Titanium Lug Bolts came loose at the track
#16
Nordschleife Master
What's wrong with the OEM lugs torqued as per factory spec? Corrosion can be taken care of with CorrosionX.
#17
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
Do you track your car?
How much anti-seize should I use? How many threads? Any brand of anti-seize that you recommend?
#19
Registered User
After you torque your wheels, grab a yellow paint marker and paint on a line on each nut, orientated to be perpendicular to the wheel radius.
Then, you just need to peek at each wheel for a millisecond and know they haven't moved.
Works great...
That's why school buses have those yellow arrows on their lugs...
Then, you just need to peek at each wheel for a millisecond and know they haven't moved.
Works great...
That's why school buses have those yellow arrows on their lugs...
#20
Poseur
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
While I personally use Anti-Seize on items like this (lug bolts) it's my understanding that torque values published by Porsche are assuming NO anti-seize. it does make a difference.
#21
#22
Rennlist Member
Apply a thin coat of Optimoly TA (aluminium
paste) on the thread and between the bolt head
and movable spherical cap ring (arrows).
The bearing surface of the spherical cap
facing the wheel must not be greased.
Tightening torque of wheel bolts:
130 Nm/96 ftlb.
#23
Drifting
Just thinking out loud here.
#24
Race Director
I talked about this might being an issue back in 2008 or so of these forums. The torque spec for steels bolts vs Titanium bolts is going to be different. What that torque spec should be is anyones guess.
I personally wouldn't use Titaium bolts on my car...EVER! for this very reason.
DO NOT USE ANTI-SIEZE....the torque spec from Porsche is based on dry threads
I personally wouldn't use Titaium bolts on my car...EVER! for this very reason.
DO NOT USE ANTI-SIEZE....the torque spec from Porsche is based on dry threads
#25
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
The 96 to 118 figure is because Porsche changed to a different material for the lug bolts. in my 2012 car the manual says to use 96 for a few type of lugs and 118 for another type... mostly dependent on color. Titanium nuts are probably even more different which is why most guys who track just use steel or steel teflon coated nuts.
I talked about this might being an issue back in 2008 or so of these forums. The torque spec for steels bolts vs Titanium bolts is going to be different. What that torque spec should be is anyones guess.
I personally wouldn't use Titaium bolts on my car...EVER! for this very reason.
DO NOT USE ANTI-SIEZE....the torque spec from Porsche is based on dry threads
I personally wouldn't use Titaium bolts on my car...EVER! for this very reason.
DO NOT USE ANTI-SIEZE....the torque spec from Porsche is based on dry threads
I think I'm going back to regular steel bolts to put this issue completely to rest. I still have a suspicion that the loosening of the bolts on the track has more to do than just an out of calibration torque wrench.
Regardless how good they look, it's not worth the hassle as I'm planning to increase my number of track days this year. For regular street driving I wouldn't have a problem with them.
#26
Thanks for your replies!
I think I'm going back to regular steel bolts to put this issue completely to rest. I still have a suspicion that the loosening of the bolts on the track has more to do than just an out of calibration torque wrench.
Regardless how good they look, it's not worth the hassle as I'm planning to increase my number of track days this year. For regular street driving I wouldn't have a problem with them.
I think I'm going back to regular steel bolts to put this issue completely to rest. I still have a suspicion that the loosening of the bolts on the track has more to do than just an out of calibration torque wrench.
Regardless how good they look, it's not worth the hassle as I'm planning to increase my number of track days this year. For regular street driving I wouldn't have a problem with them.
https://mechanicalc.com/reference/bolted-joint-analysis
I didn't have time to play with the analysis. Maybe someone more junior right from college! Could give it a shot and report back
there some interesting s statements in the article on the effects of reduced friction due to lubrication. So I'd stay with the porsche manual recommendations on that
#27
Rennlist Member
This has been discussed many times in the 10 years I've been reading/posting but I've never seen any Porsche-documented reference to this other than the owner's manual reference to using Optimoly paste on the lug bolt threads. Can someone post up something definitive? Thanks.
#28
Drifting
This has been discussed many times in the 10 years I've been reading/posting but I've never seen any Porsche-documented reference to this other than the owner's manual reference to using Optimoly paste on the lug bolt threads. Can someone post up something definitive? Thanks.
That being said, are the properties of Optimoly significantly different than other anti-seize products? Are those properties different enough to create an issue with a non-recommended anti-seize and the factory torque values?
My initial thought on the matter is, no, it doesn't matter. But, that's purely conjecture.
#29
From the information I have, the Optimol TA paste is very different to antiseize. This was from the horses mouth - from a Loctite/Henkel engineer. He stated that Optimol is an assembly paste, and that the silver Loctite Anti Seize is a paste with abrasive particles - it's a great anti-seize compound but not suitable for either the 5-lug or center lock applications.
#30
Rennlist Member
Since this is a 997 section, I've attached the part of the 997 workshop manual with specific guidance to removing and installing wheels. The full section is included but for this discussion, the pertinent part is the last two pages on installing (pages 3-4). Also note the discussion on what wheel bolts are allowed and the use of Optimoly TA (Al paste). Note this applies only to 5 bolt wheels, there is a completely separate workshop manual section for wheels with a central bolt (i.e. center lock wheels).
Normally this is a trivial event for most, but for those who track their cars, for their safety and others on the track, it's a good reference and reminder of the recommended procedure.
Normally this is a trivial event for most, but for those who track their cars, for their safety and others on the track, it's a good reference and reminder of the recommended procedure.