New clutch feeling 997.1
10-15-2022, 09:27 AM
#1
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
New clutch feeling 997.1
Hello all -
Car has 61k - just did my clutch at a super reputable shop since I had an RMS leak and the miles were up there. Old clutch still hd some life but why not - flywheel was fine.
One thing i wanted to ask was if anyone else who had a new clutch, or owned their car since new - if there is a little bit of a “break in” period before it feels a little bit tighter? Pedal feels significantly softer/less bite most notably when getting off from a start. maybe i was just used to a worn clutch..
Also for what it’s worth (i know someone’s keeping track) total cost was $5500 cash for RMS, Clutch and all the goodies sans flywheel along with install of the oil fed IMS Solution (again…while i was in there as the car previously has the LN retrofit).
Clutch and RMS and clutch without IMS would have been prob ~$3K. Shop located on Long Island.
Best,
alex
Car has 61k - just did my clutch at a super reputable shop since I had an RMS leak and the miles were up there. Old clutch still hd some life but why not - flywheel was fine.
One thing i wanted to ask was if anyone else who had a new clutch, or owned their car since new - if there is a little bit of a “break in” period before it feels a little bit tighter? Pedal feels significantly softer/less bite most notably when getting off from a start. maybe i was just used to a worn clutch..
Also for what it’s worth (i know someone’s keeping track) total cost was $5500 cash for RMS, Clutch and all the goodies sans flywheel along with install of the oil fed IMS Solution (again…while i was in there as the car previously has the LN retrofit).
Clutch and RMS and clutch without IMS would have been prob ~$3K. Shop located on Long Island.
Best,
alex
10-15-2022, 09:28 AM
#2
Three Wheelin'
It’s from the SAC, new ones have a completely different fulcrum length and will require less pressure. It stays like that until near EOL.
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frybear (10-15-2022)
10-15-2022, 05:55 PM
#4
Hello all -
Car has 61k - just did my clutch at a super reputable shop since I had an RMS leak and the miles were up there. Old clutch still hd some life but why not - flywheel was fine.
One thing i wanted to ask was if anyone else who had a new clutch, or owned their car since new - if there is a little bit of a “break in” period before it feels a little bit tighter? Pedal feels significantly softer/less bite most notably when getting off from a start. maybe i was just used to a worn clutch..
Also for what it’s worth (i know someone’s keeping track) total cost was $5500 cash for RMS, Clutch and all the goodies sans flywheel along with install of the oil fed IMS Solution (again…while i was in there as the car previously has the LN retrofit).
Clutch and RMS and clutch without IMS would have been prob ~$3K. Shop located on Long Island.
Best,
alex
Car has 61k - just did my clutch at a super reputable shop since I had an RMS leak and the miles were up there. Old clutch still hd some life but why not - flywheel was fine.
One thing i wanted to ask was if anyone else who had a new clutch, or owned their car since new - if there is a little bit of a “break in” period before it feels a little bit tighter? Pedal feels significantly softer/less bite most notably when getting off from a start. maybe i was just used to a worn clutch..
Also for what it’s worth (i know someone’s keeping track) total cost was $5500 cash for RMS, Clutch and all the goodies sans flywheel along with install of the oil fed IMS Solution (again…while i was in there as the car previously has the LN retrofit).
Clutch and RMS and clutch without IMS would have been prob ~$3K. Shop located on Long Island.
Best,
alex
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groovzilla (10-16-2022)
10-15-2022, 06:04 PM
#5
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
10-15-2022, 06:05 PM
#6
Rennlist Member
He means Self Adjusting Clutch. I’ve driven a 997S with a new clutch put in and it feels super light weight, and you can’t really tell where the bite point is. Takes a while to get used to.
Self adjusting clutch for the S:
https://rennlist.com/forums/997-foru...ah-humbug.html
Self adjusting clutch for the S:
https://rennlist.com/forums/997-foru...ah-humbug.html
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CarreraAlex (10-15-2022),
Sporty (10-16-2022)
10-15-2022, 06:18 PM
#8
Rennlist Member
10-15-2022, 06:38 PM
#9
Rennlist Member
SAC means "self adjusting clutch" which people get confused about since all hydraulic actuated clutches are "self adjusting " in the sense that you do not have to crawl under the car and manually adjust the mechanical linkage from the pedal to the release arm/ throwout bearing to set the "1 inch free play of the pedal travel". Those were the good ole days.
However in the most modern world, the fact that the geometry of the release bearing to the pressure plate fingers and to the pivot point of the arm does still change as the clutch disk wears. A small amount indeed, but there is still a change in the geometry. The new fangled pressure plate has a ratcheting setup that adjusts the distance of the pressure plate surface to keep it constant as the clutch disk wears and gets thinner. The mechanism in the pressure plate looks frightening in complexity but in actual use has proven to be robust. This system was introduced on the 997.1 S cars and then adopted to all models on the 997.2 cars. (another big difference between .1 and .2).
Don't get robbed on a clutch job. The Sachs SAC kit (disk, pressure plate and throwout bearing ) is about $900. The labor is 4 hours. 2 hours to remove the trans and clutch assembly and inspect everything including the slave cylinder etc. 2 hours to install the new clutch kit, refit the trans and linkage and test drive. Total 4 hours. Labor costs range from $125 to $200 or maybe higher if you are crazy enough to go to a dealer. Do the math, look at your wallet. If the flywheel needs resurfacing or replacing, then add in the extra cost of that part. For those with .2 cars, there is no need to replace the slave cyclinder or the Rear Main Seal unless they are actually leaking. (They are not) For the .1 crowd then you have to also consider the RMS and IMS situation. My bill for replacing the clutch ( late 997.2) was $1400 at a high end race shop when I was 2000 miles from home. I had no choice but to have a shop do it.
One thing the 997 clutches are known for is having the pressure plate completely fail and instantly doing so ,regardless of milage. The failure is cracking and breaking of the flex finger ring. It is not related to the self adjusting mechanism.
A clutch job with real Sachs kit cannot cost more than $2,000. Be careful out there.
However in the most modern world, the fact that the geometry of the release bearing to the pressure plate fingers and to the pivot point of the arm does still change as the clutch disk wears. A small amount indeed, but there is still a change in the geometry. The new fangled pressure plate has a ratcheting setup that adjusts the distance of the pressure plate surface to keep it constant as the clutch disk wears and gets thinner. The mechanism in the pressure plate looks frightening in complexity but in actual use has proven to be robust. This system was introduced on the 997.1 S cars and then adopted to all models on the 997.2 cars. (another big difference between .1 and .2).
Don't get robbed on a clutch job. The Sachs SAC kit (disk, pressure plate and throwout bearing ) is about $900. The labor is 4 hours. 2 hours to remove the trans and clutch assembly and inspect everything including the slave cylinder etc. 2 hours to install the new clutch kit, refit the trans and linkage and test drive. Total 4 hours. Labor costs range from $125 to $200 or maybe higher if you are crazy enough to go to a dealer. Do the math, look at your wallet. If the flywheel needs resurfacing or replacing, then add in the extra cost of that part. For those with .2 cars, there is no need to replace the slave cyclinder or the Rear Main Seal unless they are actually leaking. (They are not) For the .1 crowd then you have to also consider the RMS and IMS situation. My bill for replacing the clutch ( late 997.2) was $1400 at a high end race shop when I was 2000 miles from home. I had no choice but to have a shop do it.
One thing the 997 clutches are known for is having the pressure plate completely fail and instantly doing so ,regardless of milage. The failure is cracking and breaking of the flex finger ring. It is not related to the self adjusting mechanism.
A clutch job with real Sachs kit cannot cost more than $2,000. Be careful out there.
10-15-2022, 06:47 PM
#10
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
appreciate the insight! thank you.
I don't know of any shops anywhere near NYC that would do the job i just had for less than around the price i got. I called just about everyone worth driving to. I was also limited to a shop vetted to install the IMS Solution. I think the prices were fair compared to other quote i was getting a-la mcasail above
per invoice: Sachs kit was 837, also replaced RMS, bolts, rbg, release arm spring, cam plug and oil pressure sender totaling about $250. ~$1600 for labor totaling about $2,700.
I don't know of any shops anywhere near NYC that would do the job i just had for less than around the price i got. I called just about everyone worth driving to. I was also limited to a shop vetted to install the IMS Solution. I think the prices were fair compared to other quote i was getting a-la mcasail above
per invoice: Sachs kit was 837, also replaced RMS, bolts, rbg, release arm spring, cam plug and oil pressure sender totaling about $250. ~$1600 for labor totaling about $2,700.
10-15-2022, 10:28 PM
#11
I hear ya, @Floyd540 ! I documented my recent pressure plate fail last weekend on another thread (thanks @Petza914 @groovzilla ). When they go, they go. I think I found a shop local here in Central Florida that will accept/order parts from Rennpart.com - Sachs Clutch kit $750, probs add RMS and IMS at this point (I have early 997.1) and be done with it.
10-16-2022, 07:46 AM
#12
Three Wheelin'
It’s actually very much like the newer 911s similar to the clutch action in the 991.2 I drove too…super light and easy to use. I kinda like it. Takes like no effort at all to push down. My 997S has 44K miles on it now and my original clutch is not so light anymore but still working fine so I have a ways to go before I get to have a super light clutch again.
10-16-2022, 08:08 AM
#13
Rennlist Member
10-16-2022, 08:13 AM
#14
Three Wheelin'
Heavy feel- the tip breaks off and it’s metal(rod) on metal (fork)- which has alot more resistance that the plastic greased tip.
it eventually wears a cup in the fork and and then that needs replaced too.
it eventually wears a cup in the fork and and then that needs replaced too.
10-16-2022, 08:31 AM
#15
Rennlist Member
Interesting, thanks. My Indy drove my car and said everything checks out so not sure if there’s a problem. Clutch is not super heavy but is not super light like a brand new clutch either. Will keep an eye on it. Thanks.
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rtl5009 (10-16-2022)