2004 Cayenne 955 Turbo Upgrade Build Thread, Custom Manifolds, BW EFR 7163's
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ElSpoon958 (03-06-2022)
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ElSpoon958 (03-06-2022)
08-14-2017, 05:21 PM
#20
Jayme, this is my favorite thread on Rennlist now that you slipped there may be a little spray added to the equation! You referenced the goal a few times, but I don't ever think I saw it. What is your power goal? With the twin 7163's and the squeeze you should not have a problem hitting 1,000 hp if you don't mind keeping a spare transfer case and transmission around, LOL.
This pig's going to roar! Can't wait to see her fly.
This pig's going to roar! Can't wait to see her fly.
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ElSpoon958 (03-06-2022)
08-14-2017, 08:51 PM
#21
Three Wheelin'
Thread Starter
Jayme, this is my favorite thread on Rennlist now that you slipped there may be a little spray added to the equation! You referenced the goal a few times, but I don't ever think I saw it. What is your power goal? With the twin 7163's and the squeeze you should not have a problem hitting 1,000 hp if you don't mind keeping a spare transfer case and transmission around, LOL.
This pig's going to roar! Can't wait to see her fly.
This pig's going to roar! Can't wait to see her fly.
Ok, sorry, maybe I need to get off the sauce......
Of course my goal is to max out these turbo's! I am not sure where that is going to be. They are rated at 60 lb/min which equates to about 600hp each but they are only rated by BW @ 550hp. Maybe it has to do with them having a mixed flow turbine wheel and not a traditional axial flow? Irregardless I think we can count on them being able to support 1100 chp.
When I mentioned NOS, I was referring to a small shot for spool. Whatever that ends up being to get them going down low. Probably in the neighborhood of 25-100 shot. It would only be used for spool. Fact is that on the top end, once the turbos are getting close to there speed limit, NOS isn't going to be applicable without over-speeding the turbos at that point. That is going to be a big no-no with these turbos because of the Gamma-Ti turbine wheel. It has been recognized and admitted that they are not to forgiving on the over-speed. We don't want any turbine wheel failures. Of course having engine control like the Syvec's is a game changer. Even then, what people don't talk about with anti-lag is that it is super-hard on everything from the cylinder to the turbine outlet. With NOS we can spray a small shot and get the turbo's spooling INSTANTLY and have it shut off @ a predetermined boost level. Torque is going to be the name of the game here. Plus using the NOS like this a bottle will last forever.
Transmission and transfer case I know all the fear mongers are worried about but me not so much. It is what it is, a total unknown after 750hp/tq. This is where the Syvec's comes in to help things live. I feel that there are only going to be a couple of factors between the 800 and 1000ish mark. That would be Cams and
tuning. It's a guess after that. That is why I went with these turbo's. I feel like they are the largest turbo's that will be able to meet my goals while still being streetable and making power before we run out of rpm. On the other hand there are two smaller frames in the EFR b1 lineup to fall back on.
Stay tuned. I have a couple of good video's made but haven't had an opportunity to upload them. I'm going to talk about the lifters, one is for the Variocam adjusters deconstructed and explained, and one for my custom and repurposed scavenge tanks. Once we get through the top end of the engine in the next week or so, I should have the FMIC piping all done and the front of the pig going back together.
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ElSpoon958 (03-06-2022)
08-16-2017, 02:01 PM
#22
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One last pic before we move on to the top end.
Attachment 1240310
Attachment 1240310
08-16-2017, 04:44 PM
#24
Three Wheelin'
Thread Starter
08-16-2017, 05:11 PM
#26
Hell yeah. My first nitrous system was on a GM small block V8 back in 1997. It was a basic wet 150hp NX kit with all the individual safeties before the fancy progressive controllers hit the scene. I have been hooked on the juice ever since... or at least some of my car builds have. It got really fun and a little too easy in the mid 2000's when people figured out an LS1 could take a dry shot in between the airbox and the MAF and the computer/fuel system would perfectly compensate up to about a 125 shot.
Spraying the 100 shot at those low rpms to help spool will put down something like 140-160 lbs-ft of torque depending on how low you dare to hit it and what kind of nitrous system/controller you use. What are you thinking?
You will definitely get some mileage out of a 15 lbs tank since you won't be on it for long... it takes a ton of will power to not start playing with the bigger jets when it is so easy. I guess with all the time and money you have spent on this build and the nature of the turbos, the stakes are way too high to even consider. That temptation of course is one of the reasons why it gets such a bad rap.
You have a lot of us on the edge of our seats! I am excited to see when you get to the intercooler(s) and plumbing.
Spraying the 100 shot at those low rpms to help spool will put down something like 140-160 lbs-ft of torque depending on how low you dare to hit it and what kind of nitrous system/controller you use. What are you thinking?
You will definitely get some mileage out of a 15 lbs tank since you won't be on it for long... it takes a ton of will power to not start playing with the bigger jets when it is so easy. I guess with all the time and money you have spent on this build and the nature of the turbos, the stakes are way too high to even consider. That temptation of course is one of the reasons why it gets such a bad rap.
You have a lot of us on the edge of our seats! I am excited to see when you get to the intercooler(s) and plumbing.
08-16-2017, 06:33 PM
#27
Three Wheelin'
Thread Starter
Hell yeah. My first nitrous system was on a GM small block V8 back in 1997. It was a basic wet 150hp NX kit with all the individual safeties before the fancy progressive controllers hit the scene. I have been hooked on the juice ever since... or at least some of my car builds have. It got really fun and a little too easy in the mid 2000's when people figured out an LS1 could take a dry shot in between the airbox and the MAF and the computer/fuel system would perfectly compensate up to about a 125 shot.
Spraying the 100 shot at those low rpms to help spool will put down something like 140-160 lbs-ft of torque depending on how low you dare to hit it and what kind of nitrous system/controller you use. What are you thinking?
You will definitely get some mileage out of a 15 lbs tank since you won't be on it for long... it takes a ton of will power to not start playing with the bigger jets when it is so easy. I guess with all the time and money you have spent on this build and the nature of the turbos, the stakes are way too high to even consider. That temptation of course is one of the reasons why it gets such a bad rap.
You have a lot of us on the edge of our seats! I am excited to see when you get to the intercooler(s) and plumbing.
Spraying the 100 shot at those low rpms to help spool will put down something like 140-160 lbs-ft of torque depending on how low you dare to hit it and what kind of nitrous system/controller you use. What are you thinking?
You will definitely get some mileage out of a 15 lbs tank since you won't be on it for long... it takes a ton of will power to not start playing with the bigger jets when it is so easy. I guess with all the time and money you have spent on this build and the nature of the turbos, the stakes are way too high to even consider. That temptation of course is one of the reasons why it gets such a bad rap.
You have a lot of us on the edge of our seats! I am excited to see when you get to the intercooler(s) and plumbing.
And just as you stated, the fine line will be how much it takes to get spooled up and how long it has to stay on so there is a seamless transition from nos power to all turbo's with no bog during the switch. Since I have no idea how this combo is going to run it is all up in the air still. I dont think I can make the manifolds any smaller or more compact and still work up top. It may lag like crazy or it may suprise. It is all up in the air still.
Largest hurdle= tuning. Knowing positively where we are at and whats left.
08-16-2017, 10:49 PM
#28
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Your project is way more interesting. Blueprinting the turbo V8 Cayenne engine is somewhat brilliant since it's actually such a complex beastie right from the factory. Then doing custom turbos, pipes, cylinders and tunes - goes back to the old days when men were men.. and not afraid of gettng a little dirt under their nails.
I'll be very interested in seeing what your end result is. This isn't just throwing on a K&N filter and removing some cat-converters and thinking it's way faster because it makes more noise - this is some interesting engineering being done to a very high standard. Fascinating stuff to an old engineer.
08-21-2017, 09:06 PM
#30
Three Wheelin'
Thread Starter
Moving on to the top end...
This is going to be more like a few basic pictures because I just wanted to get down to business. However, I have all the information for you and whatever isn't in my head is in the Aftersales Training. Hopefully this area can be a bit more open for discussion.
A few points of interest per the Factory Service Manual:
"NOTE: As of model year 2005, the first camshaft bearing cap has two standard
bores for securing the hydraulic valve (two M6 x 60 screws) -1- . An
additional oil strainer is fitted under the hydraulic valve."
I did purchase a set of fully loaded 2005 Turbo heads and cam housings off ebay for the pricely sum of $200. I used these heads for all my mockup and fabrication. They had suffered burned exhaust valves and the exhaust guides were quite worn. These heads did not have the strainer installed so my guess is that the strainers were salvaged to reuse or just plain fell out. All the cam caps were loose when I got the heads and cams were not included. Since my heads are from a 3-2004 build date they have just a check valve inserted here. It is a basic ball and spring deal that looks like this-
My guess is that it has about a .5-1.0 psi cracking pressure.
There is also one of these installed in each turbocharger oil feed line banjo bolt. These valves serve a specific purpose respective their positions. For the one installed in the camshaft housing it is a one way valve that helps the variocam operation. In addition, for both positions they serve to keep the camshaft housing oil galleys/variocam system from draining back into the block area/turbocharger center cartridge after shutdown. These are essential. Mine were not clogged.
This is going to be more like a few basic pictures because I just wanted to get down to business. However, I have all the information for you and whatever isn't in my head is in the Aftersales Training. Hopefully this area can be a bit more open for discussion.
A few points of interest per the Factory Service Manual:
"NOTE: As of model year 2005, the first camshaft bearing cap has two standard
bores for securing the hydraulic valve (two M6 x 60 screws) -1- . An
additional oil strainer is fitted under the hydraulic valve."
I did purchase a set of fully loaded 2005 Turbo heads and cam housings off ebay for the pricely sum of $200. I used these heads for all my mockup and fabrication. They had suffered burned exhaust valves and the exhaust guides were quite worn. These heads did not have the strainer installed so my guess is that the strainers were salvaged to reuse or just plain fell out. All the cam caps were loose when I got the heads and cams were not included. Since my heads are from a 3-2004 build date they have just a check valve inserted here. It is a basic ball and spring deal that looks like this-
My guess is that it has about a .5-1.0 psi cracking pressure.
There is also one of these installed in each turbocharger oil feed line banjo bolt. These valves serve a specific purpose respective their positions. For the one installed in the camshaft housing it is a one way valve that helps the variocam operation. In addition, for both positions they serve to keep the camshaft housing oil galleys/variocam system from draining back into the block area/turbocharger center cartridge after shutdown. These are essential. Mine were not clogged.