997.1 GT3 purchase advice
09-13-2017, 02:41 AM
#16
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The GT3 is just a used car. You need to give it a thorough used car check out.
This requires more than a drive around the block.
My advice is to visit the car cold and verify all the warning lights come on then go off when the engine starts and begins to run. Be sure the A/C is off. You test this later. If on the radiator fans run and this can mask an overheating problem.
The engine should idle with no ticking, knocking or other disturbing sounds as you look the outside of the car over.
Let the engine idle as you get out of the car and look over the body, tires, wheels, brakes.
Body panel gaps should be even. Headlights should fit snuggly in the fender. Peer in the radiator ducts. Full of trash budget for a cleaning. This likely means the body water drains are full of trash too and if so the water can back up and overflow into the cabin.
The front body water drains are located under the front trunk lid on either side of the battery box. You'll need a Torx tool kit with the security bits to remove the Torx screw that holds each panel on either side of the battery box in place. Remove the screw and check for trash build up.
The A/C condensers should have the same patina. If one is newer or looks different it has been replaced. Could be just a bad condenser or could have been from accident damage.
After the engine has idled a while have the seller take you on a test ride. The route wants to be around 15 miles long and chosen to give the driver a chance to drive the car like you intend to drive it. You want to experience the car in a mix of driving scenarios. City with its stop/go driving, boulevard cruising, and highway driving (with some when appropriate some hard accelerations thrown in).
After the test ride back at the starting point switch seats. Now you drive the car over the same 15 mile route and drive the car the same way though of course stay within your capabilities.
Back at the starting point then if you still like the car give it a used car check out. Be sure you test everything from head lights to tail lights, power spoiler (if equipped with one) to the A/C.
If after all of the above you still like the car and believe you can buy it for an agreeable sum of money arrange for a PPI. Among other things this gets the car in the air so a careful check for any leak sign can be made. Every gasket, seal, o-ring, hose, hose fitting, hydraulic line, line fitting, dust boot is checked for leak sign.
You want the DME run time and engine over rev counters read out.
For price I can't help you. I'm not at all current on GT3 market prices.
My usual advice is to plug in the car's numbers into www.kbb.com or www.nada.com and see what the trade in/wholesale prices are for the car and go from there. Some might argue -- and I couldn't really argue back -- these sites may not accurately reflect the market price of these cars.
A general rule of thumb is a car depreciates 10% off of the what the dealer paid for the car the minute the car is driven off the lot and then every year when the new models arrive the car depreciates another 10%. Now with particuarly crummy cars this depreciation curve can steepen. OTOH, with desireable cars the curve can flatten perhaps after time even turn up again.
But first and foremost you want to be sure the car is worth owning that it has no major problems and is basically a sound car.
This requires more than a drive around the block.
My advice is to visit the car cold and verify all the warning lights come on then go off when the engine starts and begins to run. Be sure the A/C is off. You test this later. If on the radiator fans run and this can mask an overheating problem.
The engine should idle with no ticking, knocking or other disturbing sounds as you look the outside of the car over.
Let the engine idle as you get out of the car and look over the body, tires, wheels, brakes.
Body panel gaps should be even. Headlights should fit snuggly in the fender. Peer in the radiator ducts. Full of trash budget for a cleaning. This likely means the body water drains are full of trash too and if so the water can back up and overflow into the cabin.
The front body water drains are located under the front trunk lid on either side of the battery box. You'll need a Torx tool kit with the security bits to remove the Torx screw that holds each panel on either side of the battery box in place. Remove the screw and check for trash build up.
The A/C condensers should have the same patina. If one is newer or looks different it has been replaced. Could be just a bad condenser or could have been from accident damage.
After the engine has idled a while have the seller take you on a test ride. The route wants to be around 15 miles long and chosen to give the driver a chance to drive the car like you intend to drive it. You want to experience the car in a mix of driving scenarios. City with its stop/go driving, boulevard cruising, and highway driving (with some when appropriate some hard accelerations thrown in).
After the test ride back at the starting point switch seats. Now you drive the car over the same 15 mile route and drive the car the same way though of course stay within your capabilities.
Back at the starting point then if you still like the car give it a used car check out. Be sure you test everything from head lights to tail lights, power spoiler (if equipped with one) to the A/C.
If after all of the above you still like the car and believe you can buy it for an agreeable sum of money arrange for a PPI. Among other things this gets the car in the air so a careful check for any leak sign can be made. Every gasket, seal, o-ring, hose, hose fitting, hydraulic line, line fitting, dust boot is checked for leak sign.
You want the DME run time and engine over rev counters read out.
For price I can't help you. I'm not at all current on GT3 market prices.
My usual advice is to plug in the car's numbers into www.kbb.com or www.nada.com and see what the trade in/wholesale prices are for the car and go from there. Some might argue -- and I couldn't really argue back -- these sites may not accurately reflect the market price of these cars.
A general rule of thumb is a car depreciates 10% off of the what the dealer paid for the car the minute the car is driven off the lot and then every year when the new models arrive the car depreciates another 10%. Now with particuarly crummy cars this depreciation curve can steepen. OTOH, with desireable cars the curve can flatten perhaps after time even turn up again.
But first and foremost you want to be sure the car is worth owning that it has no major problems and is basically a sound car.
too complex and too much car go wrong. I got burnt recently when I bought and 996TT...
09-14-2017, 06:23 PM
#17
Rennlist Member
I just saw a 2010 GT3 (mkII) with 3x,xxx miles on it for $100k on the forum. The mkI prices have escalated to a ridiculous price point where buying a mkII for about $10-15k more makes more sense to me. Yeah the CL is a pain in the *** but other than that they're great cars. The facelift makes the car look more modern, the engine makes more HP and TQ.
On a side note I do agree with Mike to a degree. The handling capabilities of these cars (including Turbo) are so high that it's kind of difficult to push the cars towards the limit and enjoy them out on public roads. Sure the Turbo is much more fun on a highway or a straight road but you still should not come nowhere near the limits of the handling of the car on public roads, so they do require track days to be appreciated IMO.
If I didn't have my GT3 right now and knew what I currently know I'd probably get a 981 Cayman GTS and toss that around on the streets at much safer pace.
On a side note I do agree with Mike to a degree. The handling capabilities of these cars (including Turbo) are so high that it's kind of difficult to push the cars towards the limit and enjoy them out on public roads. Sure the Turbo is much more fun on a highway or a straight road but you still should not come nowhere near the limits of the handling of the car on public roads, so they do require track days to be appreciated IMO.
If I didn't have my GT3 right now and knew what I currently know I'd probably get a 981 Cayman GTS and toss that around on the streets at much safer pace.
09-14-2017, 06:26 PM
#18
Rennlist Member
My suggestion would be to get a good PPI done, find a paint meter (got burnt there once) and try to find a local GT3 owner you can bring along to check the car out and listen to the engine etc. with you.
09-17-2017, 01:26 PM
#19
Nordschleife Master
My only advice and many will probably disagree cause this is rennlist ( land of the track junkies ) but to me the gt3 is miserable to drive on the streets. It has no TQ compared to the TT so you have wind it out to make it GO. Sure the sound is intoxicating and the feel is amazing but if you aren't going to track it you will be happier in the TT for street driving. My .02
I ONLY daily drove my 1st GT3 - and that was in bay area traffic (on GT3 #2, another daily driver)
the sound, as noted above, is something only TT drivers can dream of.
sure, does it have the tq of a TT? no. what car does.
perhaps I'm a NA guy and not a turbo guy....anyway, that's my $ .02
09-17-2017, 02:30 PM
#20
I think the only take away is both are great but both are different. Locate a buddy with a GT3 and get some seat time. To suggest that GT3s don't have enough torque is ludicrous and misses what makes it special. The only car I've owned that I felt lacked sufficient torque to make it enjoyable on the street was my Challenge Stradale. And that was as much an issue with the F1 transmission as it was torque. The other side of the coin is the joy you get from winding a GT3 out to redline through the gears. Plus a GT3 discourages you from using torque as a crutch. I'm a GT2 guy but to say that a GT3 can't be enjoyed on the street is nonsense. Try both and decide. The Turbo and GT3 are both great cars. GL! Best gt2-josh
09-17-2017, 04:55 PM
#21
Drifting
if you're a car guy you will know what to look for. get a ppi. dme print out . buy the seller .
if 100k is too much to risk go buy new. same issues but you have someone to yell at (dealer)
when I bought my gt3 I bought the owner/seller. we're still in touch after 4 years... person who purchased my turbo - we're still in touch ...as Mooty has preached- buy the seller .
you in SF area ? let's go for a drive . you find out if it's the car for you.
if 100k is too much to risk go buy new. same issues but you have someone to yell at (dealer)
when I bought my gt3 I bought the owner/seller. we're still in touch after 4 years... person who purchased my turbo - we're still in touch ...as Mooty has preached- buy the seller .
you in SF area ? let's go for a drive . you find out if it's the car for you.
09-19-2017, 12:02 PM
#22
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if you're a car guy you will know what to look for. get a ppi. dme print out . buy the seller .
if 100k is too much to risk go buy new. same issues but you have someone to yell at (dealer)
when I bought my gt3 I bought the owner/seller. we're still in touch after 4 years... person who purchased my turbo - we're still in touch ...as Mooty has preached- buy the seller .
you in SF area ? let's go for a drive . you find out if it's the car for you.
if 100k is too much to risk go buy new. same issues but you have someone to yell at (dealer)
when I bought my gt3 I bought the owner/seller. we're still in touch after 4 years... person who purchased my turbo - we're still in touch ...as Mooty has preached- buy the seller .
you in SF area ? let's go for a drive . you find out if it's the car for you.
09-19-2017, 01:14 PM
#23
For what it's worth the founder of Auto Kennel is a member of the R Gruppe. I didn't meet him at the events. I was NorCal and he SoCal. However my recollection is he only dealt with quality Porsches. He sells other stuff but he knows Porsches and he is not a typical dealer guy. I don't know this car but based on past history I can say there is a better chance it's good than not. Only a PPI will confirm. GL! Best JBO
