oldskewel

... or an Outlook email received popup during your Powerpoint presentation to the board of directors.

EDIT - sorry if those ancient references to email and Microsoft products make no sense to anyone. There is still such a thing as a board of directors, right? BTW, who is this Alexa and why does she know about my slippery pete order?

oldskewel

A slight modification to this sort of thing, that I've done on my X5, and I think may be more convenient if it works on these Aisin transmissions too ...

By jacking the vehicle so it is not level, you can slightly overfill the AT, even when it is warmer than the level-setting spec temperature. Jack it so the fill port is higher than when the vehicle is level.

The difference is that then (tomorrow morning, for example) when you go to do the careful setting of level, there is no need to pump in fluid. It is already overfilled slightly. You just need to remove the fill plug (while engine running, vehicle level, AC on, after cycling the shifter, etc.) to allow enough fluid to drain to get you at the right level. More convenient and faster, so it will be less of a challenge to get it done before things warm up too much.

BTW, anyone have any ideas why "they" (this is common, at least for Mercedes, BMW and Porsche; including at least ZF, GM, and Aisin AT's in those cars) specify such a low temperature for setting the level vs. a truly warmed up temp, which would be far more convenient and easy to set accurately? For example, put the fill port 2 mm higher (or whatever accounts for the expansion of the fluid at higher temp) and specify something like 80*C. DIYers like us can work around it, finishing things the next day with not too much trouble. But for pro's, it turns a 1 hour job into a much longer job (most of it waiting time) if really doing it at the specified temp, which is far less convenient for everyone.

Brainz

You really want something like this at a minimum. I tried using the typical auto store hand pumps and you will wear yourself out. A garden sprayer or similar Motive Pressure Bleeder/Filler is MUCH more effective. You can pressure them up with 30 pumps or so prior to getting under the car (with the engine off to start). Fill with 5 liters or whatever it holds cold and not running (ie, fill it till it spills when cold and not running). Crawl out, refill your sprayer and pump it up again, start the car, cycle the gears, put in park, and get back under there to finish filling it with the engine running. The pressure sprayer probably fills about 1 liter /minute, so you can likely fill the trans before it gets to hot -- even if you're starting at 40 degrees C. I would not do it any other way.

kadn33

I've been looking for one like that since I did the diffs and transfer case but I had no luck in finding it locally and I am glad I didn't because after asking for 9 qts of Type IV at Toyota they gave me two 4L cans plus one 1L can like the picture, so no chance for Slippery Pete sadly.




This is really interesting and I'd say it would work perfectly but unfortunately I only have the factory jack plus two jack stands. I don't think that's safe enough to go underneath vs raising the car to the highest level suspension and crawl under.
Happy to see different approaches and solutions from other members though.

At the end and after being provided with cans instead of plastic bottles I went straight to the garden shop and found the exact same dispenser as Joefus recommended, 3L capacity but locally branded, and even better the hose I had at home fits perfectly in the valve outlet:



Bonus: Mrs kadn33 is happy on the purchase for gardening purposes as well.

Only thing pending is to pick up the filter, gasket and pan seal from the post office today and tomorrow morning I'll give it a try.

Thanks to all and I'll keep you posted.

kadn33

I've finally had the chance to replace the transmission oil early this morning.

The trans oil temp was 44°C / 111°F but because I had the new oil at home with the A/C on I guessed it would bring the value down once filled and it worked. I took my time and goit it all ready for refill and the first 3L -a bit less actually - went in easy. The gardening dispenser is a must and made the filling the easiest part of the whole job.

Then engine on, cycled through gears 3 times pausing 5 seconds in each and fill again. It started at 36°C / 97°F and stopped at 43° / 109°F when the oil started to come out. It took another 3L and a bit this time. I emptied a total of 9L in the dispenser and there are 2,5L remaining so the oil quantity in the trans right now is 6,5 L which seems to be low. I was expecting at least 7L in.

Now I'm letting it cool down until tonight or tomorrow morning to make sure it goes under 40°C and will check again.

Regards and thanks all for your help.

Brainz

Did you a) drain 9L of old fluid, or b) put 9L of new fluid in the garden sprayer before filling, and you have 2.5L left? Or c), both a) and b)?

6.5L sounds on the lower side of OK, but it depends somewhat on how thoroughly you drained the trans. If you leave the pan off and/or remove the valve body it will drip for hours/days and you'll get more old fluid out versus if you drain and refill within an hour through the drain plug. Leaving the trans to drain over night can result in an extra liter or two of fluid draining vs just removing the drain plug for 30 mins or an hour.

Now that you've refilled it, you ou might try driving it for a day/week and then rechecking/refilling the level. If you get any delay in engagement of drive or reverse, you have too little fluid. In my experience you'll notice it in reverse first thing in the morning (when cold). If its really low, it will impact forward drive too.

One other note that I've raised in the past, but hasnt been definitively settled is what constitutes "level" for filling? Vehicle level or trans level - - and how measured? It's not clearly specified in the manuals.

When I put a level on the bottom of my trans pan (vehicle on ground with air suspension raised to highest setting), the trans sloped downward to the rear. Part of the slope is no doubt from the drainage slope in my garage, and there may be some rake in the suspension depending on how your air suspension has been adjusted, but there also can be settling of the rear trans mount that can all contribute to the transmission tilting to the rear.

With chocks behind the front wheels (be safe!), I used a trolley jack under the tow hitch to lift the rear of the car until the bottom of the pan was level. The rear wheels stayed on the ground, but the rear of tge car was lifted noticeably - - maybe 2 inches at the bumper. Because the fill port is at the rear of the trans pan, I was able to get another half to full liter in the trans with the rear lifted to make the pan level. That's been at least 20k miles ago without issue.

YMMV.

kadn33

My writting was confusing now that I´ve read it again, my apolgies.

I put 9L in the dispenser and filled the trans with around 6,5L. After the job I measured the drained oil quantity and it was something around 6,5L as well so I was good. It drained for like 30 minutes, maybe less: the time it took me to clean the pan and magnets, put the new gasket etc...I took my time.

This morning I checked the oil level with the trans temp at 40°C to find no drip, so quickly filled and finished at 42°C. I`m not sure how much oil went in because I spilled some and made a mess. Maybe 0,5L more guessing from the time it took to start to come out.

Reset the adaptation and took the car for a wash and some driving and now the gear changes are so smooth that I don´t even notice them. There used to be some judder or pulsing shake - not sure how to describe - when downshifting 4-3 and 3-2 and now that is gone as well. Very happy with the result.
I think that´ll do unless I notice some delay or other issue as you mention during the following days.

Regarding the level condition of the car, the manual I have states Vehicle must be horizontal in order to check ATF and that´s it. Maybe the extra oil going in if the trans is level vs vehicle level makes no difference in its behavior. Can too much fluid be harmful as well?
I also noticed that the manual says Selector lever is in position P and later in the process Move selector lever to positon N. IMHO as long as the expected amount of fluid goes in - similar to the volume drained - and the trans works fine, the job is good.

In any case, thanks for all the tips and suggestions. Very helpful.

Pic after the wash because why not

Petza914

I did my front and rear differentials and transfer case because they were simply drain and refill, but haven't tackled the transmission yet. Other than the fluid I'll be using, what else do I need - a pan gasket and filter along with my Durametric to monitor temperature?

Is there a complete DIY in the Cayenne DIY section?

Thanks.

Vivid7

check DIYDAN on youtube. he has links to all of the supplies needed and a good step by step video.

kadn33

This^^

The air tool is a must to undo the inspection plug in the pan.

I got spare seals for both plugs from the dealer as well

Brainz

Glad you got it sorted.

Pete, when you do yours, the biggest gotcha is reinstalling the filter to the bottom of the valve body (assuming you are doing a full pan-off change rather than just a drain/refill). The oring on the filter is really easy to damage or get seated incorrectly. The filter/oring needs to be pushed straight up into bore of the VB. If you push is crooked, the oring will get pinched or squeezed out. If the oring doesnt seal right, the VB wont be able to suck enough fluid from the pan - - which means you'll underfill the trans and get occasional fluid starvation in the VB which makes for lack of drive and/or poor shifting.

Buy lots of paper towels and wear old clothes... It's messy.

Petza914

Thanks guys.

At 35,000 miles, I'm not sure the pan off change is warranted. Maybe I just do a fluid refresh now and a larger service at 60k or so. What's the recommended change interval.

Mark7000

I agree, plus, most of the official procedure is overkill. Assuming no leaks in the trans to begin with, if you drain out 4 quarts, put 4 quarts back in. Or 5 or 6 or whatever you drain out, just put the exact amount back in. Repeat in a week or two and the fluid should be really clean.

Brainz

My original fluid looked reddish brown at 35k miles, not bright clear red like new. I'd replace at least every 50k miles.

Honestly, the filter is just a screen - - it doesn't really capture any debris, rather just keeps the bigger stuff out of the valve body - - I'd not bother dropping the pan unless you've got a leak or a valve body problem.

I used Toyota T-IV / Mobil 3309, which is factory spec. The Redline ATF equivalent or M1 ATF likely works just as well, but for longer than the factory stuff which is not labeled as synthetic. I seem to recall comparing specs and they were all similar viscosity.

Petza914

I like the simplicity of the measure and replace idea. I'll capture what comes out in an old oil jug or 2 so it's fairly precise and maybe 2 it twice a 1,000 miles apart.

I'll be using Driven AT3 Synthetic. Same thing I put into the Transfer Case