2019 Cayenne Brakes...Does Everyone's Non-Ceramic Brakes Squeal?
 

A member here reported in a different thread that his brakes squeal and posted info according to Porsche it's normal. Hoping this is not the case for all, but it's concerning as we dont want a vehicle with squealing brakes. I've owned many Porsches over the years in addition to lots of other performance marques and really never had an issue with noisy brakes, and on the rare occasion we did the rotors or pads were replaced under warranty and the problem ceased. I have also read that the brakes on the 19 cayenne are quite dirty with considerable amounts of dust. As a comp, the brakes on our 2017 Q7 3.0 emit negligible amounts of dust (standard ceramic pads) and are very quiet except for an occasional short squeal in reverse which there is a TSB out for. Having to settle for noisy brakes in anything short of an ultra hp vehicle in this day and age is surprising. Before suggesting, we are not interested in the ceramic brake option for my wife's base CY, if it were a turbo yes, but not on a base. I wanted to make sure this got as many responses as possible so i started a dedicated thread. Thanks in advance.

I responded to you in a different thread once, but this seems like a better spot to address your concerns.

If your Q7 does have ceramic pads, they're a game-changer as far as dust goes. We've had two Infinitis with ceramic pads. One was a QX60 SUV, which is an appropriate car for those types of pads. The other was a G37 Sport, which had the same fixed multi-piston calipers as the car's cousin, the 370Z. The calipers and rotors were designed for high performance. But Nissan AND Infiniti decided to fit them standard with ceramic pads to alleviate dust. It worked, but the performance part of the equation was badly compromised. Ceramic pads do not work well with heat -- catastrophic brake fade can occur. Which it did as Car and Driver tested a 370Z on the track, resulting the car doing a high-speed wall-plant. (Google "Car and Driver 370Z brake failure.") That test resulted in Nissan / Infiniti offering a non-ceramic, full-performance pad option soon thereafter.

So, the long of my answer is this. Porsche produces performance cars, period. They produce, across its entire product line, probably the best braking systems in the world. They are way overbuilt for street use, so you can beat any car in its lineup on the track mercilessly without serious performance impact. So Porsche will be not fitting quiet, non-dusting, heavily performance-compromised ceramic pads to standard iron-rotor brakes anytime soon, probably ever. That's why they developed PSCB -- to keep the performance bar where they need it, while reducing brake dust dramatically.

As for the noise... well, I think any performance brake is going to make some noise, sooner or later. Just a matter of degree. The fact that Porsche had to release a slick corporate video addressing the issue with customers tells you that they've been getting an earful.

For me, it's almost a matter of pride to own slightly noisy brakes. But I understand what you're saying. And it is NOT a matter of pride to own filthy brake-dust covered wheels. :)

My recommendation: Spring for PSCB.

Thanks for your thoughts. I've owned many pcars over the years, mostly 911s/turbos and never had an issue with squealing brakes and they were much more performance oriented with cross drilled rotors etc than what's used on base CY's, but it's been several years so maybe things have changed? If we have to go for ceramic coated brakes let alone with 10 piston calipers to have a quiet vehicle, then I think that might be game changer for us, as mentioned on a performance based turbo yes, but not on a base with 335 hp. The brakes on the Q7 stop the 5000 lb vehicle quite nicely but we dont drive it, nor would we drive a CY like it's a 911, nor should one because well it's not.
Are yours noisy all the time and was it from new? The one we drove albeit for 15 mins had no squealing at all.

Sorry, you may have misunderstood me. You've got three brake options on the Cayenne:

1. "Base" brakes: Fixed multipiston calipers with standard cast-iron rotors. They performed great for us (we've had a week each in two loaner MY 2019 Cayennes), didn't make any noise, but did dust to an insane degree. I have a photo or two of a 19" wheel looking grungy after just a few drives by us.
2. PSCB: New-technology braking system introduced for the first time on the new Cayenne. It stands for Porsche Surface Coated Brakes. You get 10-piston fixed multipiston calipers in the front, four in the rear. The rotors are cast-iron, but coated with a microscopic layer of tungsten carbide. Combined with a special brake pad material, brake dust is reduced by 90 percent or more, with the added braking efficiency of that technology coupled with much larger rotors. Together, they do a good job of looking impressive inside larger 20" or bigger wheels (standard rotors look a little lost, IMHO). But the real trick is how well they perform. We test-drove a base Cayenne with them and were impressed all around. For the street, they're all you need, unless you want to be stupid (we were) with PCCB.
3. PCCB: The same carbon-ceramics that've been around for years, only massively oversized. Overly expensive and overkill. (That's a lot of overs.) But cool. We upgraded from standard PSCB on our Turbo to PCCB because there was / is a shortage of PSCB due to a fire in the factory that produces them. We didn't want to take a chance on having our build pushed back.

Our PCCBs have been mostly silent. I've had a few little squeaks and squeals in high-humidity driving after the car has been parked wet for several hours. But the noise went away quickly after an aggressive stop. Highly recommended if you want the absolute best brakes Porsche offers. But as I said, they're way over-the-top for almost any driving conditions.

I have read reports of PSCB noises from several owners here, though. You might check yourself, but I remember once Rennlister reporting Porsche is working on a fix. Another took his to the dealer, who addressed some misaligned pistons, I think.

My wife's been driving her new 2019 base Cayenne for 3+ weeks, and she's been complaining about the brake noises. I drove it on weekends and yes the brake made embarrassing noises every time I had to stop at low speed. Many other drivers looked at me and didn't say anything but I could read "What the hell is that brake noise from a new Porsche man?". I received an email from Porsche indicating the brake squeal is normal. They even provide the youtube link to where they explained about the brake squeal (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fUNHb9O52WQ&sap-outbound-id=BEE98E1E04ABA7DA96AD9786B088BE0E901206C6); however, this didn't happen on our 2014 base Cayenne. This is not acceptable Porsche!

I'm sorry to hear this (no pun intended), and you're right it's just not acceptable, these are NOT race cars. I had a fairly lengthy conversation with a local dealership's service dept today and they said vehicles that exhibit a squeal from the first few hundred miles will have it going forward, and all the "BS" from the sales reps saying it will go away, bed in the brakes etc is nonsense...it makes 0 difference. He said those vehicles that don't have the squeal from new seem to be ok, so I asked if that's the case then how can Prosche say its normal? He tried some double talk but realized I wasn't buying it and came clean saying if some vehicles squeal when brand new and others don't there's an issue, he mentioned nothing about a "fix' being in the works. Did your wife's start making noise from early on?

Zero noise on my PSCBs....only been a few hundred miles but stopping power is great- and no squeal at all

Thanks for the excellent info. This would be my wife's DD and were not spending an extra $3500.00 to get quiet brakes. See my post above re the conversation i had with a local P dealerships service dept today. If there is no fix or TSB by the time ours comes the end of May we may have to pass (sigh) and I'll get her another Q7 which she luvs and drives like a dream. Personally I doubt there's a fix in the works as that would directly contradict what's in the video trying to tell everyone the squealing is normal.

Yes, the noise started very early on. She noticed it the first day she drove it. Porsche suggested the noise will go away after a couple of very hard brakes. I will have to wait for the mileage to pass the breaking in period before attempt to do this. I am not sure if it will work.

Zero brake noise on my wife's base Cayenne after few thousand miles. When my GT3's brakes squeal, I just make a quick stop from 90 mph on an exit ramp and the brake squeal goes away for a month.

It's good to hear. I will try that when it passes the break-in period. Thanks.

This is exactly what the service dept said, some do and others don't (I assume apline's wife's CY has no brake upgrade), but if this is true then there must be a reason and an associated fix. Having to do monthly 90 mph braking to keep a near track cars brakes quiet is simply unacceptable for a base CY

I just remembered something, the new Lexus LC500 was also having issues with brake squeal and Lexus tried to tell owners that all performance brakes squeal etc, but they owners perservedered (12 page thread on club lexus) and after about a year a TSB was finally issued for the US (I believe new pads/material with no noise and less dust), the customers in the Eu are still fighting for the TSB, but the US owners are happy.

I've got a base car with about 4k miles on its odo, and haven't had any brake squeal at all. I've got nothing but praise for the brakes ... great feel and they know how to stop the car. But from what I've read in this forum, it seems some cars have squeal and others don't. Maybe the brakes are affected by temperature and humidity, and those cars that are squealing are doing so because of the local climate. I live in the Northeast, and maybe my climate here is good for brakes (I note my Carrera S has never squealed, either). I have no idea, but just throw out that possibility.

No brake noise at all on my Cayenne S.