sjfehr

Yeah, Han's posted here about it, too (or maybe it was on sccaforums?); as far as I know, retrofitting koni inserts is the only affordable way to get DA shocks and stay legal in street. Unless there are other products out there we're just not familiar with? I'm planning to contact a couple other shops to see what they can fab up, too; already emailed one, but they haven't got back to me yet. Otherwise, if anyone sees old struts for sale or someone talking about their brand new coilovers, could you please PM me about it?

Another option I've looked into is non-adjustable Bilstein B6(HD) with custom valving, but I'd really like to be able to actually adjust and tune the car's handling myself.

mopar bob

I have a question about SS. You can change on swabar does it have to be factory like a GT3 or can you go aftermarket? Plus what about the end links? can they be adjustable?

burglar

One bar can be changed, aftermarket is OK. Endlinks are OK. Hell, you could do solid bearing blocks if you want, and even have it mount differently than the OE bar.

Examples of what's not OK is changing more than one swaybar, cutting holes or notching frames for clearance, or using the alternate mounting allowance for alternate purposes, eg chassis bracing.

mopar bob

Cool thanks that is what I thought. Now what would be the best bar?

XPC5

I ran a gt3 bar, and CCW wheels at the max offset. Stock shocks, but had looked at AST's and Motons. MCS would be the choice now. The car felt ok, but was pretty soft, hard on tires with no camber, and just was not close to the competition (1-2+ sec off on 60). It needed top shelf shocks and much more tuning, none of which would resolve the tire abuse It could trophy competitive, but I don't think winning.

sjfehr

Hey, I see MCS has all our cars on their price list! $4k for a set, but I bet it's worth it.

Q. Do 986 and 987 use the exact same fitment struts? Could I put a set on my 986S now and swap it to a 987 if/when I buy one?

What does a $4k set of MCS do that a $1k set of Konis doesn't?

btwyx

That's what I run on our H Street MINI. There's something to be said for not being able to screw up the handling yourself. (The car's good enough for top 5, out of 170, PAX around here, with the right driver.)

There's a theory, to which I subscribe, that there's a right damper setup for your suspension. Any fiddling away from that just makes you slower.

PedalFaster

Going by what I've read on the internet, versus anything I was able to discern myself despite having owned Motons and JRZs, and run on Ohlins and monotube Konis: capability for more low speed compression damping, more repeatable adjustments, and more consistent shock forces across the four shocks.

Maybe I just suck, but I didn't find running on high-end shocks to be a revelatory experience (although I never did back-to-back comparisons), so my current car has off-the-shelf Koni Yellows.

XPC5

$4k is a a good price. ASTs and Motons are more than that. I felt a noticeable improvement when I first drove a car with basic Penske doubles. Those were not known for very effective low speed damping, but still worked well, much better control and planted feeling when doing extreme maneuvers. Then I put some used motons on my STR miata, and it was another leap in control, and adjustability. You can feel a single click change, and noticeably alter the car to suit the course or driving style. In a tuner class where you can adjust spring and bar, it is not as critical I think. But it still allows you to make quick, on the spot changes, which may salvage 1 run out of 3. In a stock class, it is a a powerful tool, as you have gas pressure, and damping to fine tune the car balance.

abqautoxer

I know Stan and Stephen know this but I've seen the mistake so I'll just throw it out there, MCS can be two things. Recently it's Motion Control Systems = guy(s) from old Moton before AST bought them new company and good stuff. MCS can also mean Moton ClubSports which are not the same thing.

Biggest thing I can say about shocks, you really are paying for 2 things, quality and valving. If either is off, it doesnt matter. MCS is known to get the valving right and thats the attraction to them. Penskes are an excellent product but if you don't have them setup by someone who know what to set them to for your application, you might as well have Tokicos.

TomR

sjfehr

Thanks, guys. And yeah, I meant Motion Control Systems, which I've heard really good things about. I'm still having trouble justifying dropping that kind of scratch on shocks, though. Koni 8611: $1400 for the set; MCS 2-way non remote: $3500. If it's a huge difference in performance it may be worth it, but just feels like diminishing return territory and that I might be better off taking that $2k of savings and investing in part of it in evo school and the rest of it in making my wife happy so I can keep doing things like blow $1400 on shocks.

http://www.motioncontrolsuspension.c...ts/prices.html

Are struts interchangeable between 986 & 987? If I picked up a set for my 986 now, could I transfer it to a 987 next year?

Earlydays

If you sell the car, or get tired of the shocks, they are easy to sell....so you can recover part of your investment.

sjfehr

What sort of ballpark would you expect a set of motion controls that sold new for $3500 go for after 5 years? That's a serious part of my consideration, too.

Just how badly will a well sorted out 987.2S be outclassed in SS by Lotus, GT3 and Z06? Given index maker's figures the fastest car in SS is only somewhere between 0.7 and 1.5 seconds faster than the fastest BS car around a 60 second course; is the difference between these cars really that small? I'm not in the hunt for a national championship jacket, and this is going to be my daily driver; I'd rather drive a car I love and overcome a few tenths difference than a car I'm meh about but competitive. But I don't want to dump my heart, soul and wallet into this and end up a full second down.

Earlydays

Since the shock are rebuildable, I would guess $1500 to $2000.

With respect to PAX analysis between classes it's hard to give a single answer....there are so many variables, course design (tight vs. open), track surface, ambient temperature, etc.
For example, if you look at the 2013 SCCA Nationals, SS was won by a GT3 with a long course time of 72.37 sec. and a short course time of 53.15 sec., while BS was won by a S2000 (the only car running in the class) with corresponding times of 75.74/54.20 sec.

knfeparty

And if you look at AS, you will see that I was thoroughly beaten by corvettes in my 996. now that stock is street, all the corvettes got bumped down a class so now AS has z06 to contend with and SS has every insane corvette imagineable. I'm co driving a MR2 this year since the SCCA hates Porsches so much. I will cry every time I touch the gas pedal.