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-   -   Check out the ad. One car manufacturer that just won my vote (https://rennlist.com/forums/997-forum/455204-check-out-the-ad-one-car-manufacturer-that-just-won-my-vote.html)

JJB236 09-18-2008 03:41 AM

Check out the ad. One car manufacturer that just won my vote
 
For more than a decade, i've been with MB, BMW, and Porsche.

For a few years now, I noticed these new breeds of cars on the road, and they finally won me over. Their design is just strikingly fresh. Their 4 doors look like coupes. Better looking than the MB CLS. They look different than the old typical front end of MB, BMW, and Porsche 911.

Check out this ad. I am sold on the A4, RS4, S6. R8 hasn't quite grown on me, and I like my 997 better, but these cars have come a long way. Between the AMG E-class, M5, and S6, my vote goes to the S6. :thumbup:

Anyone has a late-model Audi in here who like to share their experience? Quality, reliability, etc.
Cheers

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OkR1Wn7kHGY

AndreCT 09-18-2008 08:18 AM

The Audi is a fantastic car. Well built with an interior that puts others to shame. That said, I do not believe the S6 is in any way comprable to the M5 or E63 AMG when one considers the "performance". Very front heavy and just unable to rotate like the rwd cars can.
I want Audi to bring the RS6 wagon (Avant) to the US and BMW to bring the M5 Wagon here too. That way I can choose a real "sporty" utility car over (in my case) a GTS or similar..

Likemystoppie? 09-18-2008 12:24 PM

What a great Ad!


But i'm sorry, I've driven the new S6 several times. Talk about booorring!! Drive an E63 vs S6? The E is such a better car- all around.

purrybonker 09-18-2008 12:30 PM

I'm an Audi fan - A4T back in the day. The problem I have with this genre (4 door sport-sedans and wagons) is how their performance versions (S4/6 (heaven forbid RS4) M3/5) suuuuuuck fuel as daily, city drivers. I mean inhale fuel, I mean flush fuel down the toilet.

The A4T was ok, but given the opportunities for driving fun on the daily commute or grocery trips, even the capital cost becomes an exercise in irrational thinking. I ended up opting for a FORD FOCUS wagon! Supercharge it, drop it, coil-over it, big-brake it - I'm still into it for less than $20k - I can slip a big screen TV in the back (if I get a sudden urge at the Sony Store) and I don't lose sleep over door dings in the parking lot.

City cars should give a nod to frugality and rational practicality. Save the big ticket for the weekend cruising and posing.

997, esq 09-18-2008 03:25 PM

I have owned an Audi A4 (3.0) and have to say my experience with the car and the company has been awful. In my experience, they have failed to stand behind their product and honor their warranty obligations.

Even putting aside my personal concerns, there are a number of other concerns with their cars ---- (1) they tend to be nose heavy; (2) they depreciate extremely fast (particularly the performance cars RS4 and S4s, etc.), so your cost of ownership is much higher than a comparable BMW; and (3) their cars tend not to be particularly reliable, and repair costs are very high. On the plus side, I think Audi's interiors are best in class, and usually a notch above BMW.

If I had to do it again, I would get a Bimmer or a Japanese car (Infinity, Lexus, etc.).

MLindgren 09-18-2008 04:41 PM

My Audi experience is limited to the TT Roadster my wife drives. By far the most expensive car to maintain I've ever owned. The 4 yr/40K mile maintenance was right around $800 due to having to change the Haldex fluid. It's far more costly than Porsche maintenance which I find to be very fair.

Never again.

JJB236 09-18-2008 09:06 PM

Wow, it's a surprise to see that another German car's quality is being questioned.

I guess Audi overspent their budget on their design team over others.

Great job on their ad. "Old luxury" ha ha

Bob in NY 09-18-2008 09:34 PM

I drove the A5 S line and loved it! If it had any leg room in the back seat I would have bought one as my daily driver. I did have an 02 A4 and didn't like it very much, hard ride and the 3.2 was pretty weak.

tooloud10 09-18-2008 10:11 PM

"The biggest, fastest, most fuel-efficient car in its class."

Now, I'm not usually a "magazine racer", but I just finished reading the article in Road & Track where they point out the following:

0-60: A4, 6.2 seconds; 335i, 5.0 seconds; C350, 5.8 seconds
EPA city highway: A4, 17/26; 335i, 17/26; C350, 17/25

It IS the biggest, if you mean that it weighs 200 lbs. more than each of the other cars. Nice car, I'm sure, but I wish they wouldn't lie.

jackolo 09-18-2008 10:45 PM

As far as ads go, my three favorite ads are still the BMW M5 one with Clive Owen and Madonna, the Porsche one with the kid who sees a 911 drive by his school and then immediately heads to the dealer and then the Ferrari/Shell ad wit the different race cars driving through deserted streets.

Likemystoppie? 09-19-2008 12:00 AM


Originally Posted by jackolo (Post 5822311)
As far as ads go, my three favorite ads are still the BMW M5 one with Clive Owen and Madonna, the Porsche one with the kid who sees a 911 drive by his school and then immediately heads to the dealer and then the Ferrari/Shell ad wit the different race cars driving through deserted streets.

Hear Hear!!

Cope 09-19-2008 12:12 AM


Originally Posted by tooloud10 (Post 5822221)
"The biggest, fastest, most fuel-efficient car in its class."

Now, I'm not usually a "magazine racer", but I just finished reading the article in Road & Track where they point out the following:

0-60: A4, 6.2 seconds; 335i, 5.0 seconds; C350, 5.8 seconds
EPA city highway: A4, 17/26; 335i, 17/26; C350, 17/25

It IS the biggest, if you mean that it weighs 200 lbs. more than each of the other cars. Nice car, I'm sure, but I wish they wouldn't lie.

You have to read the fine print. They compare it to the 328xi, C330 4matic, and Lexus IS250 AWD.

Likemystoppie? 09-19-2008 12:35 AM


Originally Posted by Cope (Post 5822609)
You have to read the fine print. They compare it to the 328xi, C330 4matic, and Lexus IS250 AWD.

No such thing as a C330 4 matic.

C300
C300 4matic
C350 Sport RWD

mklaskin 09-19-2008 12:35 AM

Interesting thread.

I've owned three Audi's, a 90 Sport Quattro, an S6 Avant, and currently an RS6. The 90 was slow, but otherwise reliable and nice. The S6 was just plain awesome. Easily the best car I've ever owned, and I regret selling it (well, trading it in on an E55 wagon...).

The RS6 is right up there with the S6, save for one issue. Audi engineered, if you can call it that, a system called DRC, Dynamic Ride Control. The premise is that as the car corners, and the shocks compress, a valve opens allowing the fluid from the opposite corner shock to flow, allowing the car to stay fairly flat. Except the shocks leak. And leak. The resulting sound is a harsh "clunk", almost like the rear subframe is falling out. Audi knows they have an issue, and they have stood by it. The last time if happened it was covered by Audi, even though my car is out of warranty.

I would buy another, and I'm contemplating that currently.

If the DRC explanation is not clear, or you'd like to hear more, just send me a PM.

Cope 09-19-2008 12:36 AM


Originally Posted by Likemystoppie? (Post 5822669)
No such thing as a C330 4 matic.

C300
C300 4matic
C350 Sport RWD

Typo. It happens.

Likemystoppie? 09-19-2008 12:46 AM


Originally Posted by Cope (Post 5822673)
Typo. It happens.

Interestingly, I've seen it before. Both the 330 number and the 4 matic.


mb ISN'T offering awd in the C350 unlike the 07 model.

andre5 09-19-2008 01:26 AM


Originally Posted by Cope (Post 5822609)
You have to read the fine print. They compare it to the 328xi, C330 4matic, and Lexus IS250 AWD.

I had the opportunity to drive the new B8 A4 3.2L Quattro at Infineon/Sears Point Raceway. As far as the nose heavy comments go, the engine actually now sits further back in the engine bay, and the quattro is now set at 40% front / 60% rear. This made a world of difference over the B7 A4 2.0T Q that I used to drive. On the track, the B8 A4 felt balanced and smooth with plenty of grip and only slight understeer at the limit.

On the autocross, I drove the 328xi, C class 4matic, IS250 AWD and the A4Q. Of the above cars, the A4Q had the best handling. The C class is just a flat out understeering, underpowered, heavy car. The IS felt nimble, but still had a lot of understeer. Furthermore, the traction control was very intrusive. The 328ix handled well but still had more understeer and felt less powerful than the A4.

In terms of interiors, the A4 hands down had the best interior with the IS coming in second, IMHO. The A4 also had the most leg room in the back. I would imagine that, with the 2.0T engine, the new A4Q should handle even better.

I've owned several Audis over the years and only one let me down - a 1990 Audi 90 FWD that blew an auto tranny. Otherwise, they've been reliable for me (B5 S4 2.7TT, C5 A6 4.2, B7 A4 Avant 2.0TQ).

Likemystoppie? 09-19-2008 12:25 PM


Originally Posted by andre5 (Post 5822766)
I had the opportunity to drive the new B8 A4 3.2L Quattro at Infineon/Sears Point Raceway. As far as the nose heavy comments go, the engine actually now sits further back in the engine bay, and the quattro is now set at 40% front / 60% rear. This made a world of difference over the B7 A4 2.0T Q that I used to drive. On the track, the B8 A4 felt balanced and smooth with plenty of grip and only slight understeer at the limit.

On the autocross, I drove the 328xi, C class 4matic, IS250 AWD and the A4Q. Of the above cars, the A4Q had the best handling. The C class is just a flat out understeering, underpowered, heavy car. The IS felt nimble, but still had a lot of understeer. Furthermore, the traction control was very intrusive. The 328ix handled well but still had more understeer and felt less powerful than the A4.

In terms of interiors, the A4 hands down had the best interior with the IS coming in second, IMHO. The A4 also had the most leg room in the back. I would imagine that, with the 2.0T engine, the new A4Q should handle even better.

I've owned several Audis over the years and only one let me down - a 1990 Audi 90 FWD that blew an auto tranny. Otherwise, they've been reliable for me (B5 S4 2.7TT, C5 A6 4.2, B7 A4 Avant 2.0TQ).

Lame comparo for engine sizes.

It should have been the 2.0t quattro vs C300 4Matic.

Want the bigger 3.2 to go up against the C350. That's a nice car!!

bgiere 09-19-2008 01:12 PM

I'm on my 5th Audi...this time an A3 S-line...best one so far...and I have never had any reliability issues. None...I know others that have, i guess I've been lucky. But in Ohio, you're crazy not to have a Quattro IMHO.

Likemystoppie? 09-19-2008 01:20 PM


Originally Posted by bgiere (Post 5823790)
I'm on my 5th Audi...this time an A3 S-line...best one so far...and I have never had any reliability issues. None...I know others that have, i guess I've been lucky. But in Ohio, you're crazy not to have a Quattro IMHO.

would you stop it already? you sound like one of those drug pushers........"come on, you KNOW everyone's doing it!"


I've got an 07 E350 Sport RWD-

That car is fantastic in the snow. Only storm it didn't do well was the ice storm in april. No ****. Even the state plow trucks got stuck.


AWD is mass paranoia!

surfer 09-19-2008 04:39 PM

Drove the s5 on a couple occasions. Beautiful car inside and out but front-heavy and not as spry as the c2s. Now the r8 is a totally different species, pure sex. Would consider that for my next car when the prices aren't so outrageous.

andre5 09-19-2008 09:22 PM


Originally Posted by Likemystoppie? (Post 5823612)
Lame comparo for engine sizes.

It should have been the 2.0t quattro vs C300 4Matic.

Want the bigger 3.2 to go up against the C350. That's a nice car!!

Why compare a 4 cylinder to a 6 cylinder? Besides, the 2.0T would have more of a weight and handling advantage. Power wise, it wouldn't surprise me if the 2.0T felt stronger than the C300 V6.

greenie 09-19-2008 10:30 PM


Originally Posted by 997, esq (Post 5820992)
I have owned an Audi A4 (3.0) and have to say my experience with the car and the company has been awful. In my experience, they have failed to stand behind their product and honor their warranty obligations.

Even putting aside my personal concerns, there are a number of other concerns with their cars ---- (1) they tend to be nose heavy; (2) they depreciate extremely fast (particularly the performance cars RS4 and S4s, etc.), so your cost of ownership is much higher than a comparable BMW; and (3) their cars tend not to be particularly reliable, and repair costs are very high. On the plus side, I think Audi's interiors are best in class, and usually a notch above BMW.

If I had to do it again, I would get a Bimmer or a Japanese car (Infinity, Lexus, etc.).

DING* Bad experience with dealer AND manufacturer. Model change 04 A8L drove me up a wall with no help at all. Dumped it and havent looked back. Audi hasnt found the right formula to sell cars in the states.

caf 09-20-2008 07:07 PM

Better quality version of the cool commercial at audiusa.com

C4SCABHVN 09-21-2008 02:33 PM

This post started with "For more than a decade, i've been with MB, BMW, and Porsche". And then went on to the Audi commercial and it's impact etc. That starting sentence describes me/my wife to a T - with the exception of a couple of Saab's and one VW Passat thrown in (which was essentially an Audi, anyways, back in the day).

My wife saw the commercial (and she's been a BMW person who just got an MB S550) and she LOVED it - all until she saw the ending!!! She asked me, "did we buy the wrong car"? The ad ABSOLUTELY hit home with her and I'll say this - having just plunked down the coin for the MB - made me think too. At a minimum, it will have me/us look at the Audi next time we're looking. An outstanding ad - and the music with it was perfect. Whichever agency they are using sure did a bang-up job!

lig 09-21-2008 04:49 PM

My daily is an '04 S4. Fantastic car and has been extremely reliable. Right up there with my Lexus. Only downside - too heavy - too front heavy (being addressed in the new generation somewhat) and really thirsty.

Likemystoppie? 09-21-2008 05:27 PM


Originally Posted by andre5 (Post 5825379)
Why compare a 4 cylinder to a 6 cylinder? Besides, the 2.0T would have more of a weight and handling advantage. Power wise, it wouldn't surprise me if the 2.0T felt stronger than the C300 V6.

Because that's the proper comparo. You compare level of car to level of car.

MB's entry is the C300 V6; the Audi the 2.0t. Audi's biggest (non S line) engine is the 3.2; MB's (non AMG) it's the 3.5L.

Now if you wanna compare the RS4 vs the C63, we can do that too. LOL

Likemystoppie? 09-21-2008 05:29 PM


Originally Posted by C4SCABHVN (Post 5828812)
This post started with "For more than a decade, i've been with MB, BMW, and Porsche". And then went on to the Audi commercial and it's impact etc. That starting sentence describes me/my wife to a T - with the exception of a couple of Saab's and one VW Passat thrown in (which was essentially an Audi, anyways, back in the day).

My wife saw the commercial (and she's been a BMW person who just got an MB S550) and she LOVED it - all until she saw the ending!!! She asked me, "did we buy the wrong car"? The ad ABSOLUTELY hit home with her and I'll say this - having just plunked down the coin for the MB - made me think too. At a minimum, it will have me/us look at the Audi next time we're looking. An outstanding ad - and the music with it was perfect. Whichever agency they are using sure did a bang-up job!

A great ad it was; but gimme a break about being the wrong car. The C Class is a fantasic car; handles like it's on rails and great brakes. Not to mention MB is Ranked No.4 over all by JD Powers and Associates.....

Audi's not even in the top ten.

C4SCABHVN 09-21-2008 06:39 PM

You write and I quote - "... But gimme a break about being the wrong car. The C Class is a fantasic car; handles like it's on rails and great brakes..."


Huh? Ok, the C may be a fantastic car but I'm not sure what that has to do with my post??? As I wrote, we bought the S (and I think it's a pretty good car as well). All I'm saying is that the ad got my wife thinking. I did tell her that the particular car wasn't in the same league as hers. In any event, the original post and my comment was about the effectiveness of the ad.

Likemystoppie? 09-21-2008 07:13 PM


Originally Posted by C4SCABHVN (Post 5829319)
You write and I quote - "... But gimme a break about being the wrong car. The C Class is a fantasic car; handles like it's on rails and great brakes..."


Huh? Ok, the C may be a fantastic car but I'm not sure what that has to do with my post??? As I wrote, we bought the S (and I think it's a pretty good car as well). All I'm saying is that the ad got my wife thinking. I did tell her that the particular car wasn't in the same league as hers. In any event, the original post and my comment was about the effectiveness of the ad.

I stand corrected. I completely missed the comment about the S550.

The S550 is the best car you pick in it's category. I've even had a handful of clients trade in their Flying Spurs for S550's.

andre5 09-21-2008 08:05 PM


Originally Posted by Likemystoppie? (Post 5829170)
Because that's the proper comparo. You compare level of car to level of car.

MB's entry is the C300 V6; the Audi the 2.0t. Audi's biggest (non S line) engine is the 3.2; MB's (non AMG) it's the 3.5L.

Now if you wanna compare the RS4 vs the C63, we can do that too. LOL

But then you end up comparing a 4 cyliinder all wheel drive car to a V6 rear wheel drive car? LOL It's a never ending cycle:)

tooloud10 09-21-2008 08:23 PM


Originally Posted by Cope (Post 5822609)
You have to read the fine print. They compare it to the 328xi, C330 4matic, and Lexus IS250 AWD.

Ah, they're comparing the Audi with the big engine to the competition with the small engine. Seems shady to me...

As for the commercial, it was...just a commercial.

Chris from Cali 09-21-2008 08:44 PM

I've owned several recent Audis (2005.5 S4, 2007 A3, 2007 RS4) and they've been great cars. My RS4 is a monster - I'm only moving on because Mr. Sanner is making me a great deal on a 997 Turbo (and I like his stoppie). The A3 is now my wife's car, but it is phenomenal - quick, easy to drive, lots of fun. It's a 2.0T w/DSG - a perfect drivetrain combo that renders the V6 obsolete IMO. The S4 was really good, but the RS4 is a different planet when it comes to performance.

Also, my wife and I rented a 2008 A6 S-line for almost a month in CA and loved it. It rode great, got incredible gas mileage (30mpg???), and was fun to drive. I've heard the S6 is a little boring, but I bet it's VERY polished. If I were looking for a nice, comfy, fast cruiser the S6 would be up for consideration.

Likemystoppie? 09-21-2008 08:45 PM


Originally Posted by andre5 (Post 5829521)
But then you end up comparing a 4 cyliinder all wheel drive car to a V6 rear wheel drive car? LOL It's a never ending cycle:)


Did I REALLY have to type it all out for you??

Okay, fine.

MERCEDES BENZ C300 4MATIC (AWD) Vs. AUDI A4 2.0t Quattro. How's that?

Seriously..... :surr:


Originally Posted by tooloud10 (Post 5829553)
Ah, they're comparing the Audi with the big engine to the competition with the small engine. Seems shady to me...
As for the commercial, it was...just a commercial.


Hmm, it would appear SOMEONE got what i was say'n. Jayzus!!

Thank you Tooloud!!! :thumbup: - i see we're seeing eye to eye

Likemystoppie? 09-21-2008 08:46 PM


Originally Posted by Chris from Cali (Post 5829605)
I've owned several recent Audis (2005.5 S4, 2007 A3, 2007 RS4) and they've been great cars. My RS4 is a monster - I'm only moving on because Mr. Sanner is making me a great deal on a 997 Turbo (and I like his stoppie). The A3 is now my wife's car, but it is phenomenal - quick, easy to drive, lots of fun. It's a 2.0T w/DSG - a perfect drivetrain combo that renders the V6 obsolete IMO. The S4 was really good, but the RS4 is a different planet when it comes to performance.

Also, my wife and I rented a 2008 A6 S-line for almost a month in CA and loved it. It rode great, got incredible gas mileage (30mpg???), and was fun to drive. I've heard the S6 is a little boring, but I bet it's VERY polished. If I were looking for a nice, comfy, fast cruiser the S6 would be up for consideration.


Word up! :D

ronmart 09-23-2008 02:57 PM


Originally Posted by MLindgren (Post 5821256)
My Audi experience is limited to the TT Roadster my wife drives. By far the most expensive car to maintain I've ever owned. The 4 yr/40K mile maintenance was right around $800 due to having to change the Haldex fluid. It's far more costly than Porsche maintenance which I find to be very fair.

Never again.

Then don't buy a Lexus. I've averaged $2000/yr of "routine" maintenance on my Lexus LX 470. Lexus may have cheaper MSRP's and a good reputation, but it hasn't been any more reliable than my 2000 Benz and the total cost of ownership has been outrageous.
:soapbox:

Matias_S 09-23-2008 03:12 PM


Originally Posted by Likemystoppie? (Post 5829609)
Did I REALLY have to type it all out for you??

Okay, fine.

MERCEDES BENZ C300 4MATIC (AWD) Vs. AUDI A4 2.0t Quattro. How's that?

Seriously..... :surr:

Do you have to put out the same coin for these cars? If yes, then comparo is fair, if one requires more dinero then comparo is not fair...

JFScheck 09-23-2008 03:34 PM

Audi A6 2.7 Bi-Turbo Line-S 2003-2007
Audi S4 2006-2008
Audi A4 Line-S with 3.2 2006 - Present

Loved them ALL - West Coast moves had me sell off a few cars (too many on too many coasts)...

I am a MAJOR fan of Audi - not a single problem with any of the cars the time we owned all of them - the S4 was Super - only got rid of it because I have the 911 in California and needed a "4x4 SUV" with more room than the S4...

Likemystoppie? 09-23-2008 05:28 PM


Originally Posted by Matias_S (Post 5835762)
Do you have to put out the same coin for these cars? If yes, then comparo is fair, if one requires more dinero then comparo is not fair...

False. You compare entry level to entry level. Then the next level to the next level. That keeps the playing field level.


So if that's your arguement; a Z06 Corvette should be compared to a C2S 911 Coupe? (when ALL the mag's are comparing it to the Turbo? So they're wrong?)

See what I'm say'n?

blk on blk 09-23-2008 05:43 PM

I have a 2008 A4 as a 4rd car. It is an very unoptioned, front drive 2.0 It is no frills, but is fine for its inteded purpose for my use. I haven't had it long so no issues for me. It is quiet, gets good mileage, looks nice, and was relatively cheap considering the 2009 was a new model so they were giving away the 2008's.

997, esq 09-23-2008 06:03 PM

Hope your no frills car has a stick and not a multitronic/CVT. Although the CVT has improved, apparently, it still has reliability problems and owning one out of warranty can be a gamble. I think I would have a very different opinion of Audi if I had not gotten the multitronic. Has made me suspicious of all fancy auto transmissions ... PM me if you want details. Good luck!



Originally Posted by blk on blk (Post 5836315)
I have a 2008 A4 as a 4rd car. It is an very unoptioned, front drive 2.0 It is no frills, but is fine for its inteded purpose for my use. I haven't had it long so no issues for me. It is quiet, gets good mileage, looks nice, and was relatively cheap considering the 2009 was a new model so they were giving away the 2008's.


JJB236 09-23-2008 07:01 PM


Originally Posted by C4SCABHVN (Post 5828812)
This post started with "For more than a decade, i've been with MB, BMW, and Porsche". And then went on to the Audi commercial and it's impact etc. That starting sentence describes me/my wife to a T - with the exception of a couple of Saab's and one VW Passat thrown in (which was essentially an Audi, anyways, back in the day).

My wife saw the commercial (and she's been a BMW person who just got an MB S550) and she LOVED it - all until she saw the ending!!! She asked me, "did we buy the wrong car"? The ad ABSOLUTELY hit home with her and I'll say this - having just plunked down the coin for the MB - made me think too. At a minimum, it will have me/us look at the Audi next time we're looking. An outstanding ad - and the music with it was perfect. Whichever agency they are using sure did a bang-up job!

LOL the marketing ad really has effect on people, doesn't it? Now the biggest hurdle is the quality and reliability issue... just like the L/R Range Rovers and Jags. Hope Audi doesn't get categorized into a beautiful piece of scap metal.

Unless Audi shapes up with the dependability issue, I will stay with the "old luxury." I don't have time for frequent dealer trips. The Mercedes in the ad, I think was S550, looked lame due to the color being beige. Picture it with a black S55 AMG or a BMW M3 or M6, it would have been different. Now picture it with a 997 GT2, GT3 or Turbo. P car an "old luxury"? It's more of a legend that offers best of both worlds - design and quality.

Cheers

lig 09-23-2008 08:59 PM


Originally Posted by JJB236 (Post 5836608)
Unless Audi shapes up with the dependability issue, I will stay with the "old luxury."


Are you speaking from personal experience with regard to Audi?

Personally - after having one M-B (2003 E class - brand new) I will never buy one again. Complete and total POS. SBS brakes - joke. Fiber optic cabling - great idea - horrible execution. Squeaks and rattles very unseemly for a $50K+ car.

My Audi on the other hand has been outstanding even though I was expecting it to be pretty so-so in terms of reliability.

JJB236 09-23-2008 10:24 PM


Originally Posted by lig (Post 5836998)
Are you speaking from personal experience with regard to Audi?

Personally - after having one M-B (2003 E class - brand new) I will never buy one again. Complete and total POS. SBS brakes - joke. Fiber optic cabling - great idea - horrible execution. Squeaks and rattles very unseemly for a $50K+ car.

My Audi on the other hand has been outstanding even though I was expecting it to be pretty so-so in terms of reliability.

Nope, I never had an Audi, but that was the conclusion based on the info from the guys in here. And Audi not being in the top 10 list of JD Power reliability test kinda confirms it.

I'm not really surprised about your disappointment with the current E-class. My 300E is from 91 and still runs great at 199K miles. I think the MB status & quality was the best in the 80's and 90's. My family had the BMW 528, 740iL and now 745i Sport & 750i Sport. We never had any problems, although I hear many complaints from BMW owners.

Likemystoppie? 09-24-2008 12:32 AM


Originally Posted by lig (Post 5836998)
Are you speaking from personal experience with regard to Audi?

Personally - after having one M-B (2003 E class - brand new) I will never buy one again. Complete and total POS. SBS brakes - joke. Fiber optic cabling - great idea - horrible execution. Squeaks and rattles very unseemly for a $50K+ car.

My Audi on the other hand has been outstanding even though I was expecting it to be pretty so-so in terms of reliability.


Originally Posted by JJB236 (Post 5837285)
Nope, I never had an Audi, but that was the conclusion based on the info from the guys in here. And Audi not being in the top 10 list of JD Power reliability test kinda confirms it.

I'm not really surprised about your disappointment with the current E-class. My 300E is from 91 and still runs great at 199K miles. I think the MB status & quality was the best in the 80's and 90's. My family had the BMW 528, 740iL and now 745i Sport & 750i Sport. We never had any problems, although I hear many complaints from BMW owners.

MB has major issues with the 2003-2004 cars. The SBC braking unit was replaced by normal brakes in MY2007 as was the suspension and over all fit and finish of the car.

The 2007-09 cars are ROCK solid. Gone are the Bosch electronics ; in came in the Harmon International after MY2005.

Drive the new E and you'll see. Drive the one that's completey redesigned and you'll be blown away.

*I have a 2007 MB E350 Sport RWD- Not a single issue. Tires look as good as new. Average 24mpg (98% is city) I'd say the car rocks.

lig 09-24-2008 02:32 AM

I understand that the newer M-Bs are better now but once bitten - twice shy. That '03 really was a total POS. I never knew there were so many reasons to "Visit Workshop!"

SBS

SRS

BRAKE FAILURE

There were a few other "Visit Workshop" warnings that I have forgotten about but it was a laughable car.

The stupid logo freezing on the display screen.

The "no nav on cars ordered with Nav" for '03

My M-B experience totally sucked. The SA treated me well. MBNA could have cared less about how focked up my car was.

At the time the Lexus dealer treated me like a king - even though I was driving a very high mileage entry level car.

The Audi dealership has treated me quite well also.


More on point - allow me to quote from Bush himself:

"There's an old saying in Tennessee — I know it's in Texas, probably in Tennessee — that says, fool me once, shame on — shame on you. Fool me ----- uhhhh you can't get fooled again."

No M-B really moves me right now. The only new car I'm interested in is the GT-R.

If you put a gun to my head and said you have to buy a new M-B perhaps a C63 would be the one but it isn't 40K better than my S4 IMO.

Meister Fahrer 09-24-2008 03:02 AM

Got my A3 primarily for my wife about 2 years ago. It's been great, only a couple very minor problems.

About 24k, the car really squirts through traffic, good torque at low rpm, and the DSG is still great.
I can easily drive the car near 10/10ths with DSG and mild understeer that's easily modulated.

Plus it's a very handy size, great mileage, and a small car in the Audi wrapper gets attention.

Thought about chipping it (as I've done with 1.8Ts before), but it works fine as it is.....

The A5 is beautiful, and the R8 is just striking, they're on a roll....

Matias_S 09-24-2008 03:48 AM


Originally Posted by Likemystoppie? (Post 5836235)
False. You compare entry level to entry level. Then the next level to the next level. That keeps the playing field level.

If you want to compare entry level? Well the entry lvl c class is the C180
C 180 KOMPRESSOR 4-cylinder 156 hp 230 Nm


Originally Posted by Likemystoppie? (Post 5836235)
So if that's your arguement; a Z06 Corvette should be compared to a C2S 911 Coupe? (when ALL the mag's are comparing it to the Turbo? So they're wrong?)

False, I have seen the c2s compared to the z06 many times, exactly due to the price point.

Also a z06/c2s comparo is not exactly the same as a a class audi vs / c class merc. In any comparison like this the car magazines in Europe (AutoMotorsport etc) would choose similarly priced models, not arbitrary 'levels'.

So the car mags are not wrong, you are...


Originally Posted by Likemystoppie? (Post 5836235)
See what I'm say'n?

no

Likemystoppie? 09-24-2008 01:03 PM


Originally Posted by Matias_S (Post 5838054)
If you want to compare entry level? Well the entry lvl c class is the C180
C 180 KOMPRESSOR 4-cylinder 156 hp 230 Nm


False, I have seen the c2s compared to the z06 many times, exactly due to the price point.

Also a z06/c2s comparo is not exactly the same as a a class audi vs / c class merc. In any comparison like this the car magazines in Europe (AutoMotorsport etc) would choose similarly priced models, not arbitrary 'levels'.

So the car mags are not wrong, you are...



no

Well here in the United States we DON'T have the OLD Kompressor engine in the new C; maybe for your Country, but not here. So you might be right over where you are.

However, you don't compare cars based on price point. (not from the manurfactors side) they compare to the actual target market for THAT car.

Here in the states the Mag's (and all over the rennlist and 6speedonline.com) have compared the Z06 to the 997Turbo. Why you ask? Because they're both in the similar performance. Don't believe me? www.google.com- check it out.

Just like the NEW controversy over the NISSAN GT-R; it's been pinned against the 997T AND the Z06. But according to you that's wrong -because of price- but you're missing the point. That's not what the majority of comparo's are up against.

I've even seen the Z06 vs the GT2 or GT-R vs GT2. It's "rank" of car againts "rank" of car.

But again.......if you insist.........by all means. knock yourself out.

Likemystoppie? 09-24-2008 01:08 PM


Originally Posted by lig (Post 5837984)
I understand that the newer M-Bs are better now but once bitten - twice shy. That '03 really was a total POS. I never knew there were so many reasons to "Visit Workshop!"

SBS

SRS

BRAKE FAILURE

There were a few other "Visit Workshop" warnings that I have forgotten about but it was a laughable car.

The stupid logo freezing on the display screen.

The "no nav on cars ordered with Nav" for '03

My M-B experience totally sucked. The SA treated me well. MBNA could have cared less about how focked up my car was.

At the time the Lexus dealer treated me like a king - even though I was driving a very high mileage entry level car.

The Audi dealership has treated me quite well also.


More on point - allow me to quote from Bush himself:

"There's an old saying in Tennessee — I know it's in Texas, probably in Tennessee — that says, fool me once, shame on — shame on you. Fool me ----- uhhhh you can't get fooled again."

No M-B really moves me right now. The only new car I'm interested in is the GT-R.

If you put a gun to my head and said you have to buy a new M-B perhaps a C63 would be the one but it isn't 40K better than my S4 IMO.

I completely understand. I've been with MB since 2002; I don't even recognize the company anymore- NOW- they're all about customer service. The have a very low tolerance for bad customer service. Worse- if the local dealer insists on giving you bad service they're doing the Brand a disservice.

Mercedes has changed light-years since you were a client. It's a shame a decent sales person and dealership can't relay that message. :(

On another note; you think you were turned off by the old MB service; go experience the Nissan experience.

Not only will the car cost a fortune to maintain-according to Nissan- good luck having intelligent conversations with the SA about the car.


Talk to Chris in Cali here on RL; he was turned off by Nissan experience completely.

Cope 09-24-2008 02:59 PM


Originally Posted by tooloud10 (Post 5829553)
Ah, they're comparing the Audi with the big engine to the competition with the small engine. Seems shady to me...

As for the commercial, it was...just a commercial.

This is getting confusing. Just to clarify, the fine print of the ad states the following (I'll try not to have any typos this time):

"Audi of America, Inc. defines class as automatic transmission versions of the 2009 Audi 2.0T quattro, and the 2008 BMW 328xi, Mercedes-Benz C300 4matic and Lexus IS250 AWD. "Biggest" based on manufacturer published dimensions. "Fastest" based on independent, AMCI Certified 0-60 mph testing. "Most fuel efficient" based on EPA highway fuel economy estimates for each model; 27 highway mpg for A4 2.0T quattro automatic. Your mileage may vary."

I can't speak to the validity of the claims, just to the claim itself. Now, IMO that seems to me like they are comparing their small engine to the competitors small engines.

All I know is that in the past 3 years I tried BMW, Mercedes, and Audi vehicles during 3 different shopping experiences. I ended up buying 4 different Audis because I liked them better. I'm sure that everyone wouldn't have made the decisions as me because we all have different tastes, but I've been very happy with Audis (except for one A6, which Audi just helped me to replace with another A6) and that is all that really matters to me. As to the new A4, I think its a great car for what it is. In fact, I drove the 2009 Audi 2.0T to work today. IMO its a definite improvement on the old A4. Much more A6-like in that it has a smoother ride, better interior, and more room inside.

As for the commercial, I liked it.

lig 09-24-2008 04:32 PM


Originally Posted by Likemystoppie? (Post 5838919)
Mercedes has changed light-years since you were a client. It's a shame a decent sales person and dealership can't relay that message. :(

On another note; you think you were turned off by the old MB service; go experience the Nissan experience.

Truthfully it wasn't the dealer or the service manager that turned me off to the marque - it was the car itself and the whole "let's beta test all this new technology on our launch customers for the W211"

All my buds with W210s are extremely pleased. My brother's '04 SL500 has been a little troublesome but not to the extent that my W211 was.

I haven't had a Nissan for quite a while so I can't speak to the ownership experience there.

Chris from Cali 09-24-2008 05:08 PM


Originally Posted by Likemystoppie? (Post 5838919)
On another note; you think you were turned off by the old MB service; go experience the Nissan experience.

Not only will the car cost a fortune to maintain-according to Nissan- good luck having intelligent conversations with the SA about the car.

Talk to Chris in Cali here on RL; he was turned off by Nissan experience completely.

Nissan are a bunch of bumbling fools... I've given them 3 chances and they struck out all three times.

#1 - Deciding between an Evo and 350Z in 2003. Evo @ sticker, 350Z @ $10K over ("It's very limited") = FAIL
#2 - Considered a 350Z as a DD when I had my 911. Too bad they tried to lease me a 350Z for 335i Coupe money.
#3 - The final straw. I was on the the pre-order list for the GT-R. I got the call about coming in to spec it, etc. I got blown off when I went in. So a couple months later, the GM calls me and asks if I'm still interested. I asked, "What's the markup?" He said, "$28,000." When I asked WTF, he said it's to cover their certification, special gear, etc.

Nissan would have been 100x smarter if they'd sold the GT-R through Infiniti. My customer service experience with my FX45 was stellar - the best so far of any company, short of how well Aston treated me when I was testing the Vantage.

Likemystoppie? 09-24-2008 07:35 PM


Originally Posted by lig (Post 5839664)
Truthfully it wasn't the dealer or the service manager that turned me off to the marque - it was the car itself and the whole "let's beta test all this new technology on our launch customers for the W211"

.

Wouldn't be the 1st time I've heard that remark.

Well, if you do see a car that might turn your fancy; the cars have come leaps and bounds.

Back in 03, MB was ranked 25th overall with JDPOWERS.

Now they're ranked 4th. Target Goal is #1 by '10. That means they gotta push Porsche out of that seat. LOL :icon107:


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