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Will 992 cause 997 and 996 pricing to drop?

Old 01-08-2019, 03:58 PM
  #16  
vern1
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Originally Posted by gasongasoff View Post
Haha my feelings exactly

The thinking that the 997 is more "taut", hard core, analogue, mechanical, raw, etc etc etc is the same tired argument each old generation has used against the next generation forever. The 991 is no bigger in size then the 997 (it is wider in some dimensions and smaller in others). But it is demonstrably faster and better handling. Everyone likes to think their model is the "last of the real Porsches" because the next generation is (fill in the blank) too big/soft/un-raw/non-analogue........

I also tend to follow along with Dennis that we are all guessing on values but they are all going to go down just as the 992 will when the next one comes out. And to the vast majority of buyers they will just get the newest one they can afford. The opinions here are vastly skewed to the 997 well because its a 997 board - surprise!!

Buy what you like, drive it well and damned what it does to the value!

Originally Posted by Dennis C View Post
I agree with this logic, although we are all just guessing. I think people shopping for their first 911 will likely be more attracted to a 991 as their prices drop a bit, which will impact 997 sale prices. Lots of people (especially on this board) love the 997 for various reasons, but to a new buyer it’s older, has less tech, and may be less appealing. I do tend to think that the 992 launch will impact 991 prices more than 997 prices. This is nothing new. It happens every time a new model is launched. Older models depreciate to a certain point, and then stabilize. Fewer and fewer low-mile examples can be found, and they begin to command a premium. Special models command an additional premium. It happened to the 996, it’s happening to the 997, and it will happen to the 991.
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Old 01-08-2019, 04:08 PM
  #17  
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Originally Posted by vern1 View Post
Haha my feelings exactly

The thinking that the 997 is more "taut", hard core, analogue, mechanical, raw, etc etc etc is the same tired argument each old generation has used against the next generation forever. The 991 is no bigger in size then the 997 (it is wider in some dimensions and smaller in others). But it is demonstrably faster and better handling. Everyone likes to think their model is the "last of the real Porsches" because the next generation is (fill in the blank) too big/soft/un-raw/non-analogue........

I also tend to follow along with Dennis that we are all guessing on values but they are all going to go down just as the 992 will when the next one comes out. And to the vast majority of buyers they will just get the newest one they can afford. The opinions here are vastly skewed to the 997 well because its a 997 board - surprise!!
You nailed it! Most of the people buying newer models have never driven older models and could care less about them. The people who want older models aren't getting any younger, so supply may exceed demand.
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Old 01-08-2019, 10:17 PM
  #18  
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Originally Posted by vern1 View Post
The 991 is no bigger in size then the 997 (it is wider in some dimensions and smaller in others). But it is demonstrably faster and better handling.
991 is definitely larger, especially when you consider volume and not just outer dimensions - meaning you could easily fit a 997 entirely inside of a 991 with room to spare.

We can all agree the 991 is a better performing car, but we'd also agree that max performance is not the most important factor to used 911 shoppers. Porsche does a great job of making each generation unique, so while newer is always faster, they don't render past generations obsolete like most other cars. They're pushing that "timeless" idea with the 911, I tend to agree.
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Old 01-08-2019, 11:26 PM
  #19  
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Originally Posted by Balr14
You nailed it! Most of the people buying newer models have never driven older models and could care less about them. The people who want older models aren't getting any younger, so supply may exceed demand.
Oh I sure hope so! Would love a 993 TT ???
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Old 01-09-2019, 12:04 AM
  #20  
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Originally Posted by cwheeler View Post
Oh I sure hope so! Would love a 993 TT ???
If you want a 993 TT you should probably buy it now.
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Old 01-09-2019, 12:32 AM
  #21  
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Originally Posted by otuA View Post
991 is definitely larger, especially when you consider volume and not just outer dimensions - meaning you could easily fit a 997 entirely inside of a 991 with room to spare.
.
No it isnt and no you can't
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Old 01-09-2019, 12:35 AM
  #22  
Dennis C
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Originally Posted by vern1 View Post
No it isnt and no you can't
Agreed. It appears bigger visually due to the longer wheelbase and the taller “waist line”, but the difference is negligible when you look at the data.
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Old 01-09-2019, 01:46 AM
  #23  
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I sure hope so! Having a whole lot of trouble finding a PDK 997 for my girlfriend. They are just out of reach. Wish she wanted a 987.2 S, would be so much easier. The thing is a 997.2 Base Cab would be fine, but there are even fewer of those!

No I don't think prices will drop any faster, if at all.
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Old 01-09-2019, 03:04 AM
  #24  
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Originally Posted by Dennis C View Post


Agreed. It appears bigger visually due to the longer wheelbase and the taller “waist line”, but the difference is negligible when you look at the data.
Can't remember the exact numbers and too lazy to look them up but as I recall it, the only dimensional difference between the 997 C2S and the 991 C2S is that that the 991 is about 2.5" longer. Width the same. But like you said, it does look like the difference in size is more than that.
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Old 01-09-2019, 03:10 AM
  #25  
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Originally Posted by WhipE350 View Post
I sure hope so! Having a whole lot of trouble finding a PDK 997 for my girlfriend. They are just out of reach. Wish she wanted a 987.2 S, would be so much easier. The thing is a 997.2 Base Cab would be fine, but there are even fewer of those!

No I don't think prices will drop any faster, if at all.
Are you only searching locally or nationwide? I've noticed a lot of people having trouble finding what they're looking for are only looking in their hometown or perhaps a couple of hours away.
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Old 01-09-2019, 03:13 AM
  #26  
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There aren't many clean 997's (especially .2s) on the market at any given time, and as prices are typically somewhere in the 40's to 60's, that won't change. Many people who own them aren't selling, as they are quite affordable to own. They aren't leased. A 997.1 may be hard to get a loan for, so these buyers are cash buyers and not likely to sell based on loan payment stress. The cars are just out of reach for lots of middle-income people (who may otherwise buy a high mile e46 M3) which also keeps turnover low. Plus, with some modern suspension upgrades, the 997 really comes alive.

In 992 world, 60k gets you the engine, wheels, and 2 seats.
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Old 01-09-2019, 03:45 AM
  #27  
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Originally Posted by raidersfan View Post
There aren't many clean 997's (especially .2s) on the market at any given time, and as prices are typically somewhere in the 40's to 60's, that won't change. Many people who own them aren't selling, as they are quite affordable to own. They aren't leased. A 997.1 may be hard to get a loan for, so these buyers are cash buyers and not likely to sell based on loan payment stress. The cars are just out of reach for lots of middle-income people (who may otherwise buy a high mile e46 M3) which also keeps turnover low. Plus, with some modern suspension upgrades, the 997 really comes alive.

In 992 world, 60k gets you the engine, wheels, and 2 seats.
So, "we" are all thinking that 992 customers are "net new" customers to Porsche? Do we really think that Porsche can sustain the line on just new customers? Don't they count on converting customers? Maybe some Cayenne or Panamera customers will want a new toy? I just see so many of the folks on here with 3 or 4 Porsche's.

But OK, I get it, I shouldn't try to over think where the market is going and just get the best I can afford and drive. Shut up and drive, right?

Last edited by gumanow; 01-09-2019 at 05:59 PM. Reason: grammar
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Old 01-09-2019, 04:02 AM
  #28  
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Originally Posted by raidersfan View Post
There aren't many clean 997's (especially .2s) on the market at any given time, and as prices are typically somewhere in the 40's to 60's, that won't change. Many people who own them aren't selling, as they are quite affordable to own. They aren't leased. A 997.1 may be hard to get a loan for, so these buyers are cash buyers and not likely to sell based on loan payment stress. The cars are just out of reach for lots of middle-income people (who may otherwise buy a high mile e46 M3) which also keeps turnover low. Plus, with some modern suspension upgrades, the 997 really comes alive.

In 992 world, 60k gets you the engine, wheels, and 2 seats.
Exactly, which is why I asked how wide of a net he was casting. Somebody living in say Cleveland OH, searching only that city or that city + a 200 mile radius is in for a long search imo. Lots of stories here of buyers complaining about how hard it is to find the right car and then it turns out the car has to be within a couple of hours drive away.....at most.
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Old 01-09-2019, 04:18 AM
  #29  
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Originally Posted by gumanow View Post
But OK, I get it, I shouldn't try to over think where the market is going and just got the best I can afford and drive. Shut up and drive, right?
Now you're on track.
None of the cars you're considering are investments.
If you drive it long enough, you'll be fine with any value change.
The fun miles are worth the cost!
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Old 01-09-2019, 07:41 AM
  #30  
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You will all have a go at me for what I'm about to write :-)

I think the 992 is an eyesore, at the best of times... The front is way too square around the front bumper area and the back of the car (which always have been the 911's strong point in my opinion) is horrible.
I cannot easily distinguish a 981/982 from a 992 when viewing from behind (don't take it too literally) because of the Porsche indent in the middle.

Designwise we're close to the 996 1st gen (even though the 996 C4S has one of the nicests backends ever coming out of Stuttgart).

The 992 (and to some point the 991) is a car for the masses (at a price) and does not have the original 997 feel and design.

From a business perspective, the 992 is the right move forward here and now but for "purists" that cannot get an air/oil cooled 911 or want a more up to date vehicle, the 997 (and even the 996 II) are the only choice out there so yes, prices will eventually go up.

This said, does it really matter? I bought a 997.2 C4S PDK because I loved the way it sounded, its handling and the "modern enough" comforts for me coming with the car. Future pricing could not be any further away when I test drove the car and signed the purchase papers so to me the car is priceless...
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