Kugley

I’ll preface my questions by saying that I have been running Pirelli DH’s on a 997.1 for about the last 18 months. Previous to that I was predominantly NT01’s. My goal was to go sub 2:00 at Thunderhill (3-mile) but could only get high 2:00’s. I met Enrique at the track one weekend, and the next thing I know I’m driving Pirelli’s ever since. On a clean lap I’m down in the 1:58’s. Yes, I cheated, but it’s also fun to pass some of the 991’s out there.
I was at Thunderhill this weekend running the 5-mile and decided to run NT01’s I had on another set of wheels. The weather was perfect and don’t think conditions could have been any faster, but I was off of my normal (slick) times by 6-7 seconds. Braking and understeer were the most notable differences.
Finally, here are my questions. Do you think you lose skill or become more complacent with a slick because you become reliant on more grip without having to drive the car the same way as something such an NT01? I want the faster times but improving my driving supersedes that. Should I stick with one vs. the other or mix it up and come back to reality once in a while?

audipwr1

2 with or without bypass?

audipwr1

I'll start the war / but to be fast you need to start with much slower car

F1CrazyDriver

Look who it's, stranger. Hope you're well and hopefully i get to see you in June!
This is my opinion without writing a book; the reason why people on the forums an instructor will suggest a "street tire" is because it's the easiest way to "slow you down", therefore you don't in danger yourself or others on track. By "slowing" you down- by giving you inferior tires, it makes you the driver "learn" (example, you're forced in elementary school how to do basic math "the long way" vs. using a calculator). Reality this trick is used for newbies. You're far from being a newbie - i have ridden passenger with you. Imagen a race driver practicing on street tires to hone his skill on practice day vs. sticky tires he will race on. lol - dosen't happen-ever. Again in lamens terms - "Street tires" are used to teach basics, slow you down- once you have the basics just roll big roller. So you rhink Fernando Alonso drove go-karts in bridgestones all seasons while karting ? lol OR in any of the series he has competed in ? Nill.

See you soon amigo.

Matt- completly irrelevant to his question. Slow car is preference, slow car (big picture) = in order to slow down things for easier to process. Back on topic.

p.s. congrats on getting sub 2's !

Kugley

Enrique, thanks for the feedback and glad to hear I get to keep the Pirelli's! What you said makes perfect sense. I'll still be trying to keep up with you. I'm bummed I can't make the private day June 2nd but will be up there the 3rd and 4th with HOD. Hopefully I'll see you then.

Kugley

No bypass.
Over the top of 5.

ngng

it's not so much about slowing down a driver as it is allowing the driver to better feel the car. a r comp and slick has a very small slip angle compared to st tires which have a much greater slip angle (and allow more room for mistakes if you aren't on top of the car)

mooty

^ you said very similar thing as to enrique.

it's a preference thing.

i learned tennis and got to varsity in HS in one year. from never seen tennis ever.
how did i learn it?
i read one book by borg.
he basically said, just hit the ball as hard as you possibly can, doent matter if you get it over the net or in the court. just keep hitting and one day the ball ends up in the court. wont work for everyone but worked for me.

just blabbering....
food for thought.

997rs4.0

Good advice^

Just remember to bring plenty of tennis *****. Or in this case a few back up cars.

Protocav

Putting less grippy tires on a car is not meant to slow it down...it is truly meant for more driver feel. Slower tires are typically much more progressive in their release than full slicks, so it forces you to be really smooth with your inputs. Not only that, it really builds your skills and reflexes and makes your hands faster. I actually bought slicks and then sold them because I realized that I was just chasing lap times. My real goal is to be a better driver, and hopefully your's is too. When I see people switch between street R compounds and slicks, there is a difference of roughly 2-3 seconds. The 6-7 second difference shows that your slicks are hiding some big mistakes that you are making on track. Not trying to be a dick, this is usually just the reality.

Do yourself a favor and ditch the slicks. It will allow you to feel what the car is really doing, and more importantly what it wants you to do (as it will talk to you more). I definitely get it...it's nice to see your name at the top of the timing charts. However, it's more impressive, and rewarding to know that you did it because of your driving skill and not fast parts.

Honestly, when we see people at track days post fast times on slicks, we just throw the times out. Similarly, when the typically fast guys at an autocross in fast, well set up cars have a runoff (fastest guys in all classes share a slow, normal car) they are seldom the fastest.

Just my food for thought...go back to NT-01's for 10 track days to see how you can improve your times and your driving. Move back to the slicks when your times get better (like 2 minutes or under). It will feel super slow at first, but it will give you the tools that you need to be fast at the end.

Chad

rellim

my 1 cent worth coming from bikes.
Buy the best safety gear you can. good leathers slide a longer distance and stay together keeping your skin in tack.
Buy the best suspension you can and set it up perfect, keeps the tires in contact with the ground for best traction.
Buy the stickiest tires you can and learn what the tires are telling you and what you can get away with. Set suspension to get the most out of the tires you use.

F1CrazyDriver

Completing week 1, of doing 5lb dumbbell , year 2 , do you keep using 5lb dumbbell ?
The limit is the limit, which is the limit. No matter what tires. It's just like any sport. Are you good ? How good are you ? Can you pick it up as quickly as Y? Can you be as good as Y ? this is such a subjective question as people's feelings get hurt. Budget constraints and some assume the skill level of a forum member on the internet (not a good thing). Scott can drive. Up the ante just know the faster you go - the more danger, the more safety you need in this sport. I have many more "finding the limit" pictures but some are not PG13 rated for the forum. Get $50k , ready to burn, get some slicks, get a coach, get a chassi setup guy w/ you - that should be a good start for a car. Or go shifter kart but still need a ~$30k budget


p.s. R comps on the SC, All weather performance on the AMG, Slicks on the Turbo. The limit is the limit.

ngng

i think it come down to, are you driving and feeling the car? if so, then by all means up your ante. i think that comparing weight training to high performance driving in 100k cars is a false cause

personally, i would rather push the limit on Rs and in the rain than push the limits on a slick.

as for finding limits, i always tell students to do it on the skidpad. if you can't save a slide there saving it on the track is just luck

ngng

either way, decent time in a 997!

Spyerx

I'm a firm believer in the R comp NT01. Super easy to chase lap times with $ and tires and power and and and.

But, why do we do this? Chasing lap times? there is always a faster car, Buy a viper ACR or a Wolf or a whatever.

I'm chasing my times. And as long as I keep taking time off I'm staying on the NT01. Oh, and when a certain someone drives your car and can run it 2-3 seconds quicker than your PB, you know there is time to be had.

I'm very low 2m over top at TH on NT01 on my .1 GT3RS. Hoping to get sub 2 this summer (well maybe not in the heat!!!!)

And I agree with Audipwr... but I just like driving the GT3 too much.