wkearney99

You could be right, but I seem to recall when I ordered my 17 that Sport+/Chrono were part of the same package.

I don't disagree that it's a different experience, just that not having it isn't really any sort of deal-breaker. Having the throttle much twitchier and the shifts a lot more abrupt aren't really going to be useful in 99% of driving situations. Even running autocross with mine regular vs Sport didn't make a lot of difference. Now, on a larger road race course I've notice some benefit but, again, not really enough to have made it a deal breaker to not have the Sport+ mapping bumps.

I'm not hear to talk anybody out of it, just to assuage any doubts someone might have being led to think "you've got to have it". You don't.

mightytaco

Thanks for the info and views, thescratt and wkearney99.

I'm in the final midst of sorting my CPO purchase with dealership (the service history has some gaps, namely, there is a 50,000 km interval where there's no Porsche dealership showing an oil change, and I was told it had the onboard 7.2 kwh charger, but not sure that it does), so will see if the dealership can throw it in (hopefully the mark-up on software is large enough that they agree)!

Thanks again,
MT

waynelam83

I've just got my 2017 Cayenne S e-hybrid 4 months back. There is no operating guideline over the internet for how to operate the vehicle efficiently other than frequently charging it for full electric mode. Many people are reporting disappointing 22mpg for highway driving. Today I have just finished a 350+ miles of highway driving and I figured the following guideline that might help to get the most fuel economy from the vehicle,
1) For city driving and low speed driving(below 55mph), try to use full electric mode as much as possible.
2) whenever I get on the highway, I will use "charge mode" to re-charge the battery back to around 9 miles electric range for future city driving.
3) during highway driving, try to use cruise control as much as possible.
4) Charge mode has 20% penalty on fuel economy, so, turn off the charge mode whenever you have enough power in the battery. Don't leave it on when you have enough battery range, it won't charge efficiently anymore and the increase rpm will just be wasted.
5) intrinsic hybrid mode + cruise control is capable of delivering 30mpg. I watched its operation for the entire trip and found out that the combustion engine will turn on whenever there is uphill; it will turn off and electric motor will turn on instead when there is down hill; with very steep downhill, the vehicle will even charge the battery.
6) the engine's most fuel efficient speed is 55 mph. Under 55 mph, the gear will stay at the highest gear with lowest rpm most of the time. slightly lower speed will actually tick it back to the 7th gear frequently and kill the fuel economy a little bit.
So, with intrinsic hybrid mode + cruise control, my final mpg for the whole trip (369 miles city + highway) is 30.9mpg. This fuel economy is actually on par with Lexus RX450h. Hope this will help whoever get the hybrid.

rickjaffe

Hey all: I'm looking hard at getting a used S E hybrid, but because of several blowouts in my previous electric car which didn't have any kind of spare. I'm reluctant to pull the trigger without some kind of spare tire, even a collapsable, which is what I have in my 928 and 996 turbo. I see suncoast sells a spare tire kit for the e panamerica, but I don't see one for the Cayenne. I've seen on ebay people selling VW or audi spare which they say work on at least some models of a cayenne.
anyone have any experience with it? Any aftermarket solutions, for affixing it or even putting false floor top over it, which of course cuts down on the cargo area. Do S E hybrid owners buy a full size wheel and tire and jack kit and at least take it when they go on the highway?
the notion that companies sell an expensive care without a spare is sort of shocking to me.

also, is it true that these cars don't even come with a plug in compressor?

thx.
rick jaffe

rickjaffe

I'm looking to replace my 13 lexus rx 450h with an 16 or 17 S e hybrid.
I'm not so much considering a 15 because I've read here that there was some battery improvement on the 16 model year. Is that correct?
have a couple basic questions:

1. difference between 16 and 17 is just the later has a platinum package available, which aside from some superficial trim is same as 16 with whatever packages came with the 16? or is there some meaningful difference in what was available in a 16 optioned and a 17 plat.

2. I'm definitely going to get some kind of spare wheel. Not a Porsche specific question, but if the car comes with 20 or 21 inch wheels, I assume I have to go the full size spare route, because the collabsable only comes in 18 and 19 inch. meaning you can't have a 19 inch wheel where the other three wheels are bigger.

3. can you either remote start or turn on the heat remotely with the apple app, on any S E hybrid, or do you need the Porsche connect software package which is like a 2k option.

4. From what I'm reading the new plug ins won't be available in the first model year (out in Germany mid 2018 here?) and that what will be available here in 2018 will be base and regular s, right?

5. most of these cars seem to come with sport plus (suspension mode which is center of box below shifter) but not pasm? raising and lowering the body (standard on turbo and GTSs).
apart from the ride height, does that affect ride quality? I don't seem many S e's listed with that right button/toggle thing.

6. just to confirm, these cars don't have run flats do they?

looking at a 16 for around 60 and a 17 plat, for 70, with almost no milege, neither cpo'ed

thx.

wkearney99

17 will have the PCM4 radio setup.

You would need the Porsche Connect service to remotely interface with the vehicle. I know the gas and diesels specifically do not have any support for remote starting via the app. I have it any it's convenient but not a must-have. I've used the remote door locking a few times, and would probably get the security features if I lived/traveled in a higher risk area. As for the internet options, you DO NOT have to get an AT&T data plan for it. Anything with 4G LTE (like Verizon, TMobile, etc) will work. Bearing in mind that the radio is 4G LTE/GSM only, so if you're in a poor coverage area with only GSM then a Verizon SIM wouldn't provide connectivity (Verizon falls back to CDMA and there's no radio for that in the PCM). It's rare at this point to not have full LTE coverage just about everywhere on the East coast. I've yet to have problems.

I've yet to see any firm delivery dates on the next gen models for PCNA.

A gasoline GTS has lower springs, and is typically ordered with both air and sport+ suspension options. I would imagine it's optional in the hybrids, I'd look for it when searching used. Though I wouldn't insist on PDCC as a requirement. I've driven both with/without and not having it is not a deal breaker by any stretch (especially in the latest models).

As for spares, the Hybrids have it placed in the cargo area, instead of below (as that's where the battery goes):
http://porscheownersmanuals.com/2017...l-in-the-trunk



I don't know if any of the recommended tire sizes are available as run-flats. I'm inclined to think not.

rickjaffe

thanks a bunch. looks like it has to be an option as a complete set up.

Gundo

I just had the PCC iPhone app activated for my 2017 S E-hybrid. I use it all the time for pre-warm and pre-cool. Very useful feature. My understanding is the you need to have a hybrid for it to work without the $2k "enhanced mobility" option

rickjaffe

I'm also looking at a 2017, platinum and it looks the connection plus comes with the upgraded trim package. you buy new or used 2017 and where?

xrtdr

Update:
I have had my 2016 S E Hybrid since June.
Bought it certified preowned with 5K miles, now it has 16.5K.
Through summer and fall I was averaging 600-700 miles per tank (~35-40 mpg)
Winter performance has definitely degraded with only ~500 miles per tank and ~25mpg

I typically drive about 60 miles 3X per week and shorter mostly electric only drives the other 4 days.

Wondering if others' experience with winter performance is similar.
(It HAS been a cold winter in northern Ohio)

Also, is anyone else having an issue with oil levels running too high?
I have had to bring it in 3 times to have oil removed.
The dealer says that since the hybrid engines run cooler than ICE-only engines, oil fumes and residue do not burn off as completely and they can build up.

I can't tell if this is factual or not. Also, if it is true, does it mean that the oil is becoming degraded or impure and may not lubricate optimally?

Anyone have thoughts or knowlege to impart here?
Thanks.

chiapet15

Yes, I have also had this issue and you can read up on it here: https://rennlist.com/forums/cayenne-...-e-hybrid.html

Basically it's from unburned fuel contaminating the oil. It's not that the engine runs cooler. Since in the ehybrid many people don't operate the ICE (internal combustion engine) long enough for the engine to operate at the normal operating temperature (~220F) long enough for all the water and fuel vapor to burn off, it accumulates in the oil and lowers the viscosity, which makes the oil thinner; this means it doesn't do as good of a job protecting the engine. You can see in the above thread the oil analysis report I have done which shows the excess fuel and lower viscosity.

For me, the key takeaway is the oil change interval depends on how you drive the car. Frequent driving in EV mode with short operation of the ICE means extra fuel contamination and therefore more frequent oil changes. You could also try to put in a longer trip every week where you operate the ICE at normal operating temperature for 20-30min and see if that helps keep the fuel contamination to a minimum. I have tried this and will send another oil sample (used for 7Kmi without an oil above maximum warning) to blackstone this week and will update the aforementioned thread with new results.

mightytaco

Hi All,

I picked up my car this weekend and wanted to say thanks for all the helpful advice.

Car purchase took longer than expected as there was some missing maintenance/service history where I can only guess that the owner did the work him/herself and didn't bring it to a Porsche dealership. In the end, because it was sold by a Porsche dealer as CPO and car was otherwise in decent shape, I bit the bullet. I'm hoping that she is trouble free and not too difficult to wrench on. (I'm also hoping I get used to the brakes and the drive modes--I keep triggering the ICE even when I'm trying not to!)

Here she is pre-delivery day:


Unfortunately, they forgot to charge the battery when I picked it up and will definitely agree that they would generate way more sales if they kept these things fully charged!

Thanks again, everyone!

-MT

paul29

I also have a 2015 SEHybrid and also have the high engine oil indication. My question is where is the fuel that is causing the dilution, as some have showed on an oil analysis, coming from. The only place where fuel is admitted to the engine is through the injectors. Now I would assume that the fuel rail/lines are under standard pressure for a start condition because the ice must be ready for said condition at all times on a Hybrid. Are some of the the injectors leaking? They all cannot be leaking and washing the cylinders down or the engine may not start due to low/no compression and that is not the case.

chiapet15

The injectors are not leaking. All ICEs (internal combustion engines) go through a startup enrichment cycle when they startup cold. The length of this cycle varies with the ambient temperature as well as the engine temperature at time of startup. When the engine isn't at operating temperature, fuel doesn't atomize as easily, effectively reducing the amount of fuel available for easy combustion. To compensate for this, the engine will use more fuel (hence the enrichment) to maintain the required air-fuel ratio.

Along with this richer mixture of air and fuel, we know that there is always some leftover fuel that is unburned during combustion, and since piston rings don't form a perfect seal against the cylinder wall, some amount of blow-by, which contains this unburned fuel, makes it into the crankcase. the PCV valve usually sends this unburned fuel back up into the intake to be burned a second time for better emissions. However, because the engine isn't completely warm, some of the unburned fuel that made it into the crankcase also condenses on internal surfaces down in the crankcase.

With normal ICE-only cars, this isn't an issue because the fuel will turn into vapor again once the engine reaches operating temperature and stays there for a while; this isn't an issue for an ICE-only car because the ICE is running all the time. However, with a PHEV with a reasonably long battery range, if you use the ICE for only a few miles, the oil never gets up to and/or maintains operating temperature for long, which means that unburned fuel that condensed remains in the crankcase to mix with the oil. This builds up over time and causes the issues with fuel contamination, which lower viscosity and flash point temperature.

From my latest oil analysis report (https://rennlist.com/forums/cayenne-...-e-hybrid.html), based on my frequent use of electric-only mode, I'm comfortable with only using the oil for 6-7Kmi or 6mo. Note that since the CSeH doesn't break out electric-only miles, it's actually much fewer than 6-7Kmi on the ICE. To give you an idea of how often I use electric-only mode, I have about 24Kmi on the odometer, and lifetime fuel economy is 46 MPG

paul29

Interesting, but how can the fuel vapor condense on a surface that is the same temperature as the vapor and that surface is immediately starting to warm up. Condition vehicle moving under battery power as the ice starts ambient temp 20deg F the same air flowing over the engine is flowing over the fuel tank and lines so both fuel and engine are at the same temp and the engine is direct injection. The fuel injector is nothing more than a high frequency operated valve and any valve can leak.