TSW

Searching for forum wisdon here. I have an exhaust rattle on a CPO'ed 997 (2008). The dealer tech said all six bolts holding the exhaust were missing, which caused a cracked tailpipe and broken cats. I engaged PCNA and they and tech are citing "outside influence" as the culprit and saying CPO will not cover it. I am nearing the end of a 2 year CPO. Before I purchased, the prior owner had the RMS replaced at a dealership under warranty. Would this have required the exhaust be removed such that they may have screwed up putting the bolts on? I certainly have not touched the exhaust and am frustrated at the prospect of paying big $$ for someone's prior negligence. Thanks for any input.

rickdogg82

Prior negligence appears to be by the dealer who did not do a very good CPO inspection and let this go. If you bought the car as a CPO from the dealer, I can't see how they can claim they are not responsible for fixing it. However if you bought the car from another owner with CPO transferring to you they could argue that someone messed with it since they last touched it.

I think the dealer needs to fix it and you will have to push them to do so.

DC911S

I think cats are mandated by the EPA to be warranted for 10 years. Is your exhaust stock? If so then I assume the CPO dealer forgot to bolt it up properly. Point that out to them. Why would it still be stock and missing the bolts. If it was aftermarket then sure the people that put it in may have screwed it up

OKB

need to know which 6 bolts, who or why could they have been removed? Was the exhaust changed to something else? If there was aftermarket exhaust, too bad. Look up the warrantee service history and see if there was some service that needed to do this work. Then you could blame it on that dealer

TSW

Thanks for the helpful feedback. The exhaust is stock and, as far as I know, was never modified. Unfortunately, I am out of the EPA warranty - it looks like that is 80K (I am under) or 8 years, whichever is first (I have an '08). It is an annoying mystery.

I guess the CPO is not everything. I should have done a PPI. I just want the car fixed and back! Love the thing.

Macster

FWIW, you are not alone.

About 1.5 years after I bought my 2002 Boxster it was in -- under warranty -- for a new RMS and as is (or was at the time) SOP a new/improved IMSB end flange and bolts. Got the car back and the engine was oil tight and the RMS and IMS end flange/bolts have remained oil tight ever since.

Years pass. I can't recall the exact date but say sometime in 2014 I had the car in -- at another Porsche dealer 2000 miles away from the dealer where I had the RMS/IMSB end flange job done -- for cracked CV boots. This is not uncommon as these boots are at some point wear items.

When I went to pick up the car the tech reported he had a bit of trouble unbolting the half shafts from the transmission flanges. The problem was all the bolt head sockets -- they are either Allen head or Torx I 'm not sure which -- were stripped to the point the tech had to hammer some kind of an "easy out" like tool into each bolt head socket and loosen the bolt using the easy out tool.

Of course new hardware was required when it came time to bolt the half shafts back to the transmission flanges.

The only time those bolts have been touched was when the tech -- at the Porsche dealer where I bought the Boxster way back in Jan. 2002 -- had to unbolt the half shafts from the transmission flanges prior to dropping the transmission to get at the RMS/IMSB fllange and bolts.

DC911S

I would call PCNA and try to get a goodwill repair done. explain the whole thing....you bought CPO. never modded the exhaust and under a dealer repair the exhaust was was not properly put on and it failed. Lay it all out and tell them who the dealer is refusing to repair. At least get them to cover the labor. Contact the BBB if they don't do something for you. Get all of the documentation before you do anything.

TSW

Thanks for the feedback guys. As always, the forum is a great resource. I spoke many times with Porsche NA and mechanics at various dealers. Porsche NA was willing to cover if we could find anything in the service history that would have indicated a dealer touched the exhaust and it was not the dreaded "outside influence." We could not find anything. We researched the computer records and I called the original dealer at which the prior owner services the car. Maybe the prior owner swapped an aftermarket exhaust off and on, or maybe the bolts rattled off on these crap NE roads (it was and continues to be a year-round driven car).

So, I spoke with my trusty indy and he said we could look at many options, from a fix with OEM to some aftermarket stuff, all of which he thought he could do way cheaper than the dealer. My indy works on air cooled and water cooled 911s, so I will go that route. I will let you know what I end up with. Time to research exhaust options!

Double_J

Goodwill might be your best/only hope here for coverage, especially if it's been a while since you've purchased the car. No way to prove that you didn't mess with things after it left the dealer lot.

DC911S

I don't see how you can change the RMS without taking the exhaust off, perhaps you can but it would seem that lots of things have to come off and the engine needed dropped for that.

DC911S

He bought it CPO, so no way it had an aftermarket exhaust on it when it was bought. They won't CPO it with such things.

TSW

On the RMS point - the techs said for a Boxster the exhaust comes off, but for a 911, they just drop the tranny. It was a close run thing, but I lost the battle. It is disappointing, but I am sympathetic to Porsche NA's viewpoint that it looks like outside influence for the bolts to be missing.

On the plus side, the car is driveable and only makes funky noises when below freezing, so I cam get it over to my indy without a lot of trouble and take it from there.

John@Fabspeed

Unreal to hear you are having such trouble with your CPO! Often times individual dealerships are much more stringent and find any excuse not to honor the warranty, very sorry to hear.

In regards to replacing your exhaust, we have a wide variety of options and all are of the highest quality. I'd love to work with you to come up with a cost effective solution, and at the same time we'll get you some more horsepower and improved sound to take your mind off the unfortunate circumstances. PM heading you way