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2019 or 2020 Cayenne e-hybrid ?

 
Old 02-09-2019, 03:00 AM
  #1  
Pcar991
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Default 2019 or 2020 Cayenne e-hybrid ?

In June 2018, the week the Cayenne e-hybrid was announced, I met up with my SA and plunked down my deposit for one. At that time official orders would supposedly be taken by end of October/early November and deliveries were going to start March 2019. That was fine by me as we wanted to take delivery in May after all the winter mess is completely off the roads (live in Vancouver BC) As time went on the dates kept being pushed back and each time I checked in the dates kept getting further and further down the road. Finally today we got the call that orders are officially being taken and an April build slot is available with deliver in August. My question is, and I already e-mailed my SA (but thought I would check here), Don't the 2020's start deliveries in September/October? Would it be wise at this time to wait a couple months and take delivery of a 2020 model year? Or am I off on this and the 2020's don't hit dealer floors until December 2019/January 2020 or later?
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Old 02-11-2019, 02:14 PM
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Default told 2019s through Dec

I am in a very similar situation. Ehybrid on order w last change date late April, w expected delivery in August. My SA has told me that the run is expected to go through December and 2020s won't be appearing until the next calendar year so I'm proceeding based on that
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Old 02-12-2019, 08:57 AM
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Were you able to test drive the E-hybrid Cayenne? I just did a build on one out of curiosity and it came out a couple grand cheaper vs the same build of the S. It seems like the E-hybrid is a better deal. Other then having the base engine v6, yet being just as quick as the S, what am I missing by going with an E-hybrid. Is it startup sound, acceleration sound that the S offers which I like. How much cargo space would I be really losing and how reliable is the Porsche hybrid system. Plan on keeping it for 8-10yrs. as my daily errrands and running kids to school, practices, etc. Average about 1200 miles a month
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Old 02-12-2019, 06:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Cyclenut1 View Post
Were you able to test drive the E-hybrid Cayenne? I just did a build on one out of curiosity and it came out a couple grand cheaper vs the same build of the S. It seems like the E-hybrid is a better deal. Other then having the base engine v6, yet being just as quick as the S, what am I missing by going with an E-hybrid. Is it startup sound, acceleration sound that the S offers which I like. How much cargo space would I be really losing and how reliable is the Porsche hybrid system. Plan on keeping it for 8-10yrs. as my daily errrands and running kids to school, practices, etc. Average about 1200 miles a month

I can speak from having gone from a 2015 Panamera 4 to a 2018 Panamera 4 E-Hybrid (I've never owned a Cayenne but have driven the older S E-Hybrids and the new 2019 Cayennes at dealerships). The E-Hybrid sounds just as loud when the ICE is on as the non-hybrid. You can control when the ICE is on or off; if you want it on all the time, you can pretty much have it on all the time. The acceleration is light-years better because of the huge torque starting from stop with the electric motor. I don't think you lose any cargo space because there's no spare wheel/tire in the boot in the Cayenne any more (unlike the Macan) -- something I can't figure out, and a bad omission by Porsche. I myself can't understand why anybody would get a Panamera 4S over a Panamera 4 E-Hybrid, as the latter is cheaper and far more powerful. I love driving in all-electric mode; once you get used to that, and to all-electric cars, it really is addicting. It's especially nice to start up in my garage in electric-only mode (the default), and come home to my garage in electric-only mode -- not getting any exhaust fumes into the garage.

My E-Hybrid has nearly 18k miles on it over nearly a year now. It has behaved flawlessly -- a real dream. Porsche hit a homerun with the technology. The tech and battery pack has improved from the previous generation of E-Hybrids substantially; the all-electric range is longer by about 50% or more. I drive about 1k miles a month, mostly local driving (13 miles each way to my office can be done almost entirely on all-electric roundtrip). I get generally 1000-1200 miles per tank of gas; going to gas stations once every 5 weeks or so (vs. once a week with ICE-only previously) is priceless. I plug in every night to a simple 120-volt outlet in my garage (no need to upgrade for a 14-kWh battery pack, as it fully charges from zero overnight). I'm saving about $150-$180/month in gas savings, while my electric bill has only gone up about $50-$70/month, so about $100 net savings a month to run the car in terms of "fuel".

I've also done some long-distance trips -- the longest being a 7600-mile, 2.5-week trip across the US last summer. I didn't plug in at all on the trip but still got a respectable 29 mpg for the whole trip. And I drove quite fast on interstates out west where it's straight for miles and little traffic. Get ACC and any long distance trip is a breeze. The Cayenne may be slightly heavier than the Panamera, and it is not as aerodynamic, so I expect that the gas mileage and all-electric range will be perhaps 10-20 percent lower in the Cayenne than what I get.

People have suggested that this E-Hybrid will be very dated in 5-10 years; I disagree, because if it were to hold up without needing major repairs, it really has excellent range. Would I prefer an E-Hybrid with a 18-kWh or 20-kWh battery pack, to increase the summer range all-electric from 25 miles to 35 or 40 miles? Of course! That would be a perfect range for me. The worry with this complexity is how it would hold up over time; I can imagine repair costs being high outside of warranty. If I were to keep it for 5 or 6 years, I'd pay for the extended warranty. But my E-Hybrid is by far the best vehicle I have ever owned, and driven! I test-drove a couple of 2018 Panamera Turbos (V8, no electric motor) while I was considering buying the E-Hybrid, and the E-Hybrid (even Pan4) was light-years better, in my opinion. I would never consider another Panamera or Cayenne unless it was E-Hybrid -- they are that good. Waiting and hoping for a Macan E-Hybrid in the next couple of years...
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Old 02-12-2019, 06:45 PM
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Cometguy - Thanks very much for the detailed report!! My 2019 E-Hybrid Cayenne is just about at the V250 "Vehicle Fixed" point. And your description gives me great confidence! Now, it seems I have to wait until early September for delivery. Happy that you have had such a great experience.
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Old 02-12-2019, 07:27 PM
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Cometguy-thank you very much for detailed response as well. I feel a bit more confident in seeking my purchase towards the hybrid. I drive a lot and having the electric mode would be nice. I hate constantly going to the gas station every 4 to 5 days.
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Old 02-12-2019, 10:24 PM
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Looking at the price, specs, performance, fuel economy, and probable resale, I'm not sure where the S fits into the lineup. The e-Hybrid seems like the better value all-around. If it were priced $10K higher, I'd have a different opinion. But it's a wash money-wise, and includes Sport Chrono. What's not to like?

For me, the best value in the lineup is still the base Cayenne. But the e-Hybrid presents some really compelling technology and performance at an excellent price point. Porsche historically has gouged consumers in any way it could, for any reason it liked. The fact that it's selling a far more expensive-to-produce e-Hybrid for the same dollars as its NA counterpart in objective performance tells me they'd be just fine dropping the S, if people would stop buying it.

Like it or not, the Taycan is the future. The e-Hybrid trims are stepping-stones that they want to sell now as real-world interim testbeds, as they move toward full electrification.
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Old 02-12-2019, 10:29 PM
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Originally Posted by JCWLS3 View Post
Looking at the price, specs, performance, fuel economy, and probable resale, I'm not sure where the S fits into the lineup. The e-Hybrid seems like the better value all-around. If it were priced $10K higher, I'd have a different opinion. But it's a wash money-wise, and includes Sport Chrono. What's not to like?

For me, the best value in the lineup is still the base Cayenne. But the e-Hybrid presents some really compelling technology and performance at an excellent price point. Porsche historically has gouged consumers in any way it could, for any reason it liked. The fact that it's selling a far more expensive-to-produce e-Hybrid for the same dollars as its NA counterpart in objective performance tells me they'd be just fine dropping the S, if people would stop buying it.

Like it or not, the Taycan is the future. The e-Hybrid trims are stepping-stones that they want to sell now as real-world interim testbeds, as they move toward full electrification.
I completely agree. I kept putting different builds together between the s and e-hybrid and the E kept coming out less. Iím going to see when my dealer gets one in for me to test drive. Hard to argue against the E when comparing the two. Maybe Porsche did that for a reason by making the E a better option and get mkre people into it so they will more likely transition to full ev at some point.
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Old 02-12-2019, 10:46 PM
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I'm a big Porsche E-Hybrid fan. And I think the Hybrid will be a core vehicle for another 15 years at least. Full EVs are great if you drive 99% of your time in an urban area and the suburbs. Always great if you have a night to recharge. But cross country travel is still hard, and even the "Quick Charge DC" charging stations take 45 minutes to an hour to fill a Tesla battery. And Porsche is proving that in order to reduce charging time to 15 minutes, the vehicle has to be at least an 800 Volt system. That means even the newest charging infrastructure will have to be replaced. (And mechanics have to qualify as high voltage electricians).

I talked with a guy who tried a cross country trip with his Tesla. He said, "Never again". An hour long stop every 350 miles. And that's only where he could find a quick-charge station. And by the way, in the north, during the winter, a full EV charge only gets you 150 miles, not 350, because batteries and electric motors are terribly inefficient at low temperatures.

So, a LOT of expensive change necessary before an elegantly engineered Hybrid like the Porsche Cayenne E-Hybrid is out of fashion, and the Full EVs take over.
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Old 02-12-2019, 10:53 PM
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Originally Posted by Gmoe01 View Post
I'm a big Porsche E-Hybrid fan. And I think the Hybrid will be a core vehicle for another 15 years at least. Full EVs are great if you drive 99% of your time in an urban area and the suburbs. Always great if you have a night to recharge. But cross country travel is still hard, and even the "Quick Charge DC" charging stations take 45 minutes to an hour to fill a Tesla battery. And Porsche is proving that in order to reduce charging time to 15 minutes, the vehicle has to be at least an 800 Volt system. That means even the newest charging infrastructure will have to be replaced. (And mechanics have to qualify as high voltage electricians).

I talked with a guy who tried a cross country trip with his Tesla. He said, "Never again". An hour long stop every 350 miles. And that's only where he could find a quick-charge station. And by the way, in the north, during the winter, a full EV charge only gets you 150 miles, not 350, because batteries and electric motors are terribly inefficient at low temperatures.

So, a LOT of expensive change necessary before an elegantly engineered Hybrid like the Porsche Cayenne E-Hybrid is out of fashion, and the Full EVs take over.
I think we also get a $7500 tax credit since itís a plug- in as well or is that gone? The big bonus is better parking at airports(at least mine) and better parking at my Whole Foods. 😎 If I can get the tax credit, Iím pretty much sold on it. I do so many short drives in a day, it would make sense for me.
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Old 02-12-2019, 11:04 PM
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2nd hand info only, the tax credit has been cut in half. I'll be checking with my accountant shortly.
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Old 02-12-2019, 11:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Gmoe01 View Post
2nd hand info only, the tax credit has been cut in half. I'll be checking with my accountant shortly.
Thatís still pretty good. Personally I think the whole tax credit is ridiculous and costly. But hey, Iíll put my hand out if itís available. Thanks American tax payer. Lol. Wait, thatís me subsidizing my own vehicle. 😜😂
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Old 02-13-2019, 05:00 PM
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Originally Posted by Cyclenut1 View Post
Thanks American tax payer. Lol. Wait, thatís me subsidizing my own vehicle. 😜😂
Youíre welcome. If you buy one, how about sending me a check for half of your federal rebate, assuming itís still there? I directly represent John Q. himself!
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Old 02-13-2019, 08:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Gmoe01 View Post
2nd hand info only, the tax credit has been cut in half. I'll be checking with my accountant shortly.
not true. The only time the tax credit would cut in half is when you are getting a tesla.

2018 panamera e-hybrid is getting $6670 in tax credit and I believe cayenne will get the same.
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Old 02-13-2019, 08:41 PM
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Thanks! I looked up all the Porsche vehicles on fueleconomy.gov and the 2018 Panamera 4 E-Hybrid is indeed listed at $6,670. However, even though most manufacturer's 2019 models are listed, the 2019 Cayenne E-Hybrid is not listed. Perhaps it has to be approved by the EPA before getting listed? If so, you are most likely right, that it will get treated similar to the 2018 Panamera.
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