FYI on costs for a PDK clutch oil change
10-16-2016, 11:08 AM
#107
RL Community Team
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
Peace
Bruce in Philly
10-19-2016, 06:32 PM
#108
Instructor
For a Canadian reference, I just had my PDK clutch fluid changed at Mark Motors Porsche in Ottawa. Their senior technician did the job, same guy that is certified to work on the 918.
They did it without dropping the pan, and managed to not strip the drain plug threads on my very early '09 (summer of '08 build). I supplied them with 7L of FFL-3; surprisingly, they only used 3.25L of it (I found the rest still in the frunk when I got home). I called them and spoke to the tech - he said that this is typical unless the pan is dropped, which they wouldn't usually do unless the drain plug strips the threads. They assured me that this was the Porsche required 6yr/90K kms service using the PIWIS to work the PDK valves.
I was charged 1.5hrs labour plus $22 for a new drain plug.
They did it without dropping the pan, and managed to not strip the drain plug threads on my very early '09 (summer of '08 build). I supplied them with 7L of FFL-3; surprisingly, they only used 3.25L of it (I found the rest still in the frunk when I got home). I called them and spoke to the tech - he said that this is typical unless the pan is dropped, which they wouldn't usually do unless the drain plug strips the threads. They assured me that this was the Porsche required 6yr/90K kms service using the PIWIS to work the PDK valves.
I was charged 1.5hrs labour plus $22 for a new drain plug.
10-19-2016, 07:57 PM
#109
Just did my 10 C4S with 34K on the odo.
Just fluid, no pan.
$470 all in.
Tangentially I had been getting trans failure messages on dash. Was due to the ****ty battery I got at Advance Autoparts last year. Replaced that as well.
Just fluid, no pan.
$470 all in.
Tangentially I had been getting trans failure messages on dash. Was due to the ****ty battery I got at Advance Autoparts last year. Replaced that as well.
10-19-2016, 11:15 PM
#110
For a Canadian reference, I just had my PDK clutch fluid changed at Mark Motors Porsche in Ottawa. Their senior technician did the job, same guy that is certified to work on the 918.
They did it without dropping the pan, and managed to not strip the drain plug threads on my very early '09 (summer of '08 build). I supplied them with 7L of FFL-3; surprisingly, they only used 3.25L of it (I found the rest still in the frunk when I got home). I called them and spoke to the tech - he said that this is typical unless the pan is dropped, which they wouldn't usually do unless the drain plug strips the threads. They assured me that this was the Porsche required 6yr/90K kms service using the PIWIS to work the PDK valves.
I was charged 1.5hrs labour plus $22 for a new drain plug.
They did it without dropping the pan, and managed to not strip the drain plug threads on my very early '09 (summer of '08 build). I supplied them with 7L of FFL-3; surprisingly, they only used 3.25L of it (I found the rest still in the frunk when I got home). I called them and spoke to the tech - he said that this is typical unless the pan is dropped, which they wouldn't usually do unless the drain plug strips the threads. They assured me that this was the Porsche required 6yr/90K kms service using the PIWIS to work the PDK valves.
I was charged 1.5hrs labour plus $22 for a new drain plug.
10-20-2016, 12:18 AM
#112
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
There also seems to be a lot of reports about service advisors/techs saying less fluid is needed, but that doesn't agree with the service manual or even the owners manual (see page 290). Since anything significantly less doesn't agree with either the owners manual or the service manual I don't understand how someone could meaningfully argue that significantly less is correct.
My clutch fluid change used over 5 liters; I got back just part of the 6th bottle. That agreed with what the senior Porsche tech told me when I started this whole thread. This also agrees with a post on Renntech that quoted from the service manual. Here's a copy:
PDK transmission oil - approx. 3.12 quarts / 2.95 liters ATF transmission oil Mobilube PTX Formula A (SAE 75W-90) GL 4.5 - change at 120K miles or 12 years
PDK clutch oil - approx. 5.49 quarts / 5.2 liters Pentosin Gear Oil FFL 3 - change at 60 K miles or 6 years
Oil filling: The correct hydraulic oil level is important for operating the transmission without running into problems. The following preconditions must be met in order to check orcorrect the oil level:• Engine must be idling• Vehicle must be horizontal in both longitudinal and transverse axis• Hydraulic oil temperature between 86° F. and 104° F. (30° C and 40° C)• Selector-lever position “P”• Clutch cooling volume flow must be switched off (using PIWIS Tester in Oil fill mode)• Retain the described states for approx. 1 minute to allow the oil to settle• Open screw plug on oil overflow bore and collect emerging oil until only drops of oil are emerging• Once there is no more oil emerging, top up the clutch fluid until oil emerges atthe oil overflow bore• To avoid damaging the clutches, the procedure must be completed within 5 minutes(PIWIS Tester exits Oil fill mode automatically after 5 minutes)The correct oil level is also important to avoid damaging the gear wheels in thetransmission. There is also an overflow bore for this, which is located on the opposite side. The oil level can be checked in the usual way here.
Last edited by StormRune; 10-20-2016 at 09:43 AM.
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aways (04-07-2021)
10-20-2016, 04:53 PM
#113
Three Wheelin'
I called a dealer today. They quoted ~$800 labor only, to do a "PDK Service" with pan change. (I told them I'd bring my own Pan and Oil, the FCP Euro kit).
I tried to specify PDK Clutch Fluid change but I don't think the SA understood what I was telling him.
So, ~5 hours for this service from an over the phone quote.
I tried to specify PDK Clutch Fluid change but I don't think the SA understood what I was telling him.
So, ~5 hours for this service from an over the phone quote.
10-20-2016, 05:16 PM
#114
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
I called a dealer today. They quoted ~$800 labor only, to do a "PDK Service" with pan change. (I told them I'd bring my own Pan and Oil, the FCP Euro kit).
I tried to specify PDK Clutch Fluid change but I don't think the SA understood what I was telling him.
So, ~5 hours for this service from an over the phone quote.
I tried to specify PDK Clutch Fluid change but I don't think the SA understood what I was telling him.
So, ~5 hours for this service from an over the phone quote.
The SA at my dealer when I did this was completely wrong about it (telling me it used normal brake fluid!) until I had him go get their senior tech to come up and correct him... but that was about a year ago now. BTW, At that time, I ended up paying $370 in labor at the dealer.
I'm going to hunt down a corporate contact to let them know how screwy this appears to be based on the forum chatter. I'll let everyone know if this gets any meaningful response.
10-20-2016, 05:30 PM
#115
It's kind of shameful on Porsche's part that their SAs aren't more knowledge about this since it has become their most common tranny and more of them are coming in for 6 year service. If I were an SA I'd want to be fully conversant with every service item on the car... I'd think Porsche would demand the same of them but it appears that isn't the case (not just for this but for other things as well).
The SA at my dealer when I did this was completely wrong about it (telling me it used normal brake fluid!) until I had him go get their senior tech to come up and correct him... but that was about a year ago now. BTW, At that time, I ended up paying $370 in labor at the dealer.
I'm going to hunt down a corporate contact to let them know how screwy this appears to be based on the forum chatter. I'll let everyone know if this gets any meaningful response.
The SA at my dealer when I did this was completely wrong about it (telling me it used normal brake fluid!) until I had him go get their senior tech to come up and correct him... but that was about a year ago now. BTW, At that time, I ended up paying $370 in labor at the dealer.
I'm going to hunt down a corporate contact to let them know how screwy this appears to be based on the forum chatter. I'll let everyone know if this gets any meaningful response.
10-20-2016, 05:55 PM
#116
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
Storm, I wanted to say thank you for this and for all you have done to contribute your vast knowledge over the years lending to the 997 forum, especially now that you're in a 991 :-) we tremendously appreciate your support and still looking after us despite moving away from the 997.2..
10-20-2016, 07:12 PM
#117
What procedure has to be done on 5 mins - draining oil with engine on? If the dealer can't change the correct amount of pdk oil how can we trust that the procedure is completed in 5 mins.
Someone has to develop a DIY, it's only a matter of time as pdk cars hit the 6/60 mark.
Someone has to develop a DIY, it's only a matter of time as pdk cars hit the 6/60 mark.
10-21-2016, 12:27 AM
#118
Rennlist Member
10-21-2016, 05:23 PM
#119
If someone talked you into a 2 liter PDK clutch fluid change you didn't really get a proper PDK clutch fluid change. They only changed the fluid in the pan, not the two-thirds of the fluid still in the valves, pump, and lines of the system. In other words, you still have nearly 4 liters of old fluid mixed in with 2 liters of new. It's pretty much the same as saying you did a proper engine oil change by draining out and replacing 3 of the 9 quarts of oil, leaving 6 quarts of old oil in the engine. You wouldn't be happy with that would you?
Now, what about the cost: $321 for pan w/filter (only change once), $220 for oil (3.4Q X 3 changes @ $20ea.) and labor is free (DIY). The total is $541, which is $400 less than dealer.
Last edited by verboten; 10-21-2016 at 06:05 PM.
10-23-2016, 02:08 PM
#120
Instructor
Yes, if I did myself 3X! I finally did the math and a DIY is possible. The poster - Orange260Z said they changed 3.4 Q oil of a total of 5.5 Q or 62% (without a PIWIS Oil Fill Mode). If I drove the car (mixed the oil homogenously) and changed the oil again (same quantities) you would have 14.5% old oil in the transmission. In order to get the oil sufficiently clean (< 5%) you would only have to change the oil 3 times!
Now, what about the cost: $321 for pan w/filter (only change once), $220 for oil (3.4Q X 3 changes @ $20ea.) and labor is free (DIY). The total is $541, which is $400 less than dealer.
Now, what about the cost: $321 for pan w/filter (only change once), $220 for oil (3.4Q X 3 changes @ $20ea.) and labor is free (DIY). The total is $541, which is $400 less than dealer.
I can't tell you whether this is true or not, but this is what I was told initially would be done, and this is what was confirmed to be as being done when I called to inquire about the leftover fluid. I didn't really get any higher confidence level speaking with dealers in Montreal (~2hr drive) or even Toronto (~5hr drive). The only real alternative available to me would have been not to change the oil.