it starts out then in all-electric mode and won't turn on the engine again until it needs to. But in an ICE-only vehicle, auto-start/stop is a dumb idea if it can't be permanently disabled.