SteveFromMN

I think they detected when one set of wheels were turning and the other set wasn't. Then changed the mixture to burn lean and hot. Wouldn't hurt engine for a short time but would cut emissions way down. They hacked the test so to speak.

JRoach

Appreciate all the good input. Going back to my original question: will the VW emission issue will effect the Cayenne diesel. It sounds like a "no" because of the Ad-Blue system. I kind of agree that this might be a big enough change in a system that would require new logic so therefore it might not have the same issue unless it is found later that they did the same across the board. I never imagined that this was an industry practice and can see the points made by both sides in the previous posts.

visitador

The answer for me is that we don't know. Remember that it all started with the independent guys conducted the original test because they were actually trying to promote VW's claims. Besides the VWs, they also used a BMW X5. That X5 passed all those tests. Unless they had also a 3.0 V6 Audi TDI engined car (the Cayenne diesel engine) in the mix, there is no way to tell whether VW did not also cheated. Yes, some of us say that with the Ad Blue, there is no longer an issue. However, short of someone doing an actual real life test (like those original researchers), who knows?

[Edit: Some of the VW 2.0 engine cars involved in the EPA action were already using AdBLue]

alexb76

Only the 2016 upcoming model, and they were surprised why it still had the same software.

alexb76

I really think the Ad-Blue engines won't be impacted at all (like the X5), but EPA will probably ban ALL non-Ad Blue cars. This WILL impact Diesel reputation in general.

The majority of the news and media report just said "Diesel engines" and never mentioned anything about Ad-Blue system or not, hence the perception out there would definitely be a lot more negative towrads Diesel, and hence it will drive the demand and prices down, but that's just speculation on my part.

JRoach

ref - http://www.pri.org/stories/2015-09-2...-and-thats-big

excerpt - "In addition to fines, the automaker is facing a massive recall and the Department of Justice also announced its own investigation into Volkswagen's actions. Late Monday, the Detroit News reported the diesel investigation was expanding to the 3-liter V6 diesel engine used on Audis and the Porsche Cayenne.. Consumer lawsuits are also expected."

Let's assume for a moment that the Cayenne Diesel is guilty of the same sin of its less costly sisters. No problem, just re-flash an eprom or load a new software stack and your good to go...... or are you?

Wouldn't something have to give; performance (acceleration) or mileage (MPG)? Isn't this the three legged stool argument with contractors; you can only pick two - cheap, fast or good?

I love the mileage that we are getting now, consistent 25+ and on trips I have managed to squeeze 38 out of the little weasel (although the command system sucks but save that for another post

It would be pretty hard to tell folks that spent over 60k that at your next maintenance interval we are going to de-tune your car. While I'm not a hippy I do respect the environment and the purpose of buying the Cayenne was better mpg, it was clean and it could tow a boat allowing us to retire our current 'kraftstoff schwein'.

I suppose the manufacturer allows for a little wiggle room in the specs so maybe the de-tune will be within the advertised tolerances (i.e.: mileage will vary based on driving habits so the reason you are getting poor mileage now is not the de-tune but a problem in your ankle) but I don't see this as a good thing if it falls upon my, less than 3k miles on the odometer, Porsche.

abatis

Maybe the EPA can get Porsche to fix the Speedo error issues along with the counter cheating software upgrade.

PJ Cayenne

If they make changes to my Diesel reducing performance and fuel economy, Porsche will own my car. I bought what I bought. It performs as advertised at least in my mind. Any changes reducing performance would represent consumer fraud. But I think JR is correct, any changes will be just on the verge of noticeable.

If the 3.0 is affected, I won't return for the recall until I know exactly how it will affect my car.

wrinkledpants

A lot of TDi drivers of the 4-cyl type get mpg numbers way beyond the EPA data. The V6 TDi drivers seem to get what the epa shows. And because it uses an ad-blue system, I have a hard time believing that there is much cheating going on with that motor.

Cheating, even just a little, on a light-weight 4-cyl TDi yields pretty big results compared to cheating on a 5K lb SUV that might yield 1 mpg difference.

DWPC

Ummm...
http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/201...er-v6-diesels/

997xpress

Yeah - everything VAG is suspect now.

Sniffer

To me that reads like "Ok, the 4 cylinder was cheating so lets have a poke around at the other diesel models just in case"

Nothing more, nothing less......

DWPC

Class action specialists are licking their chops.

visitador

That's the point, right? It is a matter of corporate character. If you are cheating to make the numbers look nice on one product, what will stop you from doing the same on a different product. As a regulatory agency, it would be unconscionable for the EPA not to investigate and check. For me, that is better. If the V6 TDI is found to meet the standards, then a cloud of uncertainty is lifted.

Edit: From the following article, Porsche claims that it, and not mother VW, conducts its own emission calibrations:http://www.businessinsider.com/porsc...scandal-2015-9

Larmo

The real problem for Porsche is CAFE. These clean diesels were a fundamental part of VW's CAFE strategy which allowed them to make outsized profits on non-complaint lines like Porsche. The reason Porsche was allowed to operate an entire brand that cannot comply with CAFE was because VW was allowed combine all brands under the VW numbers. If the clean diesels are eliminated, Porsche may need to be modified for higher mpg which will necessitate smaller engines.

Eventually, electric vehicles will bridge this gap but in the short run the wholesale elimination of TDI sales in the fleet will impact low mpg Porsche cars like the Cayenne.

Which may mean... get 'em while you can.