Drove Audi R8 V10 and Ferrari 458
11-04-2013, 05:46 PM
#1
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
Drove Audi R8 V10 and Ferrari 458
I was in Vegas and I went to the Dream Racing spot where you can do a few laps in various cars like GT-R, M6, R8, 430, 458, Gallardo, 430 GT Race car, etc...
I picked to do 5 laps in R8 V10, and then 458... pretty crappy track (1.1 miles), and not so much fun if one does track days regularly, but overall pretty good if you wanna see how these cars might be on the track.
First off, R8 V10:
- Great sounding V10, BUT not loud enough. I loved the tone, and the overall grunt, BUT not the volume of it, it could use some opening up and 3-6 dB more volume
- The cabin is very comfortable, the ride is amazing, the controls and steering, and overall fit and finish is great, I'd say in some aspects better than 997 and in some aspects not as much (a bit boring), so it's quite premium overall
- Transmission is a single-clutch on this model (I think latest is dual), and while in full throttle, the shifting is very abrupt, and you definitely feel it. I think I can up-shift smoother in my own manual car, but maybe downshifting was better than my current skills. Overall, I did NOT like it, I'd pick manual over this transmission.
- Handling and cornering was impressive, BUT, it was in a more dis-jointed and disconnected sense from the road. You could not really tell if the car's gonna grip or not, or how to modulate the throttle through a corner.
- Car was heavy, although due to good weight distribution and lower center of gravity you couldn't feel too much weight transfer.
- It was a lot more difficult to make the car turn with throttle, even more so than my C4S (both AWD), so the driving style must be adjusted
- Overall, I was NOT as impressed as I thought I'd be. It's a fantastic sports car, and a great overall package for a street sports car. I however do not think it's meant as a track car, and I really did not enjoy it as much on track as I thought I would. 997 is for sure more fun, and easier to toss around on track.
Second, Ferrari 458:
- Right off the bat, this thing is purpose built for track. What an amazing interior, and fit and finish. You get chills when you get in!
- Surprisingly roomy! For instance, I couldn't fit into Gallardo (6'2, 220).
- Engine/exhaust... OMG! What an engine/noise. Absolute Nirvana! You start the car and it just feels like a race car. The car sounds close to F1 I'd say, specially full throttle above 8K RPM, WOW!
- Transmission... I've driven dual-clutch cars before, and I have no idea what module is in this one, but it is BY FAR the BEST implementation I've ever seen. This thing shift like butter, and just like a race car, felt exactly like F1 shifting. Full throttle doing 120 MPH, you can up-shift and the car just shifts through with force but with great smoothness. Significantly better than 997 and 991 PDK, not sure how does it compares to 991 GT3 PDK. Absolutely the best transmission I've ever driven. I was never sold with PDK, but this thing just works specially well on track.
- Handling! Again, just amazing, the turn-in is so sharp you had to get used to. This it THE first car that is true to the statement of "you point it, throttle and it just GOES to where you want it". Just a different league!
- Track performance... just a DREAM! I could not find anything to fault with this car on track, it handled, shifted, accelerated, brake incredibly well beyond anything else I've tried.
- Overall: I was literally shaking getting out of the car after 5 laps, and was in complete awe! This car is exactly how it's been reviewed, and how it was described by Jeremy Clarkson and others, probably the best Ferrari, and maybe the best car you can buy. R8 was just a dog compared to this, my 997 felt like a car from a past generation, and I like to command Ferrari for creating such an experience in a car that can be had at the same price as a high-optioned 991!
Final Verdict:
As much as R8 wasn't that great on track, I think it's a fantastic daily sports car. It is fast, comfortable, sound great while not too loud, and I could easily see myself driving it to work and back and taking long road trips. I'd say better than 997 and more fun than 991.
458 was a different beast, it's a car to aspire to own, and is definitely now on my bucket list. It's amazing on track and I bet would be amazing for a twisty road trip, but maybe a bit too loud and not as comfy for longer trips like R8, 997 or 991 might be. Too bad it's too costly to maintain to be used as a track car, but oh boy is it amazing!
PS. Will add pics later!
I picked to do 5 laps in R8 V10, and then 458... pretty crappy track (1.1 miles), and not so much fun if one does track days regularly, but overall pretty good if you wanna see how these cars might be on the track.
First off, R8 V10:
- Great sounding V10, BUT not loud enough. I loved the tone, and the overall grunt, BUT not the volume of it, it could use some opening up and 3-6 dB more volume
- The cabin is very comfortable, the ride is amazing, the controls and steering, and overall fit and finish is great, I'd say in some aspects better than 997 and in some aspects not as much (a bit boring), so it's quite premium overall
- Transmission is a single-clutch on this model (I think latest is dual), and while in full throttle, the shifting is very abrupt, and you definitely feel it. I think I can up-shift smoother in my own manual car, but maybe downshifting was better than my current skills. Overall, I did NOT like it, I'd pick manual over this transmission.
- Handling and cornering was impressive, BUT, it was in a more dis-jointed and disconnected sense from the road. You could not really tell if the car's gonna grip or not, or how to modulate the throttle through a corner.
- Car was heavy, although due to good weight distribution and lower center of gravity you couldn't feel too much weight transfer.
- It was a lot more difficult to make the car turn with throttle, even more so than my C4S (both AWD), so the driving style must be adjusted
- Overall, I was NOT as impressed as I thought I'd be. It's a fantastic sports car, and a great overall package for a street sports car. I however do not think it's meant as a track car, and I really did not enjoy it as much on track as I thought I would. 997 is for sure more fun, and easier to toss around on track.
Second, Ferrari 458:
- Right off the bat, this thing is purpose built for track. What an amazing interior, and fit and finish. You get chills when you get in!
- Surprisingly roomy! For instance, I couldn't fit into Gallardo (6'2, 220).
- Engine/exhaust... OMG! What an engine/noise. Absolute Nirvana! You start the car and it just feels like a race car. The car sounds close to F1 I'd say, specially full throttle above 8K RPM, WOW!
- Transmission... I've driven dual-clutch cars before, and I have no idea what module is in this one, but it is BY FAR the BEST implementation I've ever seen. This thing shift like butter, and just like a race car, felt exactly like F1 shifting. Full throttle doing 120 MPH, you can up-shift and the car just shifts through with force but with great smoothness. Significantly better than 997 and 991 PDK, not sure how does it compares to 991 GT3 PDK. Absolutely the best transmission I've ever driven. I was never sold with PDK, but this thing just works specially well on track.
- Handling! Again, just amazing, the turn-in is so sharp you had to get used to. This it THE first car that is true to the statement of "you point it, throttle and it just GOES to where you want it". Just a different league!
- Track performance... just a DREAM! I could not find anything to fault with this car on track, it handled, shifted, accelerated, brake incredibly well beyond anything else I've tried.
- Overall: I was literally shaking getting out of the car after 5 laps, and was in complete awe! This car is exactly how it's been reviewed, and how it was described by Jeremy Clarkson and others, probably the best Ferrari, and maybe the best car you can buy. R8 was just a dog compared to this, my 997 felt like a car from a past generation, and I like to command Ferrari for creating such an experience in a car that can be had at the same price as a high-optioned 991!
Final Verdict:
As much as R8 wasn't that great on track, I think it's a fantastic daily sports car. It is fast, comfortable, sound great while not too loud, and I could easily see myself driving it to work and back and taking long road trips. I'd say better than 997 and more fun than 991.
458 was a different beast, it's a car to aspire to own, and is definitely now on my bucket list. It's amazing on track and I bet would be amazing for a twisty road trip, but maybe a bit too loud and not as comfy for longer trips like R8, 997 or 991 might be. Too bad it's too costly to maintain to be used as a track car, but oh boy is it amazing!
PS. Will add pics later!
11-04-2013, 06:01 PM
#2
Rennlist Member
I was in Vegas and I went to the Dream Racing spot where you can do a few laps in various cars like GT-R, M6, R8, 430, 458, Gallardo, 430 GT Race car, etc...
I picked to do 5 laps in R8 V10, and then 458... pretty crappy track (1.1 miles), and not so much fun if one does track days regularly, but overall pretty good if you wanna see how these cars might be on the track.
First off, R8 V10:
- Great sounding V10, BUT not loud enough. I loved the tone, and the overall grunt, BUT not the volume of it, it could use some opening up and 3-6 dB more volume
- The cabin is very comfortable, the ride is amazing, the controls and steering, and overall fit and finish is great, I'd say in some aspects better than 997 and in some aspects not as much (a bit boring), so it's quite premium overall
- Transmission is a single-clutch on this model (I think latest is dual), and while in full throttle, the shifting is very abrupt, and you definitely feel it. I think I can up-shift smoother in my own manual car, but maybe downshifting was better than my current skills. Overall, I did NOT like it, I'd pick manual over this transmission.
- Handling and cornering was impressive, BUT, it was in a more dis-jointed and disconnected sense from the road. You could not really tell if the car's gonna grip or not, or how to modulate the throttle through a corner.
- Car was heavy, although due to good weight distribution and lower center of gravity you couldn't feel too much weight transfer.
- It was a lot more difficult to make the car turn with throttle, even more so than my C4S (both AWD), so the driving style must be adjusted
- Overall, I was NOT as impressed as I thought I'd be. It's a fantastic sports car, and a great overall package for a street sports car. I however do not think it's meant as a track car, and I really did not enjoy it as much on track as I thought I would. 997 is for sure more fun, and easier to toss around on track.
Second, Ferrari 458:
- Right off the bat, this thing is purpose built for track. What an amazing interior, and fit and finish. You get chills when you get in!
- Surprisingly roomy! For instance, I couldn't fit into Gallardo (6'2, 220).
- Engine/exhaust... OMG! What an engine/noise. Absolute Nirvana! You start the car and it just feels like a race car. The car sounds close to F1 I'd say, specially full throttle above 8K RPM, WOW!
- Transmission... I've driven dual-clutch cars before, and I have no idea what module is in this one, but it is BY FAR the BEST implementation I've ever seen. This thing shift like butter, and just like a race car, felt exactly like F1 shifting. Full throttle doing 120 MPH, you can up-shift and the car just shifts through with force but with great smoothness. Significantly better than 997 and 991 PDK, not sure how does it compares to 991 GT3 PDK. Absolutely the best transmission I've ever driven. I was never sold with PDK, but this thing just works specially well on track.
- Handling! Again, just amazing, the turn-in is so sharp you had to get used to. This it THE first car that is true to the statement of "you point it, throttle and it just GOES to where you want it". Just a different league!
- Track performance... just a DREAM! I could not find anything to fault with this car on track, it handled, shifted, accelerated, brake incredibly well beyond anything else I've tried.
- Overall: I was literally shaking getting out of the car after 5 laps, and was in complete awe! This car is exactly how it's been reviewed, and how it was described by Jeremy Clarkson and others, probably the best Ferrari, and maybe the best car you can buy. R8 was just a dog compared to this, my 997 felt like a car from a past generation, and I like to command Ferrari for creating such an experience in a car that can be had at the same price as a high-optioned 991!
Final Verdict:
As much as R8 wasn't that great on track, I think it's a fantastic daily sports car. It is fast, comfortable, sound great while not too loud, and I could easily see myself driving it to work and back and taking long road trips. I'd say better than 997 and more fun than 991.
458 was a different beast, it's a car to aspire to own, and is definitely now on my bucket list. It's amazing on track and I bet would be amazing for a twisty road trip, but maybe a bit too loud and not as comfy for longer trips like R8, 997 or 991 might be. Too bad it's too costly to maintain to be used as a track car, but oh boy is it amazing!
PS. Will add pics later!
I picked to do 5 laps in R8 V10, and then 458... pretty crappy track (1.1 miles), and not so much fun if one does track days regularly, but overall pretty good if you wanna see how these cars might be on the track.
First off, R8 V10:
- Great sounding V10, BUT not loud enough. I loved the tone, and the overall grunt, BUT not the volume of it, it could use some opening up and 3-6 dB more volume
- The cabin is very comfortable, the ride is amazing, the controls and steering, and overall fit and finish is great, I'd say in some aspects better than 997 and in some aspects not as much (a bit boring), so it's quite premium overall
- Transmission is a single-clutch on this model (I think latest is dual), and while in full throttle, the shifting is very abrupt, and you definitely feel it. I think I can up-shift smoother in my own manual car, but maybe downshifting was better than my current skills. Overall, I did NOT like it, I'd pick manual over this transmission.
- Handling and cornering was impressive, BUT, it was in a more dis-jointed and disconnected sense from the road. You could not really tell if the car's gonna grip or not, or how to modulate the throttle through a corner.
- Car was heavy, although due to good weight distribution and lower center of gravity you couldn't feel too much weight transfer.
- It was a lot more difficult to make the car turn with throttle, even more so than my C4S (both AWD), so the driving style must be adjusted
- Overall, I was NOT as impressed as I thought I'd be. It's a fantastic sports car, and a great overall package for a street sports car. I however do not think it's meant as a track car, and I really did not enjoy it as much on track as I thought I would. 997 is for sure more fun, and easier to toss around on track.
Second, Ferrari 458:
- Right off the bat, this thing is purpose built for track. What an amazing interior, and fit and finish. You get chills when you get in!
- Surprisingly roomy! For instance, I couldn't fit into Gallardo (6'2, 220).
- Engine/exhaust... OMG! What an engine/noise. Absolute Nirvana! You start the car and it just feels like a race car. The car sounds close to F1 I'd say, specially full throttle above 8K RPM, WOW!
- Transmission... I've driven dual-clutch cars before, and I have no idea what module is in this one, but it is BY FAR the BEST implementation I've ever seen. This thing shift like butter, and just like a race car, felt exactly like F1 shifting. Full throttle doing 120 MPH, you can up-shift and the car just shifts through with force but with great smoothness. Significantly better than 997 and 991 PDK, not sure how does it compares to 991 GT3 PDK. Absolutely the best transmission I've ever driven. I was never sold with PDK, but this thing just works specially well on track.
- Handling! Again, just amazing, the turn-in is so sharp you had to get used to. This it THE first car that is true to the statement of "you point it, throttle and it just GOES to where you want it". Just a different league!
- Track performance... just a DREAM! I could not find anything to fault with this car on track, it handled, shifted, accelerated, brake incredibly well beyond anything else I've tried.
- Overall: I was literally shaking getting out of the car after 5 laps, and was in complete awe! This car is exactly how it's been reviewed, and how it was described by Jeremy Clarkson and others, probably the best Ferrari, and maybe the best car you can buy. R8 was just a dog compared to this, my 997 felt like a car from a past generation, and I like to command Ferrari for creating such an experience in a car that can be had at the same price as a high-optioned 991!
Final Verdict:
As much as R8 wasn't that great on track, I think it's a fantastic daily sports car. It is fast, comfortable, sound great while not too loud, and I could easily see myself driving it to work and back and taking long road trips. I'd say better than 997 and more fun than 991.
458 was a different beast, it's a car to aspire to own, and is definitely now on my bucket list. It's amazing on track and I bet would be amazing for a twisty road trip, but maybe a bit too loud and not as comfy for longer trips like R8, 997 or 991 might be. Too bad it's too costly to maintain to be used as a track car, but oh boy is it amazing!
PS. Will add pics later!
11-04-2013, 06:55 PM
#3
Rennlist Member
I was at Exotics Racing three weeks ago and drove the R8 V10. White one? I agree with your assessment. I found it really hard to judge the amount of grip remaining. I spent a bit of time going sideways.
I was there last year and drove the 430 Scud and 991 C2S, and my wife felt like she has missed out by not driving. This time she did 7 laps in a 430 and had a blast.
My friend has a 458 Spider and I've had an opportunity to drive it a few times, but not on a track. An incredible machine. My 997 seems pedestrian in comparison.
I was there last year and drove the 430 Scud and 991 C2S, and my wife felt like she has missed out by not driving. This time she did 7 laps in a 430 and had a blast.
My friend has a 458 Spider and I've had an opportunity to drive it a few times, but not on a track. An incredible machine. My 997 seems pedestrian in comparison.
11-04-2013, 08:13 PM
#5
I can't speak specifically about the 458 but my 430 does not compare favorably to my 8 year old 911. At least not as a daily driver.
Now if you want to talk aesthetics or engine/exhaust sounds then no competition from Porsche there.
If you like the 458 you might be even more impressed with the newly introduced 458S which is the track version of this car.
11-04-2013, 08:47 PM
#6
Rennlist Member
How high do you have to option a 991 to get it to the price of a 458? Your review was ok till the end. The 458 is more than twice the price of a highly optioned 991. The R8 V10 is an amazing street car. I have one in a 6 speed manual - the only way imo to get one. It is also half the price of a reasonably equipped 458.
11-04-2013, 08:50 PM
#7
Rennlist Member
What a great thread.
Thanks for sharing.
Post some pics!
Boolala is correct. You can find a 458 with some miles for around $250k.
Maybe Alex was thinking about a F430 with some miles on her. You can definitely pic one of those up babies for around $150.
Thanks for sharing.
Post some pics!
Boolala is correct. You can find a 458 with some miles for around $250k.
Maybe Alex was thinking about a F430 with some miles on her. You can definitely pic one of those up babies for around $150.
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11-04-2013, 08:53 PM
#8
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I recently rented an Audi R8 V10 spyder for the day. I agree with your observations. It was the old single clutch trasnmission and was very clunky when compared with my PDK. I thought the exhaust note was actually great. Not too loud but loud when you get on it and just right for the street. As you know the 997.2 is way too quiet - so I just ordered the Tubi and should have that on very soon. The audi was fun but more of a GT. Thought it handled pretty nicely for a heavy car. Took it over a Canyon (Topanga) from the valley back down into Malibu and then down PCH - fun with a sunny day and the top down - plus my 8 year old son as a passenger.
Have not driven the 458 and I'm sure its awesome. But I am not sure I can deal with the whole Ferrari deal. I live in LA and I dont like all the attention and certainly couldnt go grocery shopping etc. in a 458. Can do it in a 911 - and even then, I get a little more attention than I want.
Have not driven the 458 and I'm sure its awesome. But I am not sure I can deal with the whole Ferrari deal. I live in LA and I dont like all the attention and certainly couldnt go grocery shopping etc. in a 458. Can do it in a 911 - and even then, I get a little more attention than I want.
11-05-2013, 12:24 AM
#9
How was the R8 at the limit? Did traction control kick in early or late?
11-05-2013, 12:45 AM
#10
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
How high do you have to option a 991 to get it to the price of a 458? Your review was ok till the end. The 458 is more than twice the price of a highly optioned 991. The R8 V10 is an amazing street car. I have one in a 6 speed manual - the only way imo to get one. It is also half the price of a reasonably equipped 458.
11-05-2013, 12:47 AM
#11
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
11-05-2013, 12:49 AM
#12
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
Maybe I was mistaken then, the guy said there are used ones at around $195K, but just a quick search now showed there's nothing below $220K, considering brand new is just mid 200s, it shows how well the value is kept, as it's just that amazing.
11-05-2013, 12:51 AM
#13
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
Have not driven the 458 and I'm sure its awesome. But I am not sure I can deal with the whole Ferrari deal. I live in LA and I dont like all the attention and certainly couldnt go grocery shopping etc. in a 458. Can do it in a 911 - and even then, I get a little more attention than I want.
11-05-2013, 01:18 AM
#14
The base price of a new 458 is 240K. Options are very expensive. E.g., diamond forged wheels are 8 K, rear camera is 3.6K, front and rear parking sensors 2.3 K, front lifter is 4.6 K etc. Most new builds are in the 280 - 350 K range. 220 K will buy you a 3 year old high mileage out of warranty example with few options (and this would be close to wholesale price if you can get it). A 2 year extended warranty is 9.9 K.
11-05-2013, 01:46 AM
#15
I was going to get out the flame retardant for you Alex. I thought you would be raked over the coals for saying the F car DCT is better than the PDK. I think it is interesting that most people with the F transmission shift manually while in the Porsche leave it in auto for best results. Any thoughts on this?
Jim
Jim