Gt3 master cylinder for 997.2s
01-24-2018, 10:10 PM
#3
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
Over cooked brakes at last hpde. Based on recommendations from the instructors. I’m running advanced group and brake pedal went soft at end of straight for the 1st time ever and I ran off track due to no brakes. Will be replacing rotors with sebro slotted and Pfc pads. Was on stock rotors and second event with Pagid rs29s. Could be that rotors are toast. Fluid was gs610 racing fluid.
01-24-2018, 10:41 PM
#4
Race Director
Gt3 master cylinder is 180 bucks at azautohaus under the trw brand.
Wont have any effect on you overcooking your brakes. only benefit will be a stiffer pedal
Wont have any effect on you overcooking your brakes. only benefit will be a stiffer pedal
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nwGTS (08-24-2022)
01-24-2018, 10:58 PM
#5
Rennlist Member
I would do the rotors and pads, then see what your thoughts are. Keep in mind that as you improve your driving you may find you become easier on the brakes.
01-24-2018, 11:00 PM
#6
Rennlist Member
Are you running R compound tires?
Impressed your hitting the limitations of the stock brake system. That's hard to do.
I think the gt3 cylinder has a bigger bore which helps with pedal feel and responsiveness but won't help with heat. You need better fluid, gt3/2/cup brake ducks, potentially different rotors and guessing more experience with different braking techniques such as trail and threshold braking.
Interested to hear more..
Impressed your hitting the limitations of the stock brake system. That's hard to do.
I think the gt3 cylinder has a bigger bore which helps with pedal feel and responsiveness but won't help with heat. You need better fluid, gt3/2/cup brake ducks, potentially different rotors and guessing more experience with different braking techniques such as trail and threshold braking.
Interested to hear more..
09-27-2018, 03:32 PM
#7
Considering changing the master cylinder of my 997.2 c2s with the gt3 one for better brake pedal feel
Is the part number for the GT3 master cylinder 997 355 910 30/31 anyone done this and noticed any significant changes?
Is the part number for the GT3 master cylinder 997 355 910 30/31 anyone done this and noticed any significant changes?
Last edited by Presto; 12-11-2018 at 01:34 PM.
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12-11-2018, 01:37 PM
#8
Anyone who did this upgrade want to chime in? Considering the trw gt3 master cylinder when they are back in stock for a reasonable price.
will it improve the pedal feel? I know it will not reduce braking distances. I plan to eventually do the 6 piston turbo front caliper and 350mm rotors all round.
Any downsides or error codes with the bigger MC pushing more fluid thru the abs pump on a 997.2 c2s? 996 owners have reported abs related error codes with this upgrade.
will it improve the pedal feel? I know it will not reduce braking distances. I plan to eventually do the 6 piston turbo front caliper and 350mm rotors all round.
Any downsides or error codes with the bigger MC pushing more fluid thru the abs pump on a 997.2 c2s? 996 owners have reported abs related error codes with this upgrade.
12-14-2018, 01:12 PM
#9
For anyone looking to do this upgrade, I did it in my 997.1 c2
It may have increased pedal stiffness, a little.
Per PET
997.1 C2 - 997.355.910.00
997.1 C2S - 997.355.910.10
997.1 C4 Targa - 997.355.10
997.1 C4 & C4S - 997.355.30
997.1 GT3 - 997.355.30
997.2 C2 - 997.355.910.10
997.2 C2S - 997.355.910.10
997.2 C4 Targa - 997.355.910.10
997.2 C4 & C4S & Targa C4S - 997.355.910.30
GT3 - 997.355.910.30
So you may as well call it a C4 m/c swap
It's a direct swap for 997.1 and 997.2 cars - if you've got a C4 or C4S cars you've already got the larger unit. Buy the TRW generic OEM part for $200 online.
If you DIY taking the old unit out requires an excess amount of force - it's unbelievable. Put towels down everywhere and wear eye protection because brake fluid will likely fling around.
Pre-fill (bench fill) the new unit before installing. My experience was that I still had air in my system and needed to burp the car a few times. I used generic Pentosin DOT 4 fluid ($20 for a couple of liters) from Autozone for the purge. Burped the corners a couple of times recycling the store bought fluid, drove the car a couple hundred miles, then swapped it out for the good stuff (Motul RBF600).
OP - if you're running advanced group you're obviously invested in this hobby, do it right and get some larger brakes. The master cylinder won't dissipate any more heat, it adjusts the pedal feel (and a little bit at that). Larger brake surface and better cooling are what ya need.
Some tracks simply lend themselves to cooking brakes easier than other tracks. Sometimes it's just a physics problem. After 10+ DE's I finally hit a bit of brake fade on stock rotors and pads at Laguna Seca a couple of months ago. It was in part a comfort thing; I was comfortable on that track to keep the speeds up. Other tracks like Streets of Willow or Buttonwillow or Chuckwalla - no issue whatsoever. Could be that I was leaving behind a lot of speed, too!
No plans for tracking in 2019, just autocross, so I'm saving my pennies because eventually I'll need to address the heat problem too.
It may have increased pedal stiffness, a little.
Per PET
997.1 C2 - 997.355.910.00
997.1 C2S - 997.355.910.10
997.1 C4 Targa - 997.355.10
997.1 C4 & C4S - 997.355.30
997.1 GT3 - 997.355.30
997.2 C2 - 997.355.910.10
997.2 C2S - 997.355.910.10
997.2 C4 Targa - 997.355.910.10
997.2 C4 & C4S & Targa C4S - 997.355.910.30
GT3 - 997.355.910.30
So you may as well call it a C4 m/c swap
It's a direct swap for 997.1 and 997.2 cars - if you've got a C4 or C4S cars you've already got the larger unit. Buy the TRW generic OEM part for $200 online.If you DIY taking the old unit out requires an excess amount of force - it's unbelievable. Put towels down everywhere and wear eye protection because brake fluid will likely fling around.
Pre-fill (bench fill) the new unit before installing. My experience was that I still had air in my system and needed to burp the car a few times. I used generic Pentosin DOT 4 fluid ($20 for a couple of liters) from Autozone for the purge. Burped the corners a couple of times recycling the store bought fluid, drove the car a couple hundred miles, then swapped it out for the good stuff (Motul RBF600).
OP - if you're running advanced group you're obviously invested in this hobby, do it right and get some larger brakes. The master cylinder won't dissipate any more heat, it adjusts the pedal feel (and a little bit at that). Larger brake surface and better cooling are what ya need.
Some tracks simply lend themselves to cooking brakes easier than other tracks. Sometimes it's just a physics problem. After 10+ DE's I finally hit a bit of brake fade on stock rotors and pads at Laguna Seca a couple of months ago. It was in part a comfort thing; I was comfortable on that track to keep the speeds up. Other tracks like Streets of Willow or Buttonwillow or Chuckwalla - no issue whatsoever. Could be that I was leaving behind a lot of speed, too!
No plans for tracking in 2019, just autocross, so I'm saving my pennies because eventually I'll need to address the heat problem too.
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ATX_Native (08-23-2022)
12-25-2018, 07:34 AM
#10
Very useful info Appraiser. Thank you for the feedback.
09-02-2023, 11:21 AM
#13
For anyone looking to do this upgrade, I did it in my 997.1 c2
It may have increased pedal stiffness, a little.
Per PET
997.1 C2 - 997.355.910.00
997.1 C2S - 997.355.910.10
997.1 C4 Targa - 997.355.10
997.1 C4 & C4S - 997.355.30
997.1 GT3 - 997.355.30
997.2 C2 - 997.355.910.10
997.2 C2S - 997.355.910.10
997.2 C4 Targa - 997.355.910.10
997.2 C4 & C4S & Targa C4S - 997.355.910.30
GT3 - 997.355.910.30
So you may as well call it a C4 m/c swap It's a direct swap for 997.1 and 997.2 cars - if you've got a C4 or C4S cars you've already got the larger unit. Buy the TRW generic OEM part for $200 online.
If you DIY taking the old unit out requires an excess amount of force - it's unbelievable. Put towels down everywhere and wear eye protection because brake fluid will likely fling around.
Pre-fill (bench fill) the new unit before installing. My experience was that I still had air in my system and needed to burp the car a few times. I used generic Pentosin DOT 4 fluid ($20 for a couple of liters) from Autozone for the purge. Burped the corners a couple of times recycling the store bought fluid, drove the car a couple hundred miles, then swapped it out for the good stuff (Motul RBF600).
OP - if you're running advanced group you're obviously invested in this hobby, do it right and get some larger brakes. The master cylinder won't dissipate any more heat, it adjusts the pedal feel (and a little bit at that). Larger brake surface and better cooling are what ya need.
Some tracks simply lend themselves to cooking brakes easier than other tracks. Sometimes it's just a physics problem. After 10+ DE's I finally hit a bit of brake fade on stock rotors and pads at Laguna Seca a couple of months ago. It was in part a comfort thing; I was comfortable on that track to keep the speeds up. Other tracks like Streets of Willow or Buttonwillow or Chuckwalla - no issue whatsoever. Could be that I was leaving behind a lot of speed, too! No plans for tracking in 2019, just autocross, so I'm saving my pennies because eventually I'll need to address the heat problem too.
It may have increased pedal stiffness, a little.
Per PET
997.1 C2 - 997.355.910.00
997.1 C2S - 997.355.910.10
997.1 C4 Targa - 997.355.10
997.1 C4 & C4S - 997.355.30
997.1 GT3 - 997.355.30
997.2 C2 - 997.355.910.10
997.2 C2S - 997.355.910.10
997.2 C4 Targa - 997.355.910.10
997.2 C4 & C4S & Targa C4S - 997.355.910.30
GT3 - 997.355.910.30
So you may as well call it a C4 m/c swap
It's a direct swap for 997.1 and 997.2 cars - if you've got a C4 or C4S cars you've already got the larger unit. Buy the TRW generic OEM part for $200 online.If you DIY taking the old unit out requires an excess amount of force - it's unbelievable. Put towels down everywhere and wear eye protection because brake fluid will likely fling around.
Pre-fill (bench fill) the new unit before installing. My experience was that I still had air in my system and needed to burp the car a few times. I used generic Pentosin DOT 4 fluid ($20 for a couple of liters) from Autozone for the purge. Burped the corners a couple of times recycling the store bought fluid, drove the car a couple hundred miles, then swapped it out for the good stuff (Motul RBF600).
OP - if you're running advanced group you're obviously invested in this hobby, do it right and get some larger brakes. The master cylinder won't dissipate any more heat, it adjusts the pedal feel (and a little bit at that). Larger brake surface and better cooling are what ya need.
Some tracks simply lend themselves to cooking brakes easier than other tracks. Sometimes it's just a physics problem. After 10+ DE's I finally hit a bit of brake fade on stock rotors and pads at Laguna Seca a couple of months ago. It was in part a comfort thing; I was comfortable on that track to keep the speeds up. Other tracks like Streets of Willow or Buttonwillow or Chuckwalla - no issue whatsoever. Could be that I was leaving behind a lot of speed, too!
No plans for tracking in 2019, just autocross, so I'm saving my pennies because eventually I'll need to address the heat problem too.I read in the quoted message above that the GT3 master cylinder (TRW aftermarket part PMN166) is a direct swap in a 997.2 Carrera S without any error codes affecting PSM or ABS. Is it so for sure?
What about adding also the GT3 brake booster? Is it convenient / worthwhile?
Thanks in advance for your comments to help me decide.
Regards from Spain
Andrés