These forums can be depressing!
 

I like my RS, but after reading all the online posts about poor the LSD, center lock issues, coolant hoses that can let go at any second, and now the pressure plate/clutch issue. I am thinking of selling the car and getting a spec Miata. I don't feel like tracking my car anymore to be honest. I am at the point in my life where I want less stress and aggravation. :banghead:

I'm more concerned about the coolant fittings, but I'm having the same conversation in my head as well....

As long as you promise to make a DIY installing track mats or something in the Miata and post pics here I say sure go ahead ; )

Miata sure will be cheaper to maintain and insure.....but who wants a girly car with no balls? :nono:

I learned along time ago that there is a fine line for having a street car vs track car......after 100's of thousands of dollars spent on having fun at the track, repairing broken parts, beefing up existing parts, etc.... I can honestly say having a street car is less stress and aggravation. Sure I miss all the fun sometimes , but my CPO covers all this Pcar crap when and if it breaks, no questions asked...

There are a ton of track prepared cars out there for sale....look at 3 series bimmers if you want a fun car, relatively cheaper to maintain than pcars and much more fun than a miata.....

Let me advice you to go by your own experience (drive it / track it hard until something really fails) and real relevant data from trust worthy sources. There's a lot of BS that gets posted and several others jump immediately on the bandwagon and the casual reader might get the impression that all this cars are a POS.

Even for the famous LSD wear, most users that complain about this do it based solely on static tests but not real track "misbehavior" as 99% of those drivers don't really push the car to the point that LSD locks and you lay down 2 (instead of 1) black lines on exit. Also, most still leave the TC/PSM on, which still doesn't allow the benefit of the LSD as the rear tires are braked by the nannies before significant slip happens.

Dont read and believe, go drive...

so true great point...these forums unfortunately get most of the bad experiences when stuff breaks, so readers get impression all the same model cars have the same issues....

Agree on the LSD with this caveat. On the 6GT3 the most noticeable effect when tracking is the rear instability under heavy braking from high speeds with a bad LSD. Never had any issues with acceleration.

Now the GT2 is a whole nother ball game with a bad LSD.

Peter

There is always two sides to the coin... ;)

The reason P-car or other marque issues are reported in this and other forums is because they tend to appear frequently. It's not always easy to determine the likelihood of experiencing these failures in one's car but they are a reality. Defects and safety issues should not be ignored or diminished in significance IMO. They should not exists and they need to be corrected.

For daily driven vehicles chronic reliability or safety issues are much more than an inconvenience for most owners. IMO these problems should be resolved quickly and as painlessly as possible by the car mfg. Ignoring the problems won't make them go away but customers may leave the brand as a result of poor service or defect issues?

As far as tracking goes a P-car is a fun experience but it requires more maintenance as a result, like any tracked vehicle. Dedicated race cars are nice if you have the time/budget/space etc. People should chose what works for them as no two situations are the same.

Agreed....however that does not mean that those faliures should be dismissed, as they are part of motorsport...although most here do not race but we are as close as it comes to it and mechanical issues should not be a reason to stop driving IMO.

I'm keeping mine.
LSD don't worry. I had 11 gt3 all but one has open diff. Just drive around it. I never had braking instability maybe I'm
Too slow. But I know two drivers who did 1:37 with Hoosier and stock gt3 with open diff. They have no plan to fix it.

Coolant u r in taxes. Just run water mixed with beer

CL. I spent three hours yesterday putting car on stands and REALLY played around with CL. Once u really get ur hands dirty and understand the mechanism it's not bad. Though 5 lug still easier b

PP I know two cars. But that's small %

Engine. I know three cars had engine issues. But small number.

Just drive it. Fix it when broken. I was selling only bc I really have no time driving it. I mean it literally. I barely get enough
Hours to sleep everyday.

Miata. I love it had nine inc one spec Miata. I even commuted in my spec Miata no AC caged in my suit and tie in heavy traffic. So I'm no softie. But unless ur racing Miata is not it. I can run faster backward. In de I'll just out drag u on straight and park it in turns. I can see ur middle finger and swearing already. Now if ur racing SM then it's the best and probably the only real amateur racing.

All of this LSD talk in so many threads, I think t's time to check mine after 2 hard seasons out there on my car/diff... What would I notice in the GT2 Peter??

As for the OP, it sucks when you have something looming in the back of your mind, really hinders you from enjoying the car to it's fullest potential, i've been there but just got over it... Just drive the hell out of it, but check up on the issues before hand to make sure all is well, and in between. If still not comfortable, go for a spec cayman or something?

My LSD (when TC is on, and driven hard at the track) makes the same noise as an AK-47 when attempting to lock.... is it bad? It felt like something was going to fall out the rear of the car....

That was one time. After that, I went back to driving with TC/SC OFF.

I wouldn't get rid of the GT3 though... I've overlapped spec Miatas (in advanced/solo groups) at Sebring :D

The key to going really fast in any car is not caring about the car a great deal. The Miata fits the bill.

Racing a spec miata is great fun. I found racing a spec miata far more fun than de with a GT3RS. If you want to race, get a spec miata and have at it. You will have no regrets. Others will argue, but no venue in amateur racing is as intensely competitive as spec miata.

If you plan to track in a DE/track day environment, I'd keep your GT3. The miata is fun because you are nose to tail or wheel to wheel most of the race. The complete lack of power is going to be frustrating in a DE environment

Some wheel spin in slow speed corners like the Safety Pin @ Sebring and Oak Tree @ VIR. Probably something of an issue in the wet. Still having the rear walk around braking from 150+ mph was the biggest reason for me to upgrade.

If you don't notice these issues then U are golden.

Peter

As others have said, just get in and drive. If something happens, repair it (read: upgrade) then. I still have oem LSD and it's working. When it dies I'll upgrade the guts then. A thorough exam found the start of pulling coolant fittings. Tech pulled the engine and welded them up. Now I'll never worry about that again. Shocks wore out....motons went in. Stuff like that. No big deal. :D

i started doing DE this year and saw with my own eyes 3 cars smashed and towed out from NHMS. reality is - sometimes sh$t does happen on a track. and this 'sometimes' seems more like 'all the time' IMHO.
So unless one can shell out enough to get same replacement car right away it would make sense to adjust the priorities.

i am not sure about spec miata but spec boxster or ariel atom does make a lot of sense to me, as soon as transportation issues (trailer+tow vehicle) were taken care of. track car should be cheap and simple enough to fix and I think of something within $20K budget to buy. spec boxster imho is a great platform to consider.

^ + 1

The car in my avatar has 37k miles (about 30-40% on track), countless brake pads, tires, oil changes, RMS, diff rebuild, and on my second set of PCCB rotors (will not settle for anything less). Wear & tear = enjoyment of car! Just go drive!!!:)

Thanks guys....even for the bitch slaps! I will run the car until it breaks but I will also tweak out the M3 a bit and hammer that one more.

I just figured out that I have 2 screen names. (UGH!) Posted by my most used name:

Thanks guys....even for the bitch slaps! I will run the car until it breaks but I will also tweak out the M3 a bit and hammer that one more.

quite honestly, I dont think if I had an M3 (E92) and an RS I would bother modding the M3 at all ... unless you were planning on stripping it out and turning it into a pure track car, you could spend 1000's on suspension, brakes etc and still not get the performance and experience that you would from the RS ...

save your cash, drive the RS, *if* something brakes and it doesn't get warranted then use the money to fix it ... regardless of the perception created by some of the problems we have discussed recently on this forum the 997 GT3 (RS) is still the best production track car out there for performance and reliability IMHO ...

... or

use the cash and arrange another "model" photo shoot pls!

:D

Sure, people complain about the various issues when tracking the cars.

Now go ahead and find another car that will have less issues under same usage pattern while being capable of similar speeds. It also must be street legal.

The GT3 is the best there is for DE type driving. Racing is a totally different subject.

And don't bother with the M3. Great street car. I love mine. Too portly for the track, though.

The amount of modification needed to make it fun on the track is huge. Total reworking of the suspension and the brakes is needed. To process of installing a racing seat and roll bar is a complete hack compared to the Porsche. With the GT3 you get most of what you need straight from the factory.

Well said.

I never pound on the car anyway. Its always 75% at the track. I save it all for when I get to do a race. My wife allows one a year..but she lets me hang with those models! HA! For the hell of it...here is a shot of my motorcycle with a model. She lets me get away with a lot :)

+1

WTF is she (not) wearing ...

you are a lucky man to have a wife that lets you anywhere near those girls!

Very nice picture and I must say and (no offense) what motorcycle? :roflmao: BTW keep the car that hottie needs a ride! :evilgrin:

Interesting thread. I felt some of the same feelings, but most of the replies here are the right answer- just drive it. If you got the recent Christophorus, you probably read about the guys who took a street
GT3 RS and ran it at 24hrs Nurburgring and placed 13th! That's pretty amazing and telling about the car. So impressive. And to boot, the car was driven to and from the track. There aren't very many cars that could do this.

M3... you can put in 50k, it still aint gonna hold a candle to RS.

There is always some good info here, especially when it comes to upgrades. We got a good deal on the telemetry/video systems thanks to the hard work of a member here on Rennlist.

But I do have 2 words for you:

Analysis Paralysis

I agree with some of the previous notes, just drive the car and enjoy it. If something breaks get it fixed. We all have new cars that probably are still under warranty so lets just have fun.

I bet if you went to the corvette or mustang forums there would be twice as much stuff about fix this or fix that.

Relax

Owning many corvette Z06's for 10 years I had one corvette break just driving like grandpa and then service could not figure out how to fix it and the car sat there 30 days. I'm much happier with Porsche;) Enjoy those cars and be thankful you don't have to encounter Chevy service. :icon501:

Whats depressing is NOT having an RS!! BUT I admit I forget about it when I drive the C2S.

Ask me how I know that, oh to well? :icon107::icon107:

me too...:(

Exactly... From my own experience there's no other brand of car (at that price) that you can take "as is" to the track, drive them hard, and have a lot of fun with reliability and consistency. Modern, portly M bimmers are a disgrace to the heritage (for track work).

Nothing has failed at the track on any of the street P-Cars I've had (Racing is another story, but its normal given the exponential stress)

wow, FINALLY figured out how to multiquote, only took 8 years on RL. :evilgrin:

bmw. break my wallet.
i HATE those things; after 15 or so of those, no more, EVER.

...and nowadays they are even unreliable for street duty. My wife's latest (2) X5s that we have leased (after the Cayenne b/c it didnt have a 3rd row), have been a reliability nightmare. Visits to the dealer every month and left stranded twice in the middle of nowhere:mad:

new pepper is very nice. but i am surprised that it didn't have any provision or even a jump seat for 3rd row.

thats why i dd a benz and so does my wife

Yup, and you can't beat the 7 year 100K MB Certified warranties!

I had bought new pre-launch edition '00 X5 4.4 Sport. In 3 years and 40K miles maybe 3 months all was OK. That was my last BMW. Engine cooked, many electrical problem, many rubber bushing, boots etc tearing.
It left my wife stranded 3x. She refused to drive it the last few months after it stalled on a freeway exit and she could not keep it in the corner without powersteering and it sat in driveway while lease ran out..
After that R350, S430 and now E320CDI and CL 65.. No real problems. Looking to add R320CDI or ML 320CDI.

:soapbox:

True to that. I will say though, I love the M car's in general, I mean awesome feats of technology as a whole. Just irks me that they aren't put together well enough to hold up to the stressors we would love for them to endure. The E46 M3 is still one of my favorite car's in the world, and oddly enough one of the most FUN cars I have ever driven.. I mean, it's so damn balanced and controllable at any limit, I use to do crazy things in that car, and when it was supercharged that threshold was even higher lol, as long as there wasn't an oil/fuel leak, belt snapping, etc... :soapbox:

In all, nothing compares to a Porsche in regards to purity/thrill/capability per RELIABILITY. Almost all of my mileage on my GT2 is track miles, suffice to say, the thing is a beast and keeps running HARDER as the miles pour on.. Consumables and little nags along the way were the only replacements (such as the oil sending unit which recently went)... All minor though and common , I am thoroughly spoiled by these GT car's and leave underwhelmed after a test drive in most other car's !

Hah John, took you long enough... To be fair, my M3's were reliable when stock, or slightly modded (not motor wise lol)... Once I touched stuff, was all down hill ! M5 had smg pump failures :(

See above, yea not the greatest.. Surprised to hear that about the other car's in the lineup (X5) but I guess it shouldn't be? Don't know what they are doing wrong, but maybe BMW should reevaluate their manufacturing priorities and quality control.

+1 While I find this site to have lots of valuable information, many issues get blown out of proportion and some things are just down right misleading. Porsche bases their GT3 technology on a proven race car that is very similar and I don't think there are too many other cars that do as well for a reliable street / track car. Take a 964 or 993 and turn it into a fast and reliable track car and you will realize how nice of a package the GT3 really is. Just enjoy your RS and follow your mechanics maintenance recommendations. You'll sleep a lot better.

I just spent the entire day at Eagles Canyon Raceway (NW of Dallas). My friend, Christian, organizes a couple of track days and we all split the cost equally among the drivers. There were only 15 cars, and I drove 75 laps (each lap is 2.5 miles), with very little traffic. Most of the laps were clean laps, unimpeded by traffic.

I drove the car to the track, did 75 laps on the track, and drove it back home. Almost every car out there had issues, except for...............

another GT3.